they want the good ole days back when they could discriminate and not have to even justify it or just do so vaguely . . . anything that takes HUMAN judgement out of the equation IMO is better than the . . well he had a better essay . . in my opinion or his school was better . . IN MY OPINION or his 1450 on the SAT is not as good has his 1440 and being from a 'GOOD' school Rocket River
Most kids I know, around 80%, didn't bother studying for the SAT in any serious capacity. (didn't buy any books, or take any prep classes) This includes both top ten kids and non-top-ten kids.. the majority of kids don't study for that test because they know it is a comprehensive test of the knowledge you've gained over your time at high school, and one book or week of cramming can't prepare you for that. And as for your second comment, I've already discussed that, but I guess you missed what I said. Who says "most" high schools are above 4.0 averages? Where is your source for that? I'm genuinely curious. I went to a mediocre east Texas school, and our 10% threshold was around 3.5. And YES, kids DO stay away from AP classes because often times it is easier to take the gauranteed 4.0 in a regular class than it is to risk getting less than a 4.0 (which can happen easily in a subject you're not the best at) in an advanced course. Like I said before, at schools like Westlake where the 10% threshold is above a 4.0 this is NOT a problem, because in order to compete you HAVE to take advanced courses.. there is no ducking it.. but at regular schools this scale does not solve the problem.
All public schools. UT is being affected right now, soon A&M will be swallowed up by the rule as Texas' population continues to explode. The argument of "well, there are other good universities to go to" doesn't hold water when you're talking to a family with a "tradition" of UT grads. Not only that, someone who could get into UT might not be able to get into Rice/Tulane.. or maybe couldn't even afford it, I know I sure couldn't have coming out of high school. And in my personal experience, nearly every family I've met of money wants their kid to go to UT/A&M.
I love this talk about grade inflation at UT. Isn't the average graduating GPA at UT a 2.8? Grade inflation my butt. UT lets them all in, and then fails them all out. Nobody is just handing out diplomas at UT.
Grade inflation is a nationwide thing. Universities and high schools average GPAs go up year to year over time. Interesting data here.. http://gradeinflation.com/
I was only countering the opinion that well off people tend to get better grades. The well off people I know aren't trying to get their kids into UT. UT is a 2nd or 3rd choice if their 1st options don't pan out. I'm only offering my experience...I'm not suggesting a nationwide rule. If you graduated in the top 11% of your school and have a high SAT score, schools like Rice will definately consider you a top candidate. Something like 75% of the students at Rice are on some form of financial aid. We clearly travel in different circles. Anyway, just fix the system...don't throw it out. It is a simple idea with good intentions. Just tweak it to include SAT scores in calculating the 10% thing and be done with it. Everybody is just b****ing about the problem but nobody here is offering a solution...except maybe to just dump the whole plan.
If you are top 10% of your highschool then you deserve to get in. Kids shouldn't get punished for going to a rural school that can't afford to attract top teaching talent or doesn't teach to do well on useless tests like the SAT. The only thing this hurts is magnet schools because only 10 percent of them are guaranteed so kids and parents have to weigh the benefits of going to a tougher, more challenging, more competitive school to the benefit of automatic admission by going to the normal school.
I'm not informed on this topic AT ALL...But...seems like a great program to me. As long as the top ten kids are succeeding at UT, this seems like a much much less subjective way to offer a form of affirmative action. The top-ten kids, are, afterall, besting their peers. They are excelling in the situation they are placed (their individual schools) and should have a decent chance at success when given the greater challenge of UT. Perhaps incorporating SAT scores would be an improvement...but overall, the system seems to make a lot of sense.
I very poor policy. I saw the same piece several months ago. There have to be better ways to promote "diversity". 10 percent is way too high and you have to factor in SAT scores on some level. I'm all for non-race-based affirmative action (which this essentially is), but this policy just wasn't thought out too well.
Meanwhile I just heard that UH is raising its admission criteria to those comparable to UT and A&M. No offense to the Coogs out there but if I am a High School student in Houston (or their parents) and I have a choice between UH, A&M, and UT, UH is running 3rd...
This was another part of the piece that I found interesting because the girl who didn't get in was in the top 12% of her school but still had much better grades and SAT school than the girl from the poor hispanic school who did finish in the top 10% of her school. It seemed to me like the girl with the good grades still could've gone to another college besides UT yet was determined to get into UT out of both family and quality obligation. I believe UT is a very good university but is it worth doing two years JC when she could probably go to another university including another state or private school comparable to UT? I went to college in the late 80's so its possible that things have changed but for me and most of my friends it was a given that we could get into UT. I was automatically accepted into UT but chose to go out of state to what I and my family considered a better college rather than remain close to home in Texas.
The problem with the top-10% rule is that it is swallowing up admissions at UT (and I believe A&M). It restricts those schools from having much choice at all in their admissions process, which restricts the ability to acquire other types of diversity. The simple solution to this is to change the top 10% rule to guarantee admission into a Texas public university, but not necessarily one of your choice. That is, each school would be able to set a cap (say 50% of entrants - I think UT is getting up to 70% now?) that are admitted through the Top 10% rule. That leaves the school some options to select their students, while also guaranteeing a decent college education to any top-10%er.
Sishir Chang, yes I agree. We don't always get what we want in life. Consider it the first lesson of being an adult. You don't always get what you want. Life is about compromises. Your married life, living with children, getting a job, having friends, politics is all about compromises. Hell, chosing the Rockets next power forward will be a compromise. As long as people have an honest and even playing field, you may not always get to chose UT. UT isn't an entitlement. If you are top 12% with good SAT scores, many schools in this country WILL take you. Not attending UT doesn't put an American at a disadvantage. You don't get in...get over it.
UT was also a given when I graduated high school and for many of my classmates it was a last resort if they didn't get in anywhere else. I think everything changed recently with the advent of the top 10% rule. The sheer number of students wanting to go there has allowed them to become selective (outside of the top 10% rule - such as out of state applicants) and increase their status.
I think the UC system in CA does that where if you graduate at the top of your class, I don't know what the percentage is, you can automatically go to a UC school. It just might be UC Davis and not Berkeley or UCLA .
Out of UT, A&M, and UH, UH is third in that group. My point was that Universities usually go as far as their funding goes..
