U.S. ambassador, 3 American diplomats killed by protesters in Libya

I am curious to know what the anti-muslim coalition here would like to be seen done to end the "Islam threat".

 

Would rather take that chance than give it to people with no foundation or framework for making the right decisions. The worst effect of this is the ambiguity of trying to move forward and the legislative procedures that stall speed and efficiency. There needs to be a concrete plan that is implemented at all costs.

We'll see who they run around Allahu Akbaring when the scapegoats are gone.

 

I agree with that. I remember posting a little while back about the Arab Spring and how it was going to get ugly and comparing it to other countries that literally struggled for 100 years from their first democratic revolution to something we'd recognize as a modern, just society. I expect these attempts at democracy are going to get bogged down for awhile in Islamization, instability, probably relapses into authoritarianism, and so on. But, it's probably still worth it; hopefully it doesn't still take 100 years to do.

I have 2 thoughts on this:

1. I think it's quite dangerous to characterize and dismiss these people as barbarians or savages. It's a psychological dehumanization that people do to rationalize acts of war. The truth is the people in the mobs are real people, and even when we disagree or they're idiots, we need to understand what makes them tick. It's not good for your soul to put other people in a subhuman category, even rhetorically, because it increases enmity, callousness and all kinds of evil. I take pity on the mob, not because I don't think they did anything wrong, but because I think it's a tragedy they got themselves to a place where they did something so evil. (Corrollary: I think there is an equal danger for people occupying a different position in the dialogue to dismiss the filmmaker in the same way. He strikes me as just as much a savage as this angry mob. He's still an idiot, but he's reacting to something just like this mob did. I pity him too.)

2. I don't think we should censor speech because we're afraid Muslims might kill us for saying the wrong thing. But, this guy's idea to make a movie expressly to insult the Prophet and to poke Muslims in the eye was not exactly one born out of love. This guy is trying to incite anger among Muslims and hatred of Muslims among Westerners. He's doing his part to foment war between 2 civilizations. Even if everything he said about the Prophet was true and even if people are wrong to react the way they do to his movie, what he's intending and doing in making this movie is evil. I don't think I'd assign him particular guilt in the death of the ambassador, but I do think he's a small contributing member to the broader tragedy of the discord between the West and Islam, which is probably much worse. I wouldn't put him in prison for it, but I think that's worthy of some reproach.

 

I agree this isn't about offensive videos - as stupid it is to make a video just to offend people, it's not going to stop.

The question is how we deal with the results of it. Is there any solution?

 

Weak attempt to backtrack from an obviously stupid post.

"Yeah, I posted something idiotic in a futile attempt to grandstand and talk to adults, but let me try and twist reality so that I look less stupid" - FAIL

Go get some coffee for the grown-ups.

 

Having just read up on what happened, as a Muslim this act makes me very disappointed and outraged at these ignorant protesters. I know the past few pages, as always when it comes to a topic on the D&D involving Arab/Muslim people and the religion, it becomes a ideology bashathon.

As a Muslim myself, this act is totally unacceptable, totally unjustified and totally against Islamic principles and teachings and those that participated should not even call themselves Muslim. It's not justifiable in any way. I had not even heard of this movie and even then, with this film and any other form of media with a negative Islam-bash theme, I don't watch it. I don't bother with it. And why these pathetic excuse for Muslims always get bent out of shape when the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) is bashed and go on an emotionally-driven tirade.

Why get mad over it? It's no surprise there are people out there that hate Islam and all it represents, a lot of times without fully knowing its principles and teachings. I could just type "Islam" or "Muslim" in Google or on Youtube and I'll find tons of websites, videos anti-Islam propaganda etc with no other agenda than to demonize Islam and make it look bad. Am I gonna turn into Mr. Hyde? I know its out there, I disagree with it but I'm not going to go on a killing spree because reacting in that way is essentially UnIslamic and even contradictory to Prophet Muhammad's own conduct, teachings and practices.

People slandered him, talked trash about him and his family, abused him, physically assaulted him, tried to poison him and all sorts of other things and he always reacted in a merciful, peaceful, forgiving and just way. And these idiotic, uneducated Muslims just go off of emotion and not common sense. Muhammad didn't go on a tirade when he was bashed so they have no right to do the same. It happens so often that it's sickening.

It's like what one poster said early on in this thread:

Islam, if unbiasedly studied and preconceived notions cast aside, is a beautiful religion rooted in treating people with respect and dignity, not letting your emotions and desires cloud your judgment, being soft-hearted and many other virtuous qualities that religions like Judaism/Christianity/Buddhism etc. can identify with and agree with.

But put it in the hands of a intellectual r****d, and you get stuff like "Muslims" going nuts over a cartoon and outraged over every negative thing out there. I feel many of these Muslims don't know the tenets of their faith. They probably think Islam is just a set of basic rituals and nothing more when in fact it's the way you conduct yourself with people. It's a state of mind. It's the way you walk and talk, the way you treat your parents and neighbors and friends and people of different religions and nationalities. All with respect and civil rights. It's the way you react. It's about controlling your emotions like anger, lust etc. When this type of knowledge that comes from Islam is ignored or not emphasized in those countries than you get r****ds that going on a rampage at the drop of a hat without really knowing and understanding why they are doing it.

 

There is no anti-Muslim coalition.

 

People should feel free to express ideas in a free, democratic society without someone trying to kill people for it.

If people can't stand for that point, then there is nothing left to stand for.

 

LOL, nice try. Spend some time in the Balkans and they will spit it at you for trying to make the correlation between new age Serbia and gangster ridden Yugoslavia. But I understand your error... it's hard to know these things from wikipedia.

 

I'll take that as, "we don't have a clue as what to do, we just want to vilify as much as possible"

 

I pity you for saying something so insanely stupid.

There is a huge difference between murdering people as part of an angry mob and criticizing an ideology with a badly made film. This difference is also reflected in civilized countries' criminal law systems: murder is obviously sanctioned whereas free speech is...free.

How generous of you.

 

Heh, ATW.

It's historical fact that the state of Serbia implemented multi-party democracy in 1990, coinciding with the rise of Milosevic.

Oh well. Another personal attack for the record.

Hey, how are you doing, buddy? I don't feel the old venom. Congrats on your new, uplifted mood!

 

Actually a good post.

I don't know what you are talking about (the funny thing is, neither do you). There is no "anti-Muslim coalition".

 

Mmm.

Do they also spit on people for saying the implementation of democracy led to great things for Yugoslavia/Serbia/whatever the f**k initially? Or do they talk in semantics when backed in a corner?

Use your Balkan experience and tell me how the Serbian people of 2006 were beautiful and ready for democracy---in contrast with these "walk on water" fools in the Middle East.

 

On 9/11 as we remember our fallen heroes, as Islamists are attacking our embassies in Libya and Egypt, and Netanyahu is trying to get a meeting with the president (snubbed of course)....

...Obama is airing an interview with "THE PIMP WITH THE LIMP" in Miami



we truly have a clown leading our country.

http://miamiherald.typepad.com/nake...dicare-on-911-with-pimp-with-the-limp-dj.html

 

I don't know that I buy this, but there's a theory out there that this was actually an Al Queda attack, revenge for the assassination of one of their seemingly endless 2nd in commands.

 

Huh.

Any comment on Romney's pledge not to get political on 9/11, incidentally? That worked.

 

Obama aired it on 9/11

 

And Romney falsely attacked the President on 911 (which is getting savaged even by the right)

What’s yer point?

 

Obama is the program director at 106.7 FM in Miami?