Vince Young

This conversation shouldn't happen until he wins a HT and a NC. ~ both are real possibilities this season.

 

The NFL is where the "best of the best" play. The great players in the NFL are the players that are truly great (generally speaking). There are no East Padooka State's on the lineup in the NFL (well, ok, there are the Texans, but...)

 

Now Reggie might have been the greatest HS player. Too bad my Aggies and that damn spread option have turned him into a dissappointment.
As for VY, he is great yes, but the greatest, not yet. Right now there are a couple better over in SoCal. Maybe in two years, I'll have a different opinion.
I wouldn't call Vick the greatest either and I put Young right next to him.

 

Even though Steve McNair played in the SWAC at Alcorn, he put up freakish numbers every game in college.

 

Sheesh. Too predictable.

I view UT threads to see texxx's 'complex' in action.

 

But the skill set, especially at the QB level, is completely different in the NFL from the college levels. That's why the top NFL QB's were not consistently top college QB's and vice-versa. There's much more room for unorthodox play in college than the NFL.

 

Sorry, that honor goes to Ced Benson of Midland Lee. The Horns have you there too.

 

Ya know.

I realize that the Texans need a new line, but I really wished that we drafted him.

That dude is a winner.

 

What about my post do you disagree with? Let's focus on the content instead of personal attacks, Cohen.

 

totally different game. particularly for QB's. no one would make a case that Joe Montana was the greatest college QB ever. you couldn't.

in the alternative...no one would argue that Charlie Ward wasn't anything short of spectacular at the college level. or Tony Rice...or Major Harris...or Darian Hagan.

I will tell you straight up that Mike Vick is the most overrated played in the NFL . I'll also tell you he was perhaps the very best COLLEGE football player i've ever seen.

 

that 80 yard touchdown run against OSU took vince 36 steps. yes. 36 strides. that's 6.67 feet per stride.

 

if stats are your bag (posted by CarKev14 on hornfans):

Career:

6: Vince has six of the top eight longest runs by a QB in UT history. No other UT QB had more than one run for over 53 yards in his career—Vince has six so far.

8: Vince is 8-1 when tied or trailing at halftime (losing only to OU in 2004), and 3-2 when tied or trailing after three quarters (OU 2004 plus WSU 2003—big *** for WSU, as Vince didn’t play in final 22+ minutes, including the entire 4th quarter). Nice numbers. Nicer still when you note that Mack-coached UT teams were 5-11 pre-Vince when tied or trailing at half-time, and 4-13 when tied or trailing after three quarters.

9: Vince is tied for 10th in 100-yard rushing games at Texas, with nine. One more puts him in a tie with Eric Metcalf and SteveWorster for 8th; and two more ties him with Hodges Mitchell for 7th.

25: Vince is 4th in victories at Texas, tied with James Brown and Peter Gardere, with 25 wins. He’s one win behind Chris Simms and Marty Akins for 2nd; and three wins behind Bobby Layne for 1st.

33: Vince is 1st among Quarterbacks in rushing touchdowns at Texas, with 33. Marty Akins is 2nd, at 26.

33: Vince is 5th among all positions in rushing touchdowns at Texas, with 33. He’s three behind Steve Worster for 4th; seven behind Earl Campbell for 3rd.

34: Vince is 5th in touchdown passes at Texas, with 34. He’s three from a tie with Peter Gardere for 4th.

43: Going into Oklahoma State, on 300 career drives, Vince had led UT to 129 touchdowns and 24 field goals. We’ve scored a TD on 43% of his drives and averaged 3.3 points per drive. By comparison, Chris Simms’ best season was 33.6% TD’s and 2.7 ppd in 2001; and Major’s best was 32% in 2001 and 2.5 ppd in 1998.

60.4: Vince’s career passing completion percentage is the best in UT history, 60.4%. Chris Simms is 2nd, at 58.7%.

67: Vince has been responsible for 67 TD’s (34 throwing, 33 rushing). That puts him in a tie with Cedric Benson for third in UT history, behind only Chris Simms (68) and Ricky Williams (76).

92.6: Vince is 2nd in winning percentage at Texas (25-2, 92.6%), behind only James Street (20-0, 100%). Chris Simms (26-6, 81.3%) is third.

92.6: Vince is 9th in winning percentage in NCAA history (25-2, 92.6%). He’s one win from Gino Toretta for 8th; three wins from Turner Gill for 7th; four wins from Jay Barker for 6th. To get any higher he’d have to come back for a senior year, in which case he could get up to 2nd or 3rd depending on whether Leinart loses this year. Hmmm.

140.4: Vince’s career Passing Efficiency Rating is the best in UT history, 140.4. Chance Mock is 2nd, at 138.9. Among QB’s with 250+ passing attempts, Chris Simms is 2nd, at 138.4.

2,802: Vince is 1st among Quarterbacks in rushing yards at Texas, with 2,802. Marty Akins is 2nd, at 1,963.

2,802: Vince is the 7th-leading rusher among all positions in UT history, with 2,802 yards. He’s 72 yards away from A.J. “Jam” Jones for 6th. Top five (Roosevelt Leaks) is 121 yards away.

2,802: Vince is 12th all-time among D-1A quarterbacks in rushing yards, with 2,802. He’s 16 yards from #11 El Roberson of Kansas State; 497 yards from entering the top 10 (Fred Solomon of Tampa); 632 from entering the top 6 (Eric Crouch of Nebraska); and 1,093 from #1 (Antwaan Randle El, Indiana). Brad Smith (3,891) is the only active QB ahead of Vince (Brad’s now 2nd), and Brad’s got another year under his belt.

4,839: Vince is 5th on the career passing yardage chart at Texas, with 4,839 yards. He’s 2,258 away from Chris Simms, for 4th; 3,514 from Major Applewhite for 1st.

7,641: Vince is 3rd in total offense at Texas, with 7,641 yards. He’s 408 from James Brown for 2nd; and 418 from Major Applewhite for 1st. Vince is 798 yards away from being ranked in the NCAA top 84 list for career total offense.

Season:

2: Vince has had two 100-yard rushing games so far in 2005.

3: Vince had three 100-yard rushing games in 2003, which ties him for 33rd in a UT season.

4: Vince had four 100-yard rushing games in 2004, which tied for 17th in 100-yard rushing games in one season.

5: Vince led the team to five games with 500+ yards of total offense in 2004, including two games with over 600 yards. UT has only gone 500+ five times in a season once before, in 1996. Matter of fact, we’d only gone over 500 yards 10 times before 1992. The team went over 500 three times so far in 2005, against U-LA-LA, Missouri, and Oklahoma State.

6.46: In 2004, Vince averaged 89.92 rushing yards per game and 6.46 per carry. Only four D-1A players--Wendell Mathis of Fresno State, Andre Hall of South Florida, Garrett Wolfe of Northern Illinois, and JJ Arrington of Cal finished higher in both. Note that only JJ plays in a BCS conference—and I’m not sure that the Pac-10 believes rushing defense is legal. Two more yards and Vince would have passed Hall and Wolfe on yards per carry.

7.4: Vince led the nation in yards per carry in 2003, with 7.4.

12: Vince was the Big 12 Freshman of the Year in 2003.

14: Vince owns the UT record for consecutive completions with 14 set between the Oklahoma State and Kansas games in 2004. Chris Simms set the previous record, 11, in 2001. Vince now owns the third-best mark as well, with 10 in a row in the ULALA game in 2005.

14: Vince’s 14 rushing TD’s in 2004 ranks 7th on UT’s single-season list, and ties him with Donnie Wigginton for 1st among QB’s.

16: Vince’s 16 passing TD’s in 2005 ranks 8th on UT’s single-season passing TD’s list. He’s one TD from 7th(JB); two from 6th (Major in 1998 and 2000); three from 4th (JB); five from 3rd (Major); six from 2nd (Chris); 10 from 1st (Chris).

48.2: Going into the Oklahoma State game: on 81 drives in 2005, Vince had led UT to 39 touchdowns and 7 field goals. We’ve scored a TD on 48.2% of his drives and averaged 3.6 points per drive. By comparison, Chris Simms’ best season was 33.6% TD’s and 2.7 ppd in 2001; and Major’s best was 32% in 2001 and 2.5 ppd in 1998.

58.7: Vince’s completion percentage as a freshman (58.7%) was second only to James Brown’s mark of 69.6% among UT freshmen QB’s with at least 10 passing attempts.

59.0: Vince’s completion % over his first two years (59.0%) is 2.2% higher than the next-closest UT QB.

63.2: Vince's completion % in 2005 is the 2nd-best in UT history, behind only James Brown's 69.6% in 1994 (of QB's with 75+ passing attempts in a season).

89.92: In 2004, Vince finished 1st of D-1A Quarterbacks in rushing yards per game (89.92).

163.65: In 2005, Vince has a 163.65 Passing Effiency Rating, 7th-best in the country and the best by any UT QB since James Brown finished with a 177.0 rating in 1994, setting the UT record for QB's with 50+ passes in a season.

700: Vince is the only player in UT history to rush for at least 700 and pass for at least 700 yards in the same season. He was two rushing yards away from rushing for 1000 and passing for 1000 in 2003. SARCASM ALERT: Good thing he didn’t play for the final 20 minutes of the Washington State game last year, or he’d have been only the third freshman in D-1 football history to hit that mark. In 2004 he finished at 1,079 rushing and 1,849 passing. So far in 2005 he’s at 725 rushing; 1,835 passing.

998: Vince’s 998 rushing yards as a freshman was second only to Cedric Benson’s 1,053 yards as a freshman.

1,079: In 2004, Vince rushed for 1,079 yards—which ranks 23rd all-time for a NCAA D-1A QB for a season.


2,560: In 2005, Vince has 2,560 yards in total offense, which ranks 7th on UT’s all-time single-season chart. He’s 34 yards from 4th place (passing JB 1995, JB 1996, and Chris 2001); 368 yards from 3rd (passing himself from 2004); 523 yards from 2nd (passing Chris 2002); and 651 yards from 1st (passing Major 1999).

Game:

4: Vince is the only UT QB to rush for four TD’s in one game (Tech, 2004; and Michigan, 2004). Only RB’s Cedric Benson and Ricky Williams have rushed for five or more in a game. The 24 points each game ranks 7th in UT history.

4: Vince has four of the top six rushing games by a UT quarterback, including the top two.

5: Vince’s 5 TD’s in the 2005 Rose Bowl (4 rushing, 1 passing) are the most ever accounted for by a single player in Rose Bowl history. They also put him in a tie for 3rd-most by any player in any bowl game. Vince is pictured on page 315 of the NCAA 2005 Football records book.

7: Vince has rushed and passed for 100+ yards in the same game seven times. He did it against OU in 2003 (127 rush/135 pass); Tech (158 rush/142 pass), OK State (123 rush/278 pass), Kansas (114 rush/289 pass), and Michigan (192 rush/180 pass) in 2004; he did it against Missouri (108 rush/236 pass) and Oklahoma State (267 rush/239 pass) in 2005. No other UT player had ever gone for 100+ in both categories in more than one game, and no other UT player has passed for more than 216 while rushing for 100+.

28: Vince led the team to the greatest comeback in UT history—down 28 against Oklahoma State (35-7), we scored 49 straight points to win the game. He also led us back from 10-point 4th-quarter deficits twice in the final three games of 2004 (Kansas and Michigan). This year he led Texas back from a six-point 4th-quarter deficit against 4th-ranked Ohio State in Columbus, and a 19-point 2nd-quarter deficit against Oklahoma State in Stillwater.

86.2: Vince hit 25 of 29 (86.2%) of his passes in the Colorado 2005 game, setting a new completion % mark for a single game. Vince set the old mark when he hit 18 of 21 (85.7%) of his passes in the Oklahoma State 2004 game (previous record was James Brown’s 81.5% against UH in 1994).

192: Vince’s 192 rushing yards against Michigan in the 2004 Rose Bowl was the highest rushing total by a UT QB in a game; the 2nd-best rushing yardage total by any UT player in a bowl game (11 yards behind Ricky’s 203 vs MS State in 1999); and the 35th-best rushing-yardage total by any UT player in any game. They were also the 2nd-best total by any QB in a bowl game, behind only Tommie Frazier’s 199 in the 1996 Fiesta Bowl.

267: Vince’s 267 rushing yards against Oklahoma State was the best-rushing yardage single-game total by any UT QB; and it was the 5th-best rushing yardage total by any UT player in any game. Only Cedric, Ricky, and Roosevelt ever rushed for more.

336: Vince broke his game-high in passing yards two games in a row. Going into the Oklahoma State game, his best yardage total was 215 (against Tech in 2003). He threw for 278 against OK St in 2004, and then broke that by throwing for 289 against Kansas. In 2005, he broke that again when he went for 336 against Colorado.

506: Vince has three of the top five, and five of the top 10, total offense yardage games in UT history. His 401 (123 rushing, 278 passing) against Oklahoma State was the third-highest at the time (behind Major’s 476 in the 2001 Holiday Bowl and Chris’s 411 at Nebraska in 2002). Then Vince hit for 403 (114 rushing, 289 passing) against Kansas. His 394 yards against Colorado in 2005 ranked 6th on the all-time list. His 372 in the Rose Bowl ranked 9th.all-time. His 346 yards against Ohio State in 2005 ranked 20th, his 344 yards against Missouri ranked 22nd, and his 300 yards against Tech in 2004 ranked 37th. His best game yet was against Oklahoma State in 2005, when he rushed for 267 yards and passed for 239, giving him the best single-game total in UT history (506).

 

you cant even begin to talk about him being the best ever until he's won the heisman.......If he doesnt win a national championship, that would suck, but i dont think it would reflect on his skills as a player. sometimes there are just better teams out there. as far as the NFL goes, i dont think hes any better than michael vick. vick is fun to watch but his career is gonna get cut short if he keeps doing crazy runs. you can get away with that stuff in college but as we've seen, every year vick gets banged up running all over the place and it will just slowly degrade his speed and legs.

 

Um...Bo Jackson
Tony Dorsett
Herschel Walker
Earl Cambell
Archie Griffen

Just to name a few.

 

Yeah, that was just sick. You could see defenders underestimating how fast he was running because they were taking bad angles towards him running down the sideline.

 

Best College player of all time? Can't say I agree, and this is coming from a HUGE UT fan and HUGE VY fan. There have been so many great players throughout history, is Vince one of them, absolutely, but not right now.

I can't believe I'm actually gonna agree with bigtexx, but we need a National Championship and Heisman winner to put him up there.

 

Certainly exciting to watch, but not the best all time. After he wins the Rose bowl, then he might be considered in the elite company of Weinke, Torretta, and Wuerffel.

 

Ya, don't forget they also had their last line of defense (a corner who was is a converted QB) jump at a nasty pump fake. That was one of the most unbelievable runs I had ever seen.

 

Thank you. I couldnt agree more. Its nice to see someone share the same opinion.

Heck, as atrocious as the year has been, David Carr still has a better completion percentage (58.6 to 52.4), higher QB rating (71.2 to 63.0), and isnt that far behind in rushing yards per attempt (5.6 to 6.2). Yet, Michael Vick is an ungodly player