What are yours? Here is a list (not including Wade as a PG). A quick list I pasted in. What is your Top 20 -- in order? alston,rafer arenas,gilbert armstrong,darrel arroyo,carlos barbosa,leandrin bibby,mike billups,chauncey boykins,earl cassell,sam claxton,speedy daniels,antonio davis,baron fisher,derek ford,t.j. francis,steve harris, lucious harris,lucious hinrich,kirk hudson,troy jackson,bobby johnson,anthony jones,damon kidd,jason knight,brevin lopez,raul lue,tyronn marbury,stephon mcinnis,jeff miller,andre murray,ronald nash,steve parker,tony payton,gary snow,eric stoudamire,damon terry,jason tinsley,jamaal vanexel,nick ward,charlie watson,earl williams,frank williams,jason
Did you just forget you had just made the following thread a minute earlier? http://bbs2.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=82287
1) kidd,jason 2) davis,baron 3) cassell,sam 4) parker,tony 5) bibby,mike 6) francis,steve 7) marbury,stephon 8) nash,steve 9) billups,chauncey 10) williams,jason 11) miller,andre 12) snow,eric 13) hinrich,kirk 14) arenas,gilbert 15) payton,gary 16) vanexel,nick 17) arroyo,carlos 18) ford,t.j. 19) jackson,bobby 20) terry,jason others recieving votes: 21) fisher,derek 22) tinsley,jamaal 23) daniels,antonio 24) mcinnis,jeff 25) stoudamire,damon 26) hudson,troy 27) boykins,earl 28) alston,rafer
1Kidd - still best in NBA at setting up teammates; best rebounding guard 2Cassel - awesome midrange game, killer in crunchtime 3Marbury - runs pick and roll better than most, 20/8, could pass both this year as his team has improved and Kidd/Cassel getting old 4Parker - has won an NBA championship, should be best in NBA some day 5Bibby - great shooter, team aging 6Davis - athletic, shoots too many 3s 7Billups - fits in great in Detroit's system 8Nash - great up-tempo guard, best offensive PG in NBA 9Francis - overrated, too many bad shots, turnovers 10Arenas - scores like whoa
kidd - i guess i'll put him number one. amazing court vision. not a good shooter who still puts up quite a few shots (shot more than francis last year). can make a talented team go. cassell - using last season as the barometer, he was amazing. having kg around obviously helped but he put up huge numbers. francis - i really don't wanna put him this high but i really don't feel any of the guys below him deserve it either. back on a team that needs his talents, he'll be explosive and a statsheet filler again. and all his teammates don't seem to end up hating him like starbury. baron davis - he and francis are close, i could've put him over francis, but last season he shot himself to greatness (his percentages were not good). he'll come down to earth a little in the west i think. i know that goes against using last season as a barometer which i did for cassell, but it's my post and i'll flip-flop when necessary. nash - at least for another year or two until he gets older. shoots so well but can still penetrate and create well. may finds things tougher this year when all 4 of his teammates can't launch 3's and spread the D for him to penetrate. marbury - great stats, could put him 3rd if i wanted to, but how much does he help his team, not sure. in fact, his stats may be the best but as long as his image (and it's backing in reality) remains i have a hard time putting him higher. bibby - overrated big time but he fits the sactown team perfectly. best shooting point guard not named nash. has either been a high assist man (8+ two season in vancouver) or more of a scorer (18 ppg last year) but never put the two together the way the guys above him have. if peja leaves maybe he'll get more of the offense to prove if he can. parker - playing with duncan is awfully nice. also overrated due to spurs overall success. will get better, and where he ends up on this list could be high but he has to show more than he has. billups - another guy perfect for his team and who is obviously getting huge pub from the teams run. he's moved way up the last 2 years but this is about where he tops out. that's about it from me.
1. Jason Kidd - Best passer, defender, and rebounder of all these guys, when he's healthy. 2. Baron Davis - Good passer, good defender, streaky shooter. He still has room to grow and improve. 3. Sam Cassell - Clutch shooter, strong passer, arguably the most well-rounded offensive player of any of these guys. Weak defender though. 4. Steve Nash - Great penetrator, extremely unselfish, effective, if weak finisher. Deadly shooter. No excuse for his poor defense, though. 5. Mike Bibby - Extremely clutch, unstoppable in the high pick and roll, great shooter and passer. Very effecient on the fast break. 6. Stephon Marbury - Marbury has all the physical gifts and instincts to be one of the greatest of all time. If he ever learns to trust his teammates with the ball, he'd be the best PG in the league. 7. Steve Francis - All-World talent and a CBA brain. Good guy, great energy, but he just doesn't know how to play winning basketball. 8. Andre Miller - Miller puts up monster stats when he's allowed to dominate the ball and create. 9. Gilbert Arenas. Great scorer, questionable decision making. Steve Francis with less athleticism but better scoring instincts. 10. Jason Williams - Can't shoot, plays zero defense, but he's probably the best ballhandler on the list, and right up there with Kidd in terms of passing ability. He's really improved his decision making in recent years.
01. Jason Kidd 02. Baron Davis 03. Sam Cassell 04. Steve Nash 05. Mike Bibby 06. Steve Francis 07. Stephon Marbury 08. Tony Parker 09. Jason Williams 10. Chauncy Billups
A top 20 list for PGs in today's NBA is a stretch. Honestly. Shockingly few guys are anything more than undersized SGs. You can count on one hand the ones that can distribute the ball, run the offense, and make teammates better. Even Isiah Thomas and Mark Price could do this while scoring, but that's why they were consistent winners. Guys like Gilbert Arenas are harmful if you want to win games. Baron Davis may be a great scorer that can carry his team, but his style in no way translates to a championship team. I still feel he was a huge reason why the US team blew it in 2002. That said: 1) Jason Kidd (but watch that knee closely) 2) Mike Bibby 3) Tony Parker 4) Andre Miller 5) Steve Nash ------------------------------ Best of the shoot-first-second-and-third Guards: (6) Chauncey Billups (for obvious reasons) (7) Sam Cassell (8) Stephon Marbury (9) Steve Francis (10) Baron Davis Captain Kirk and Carlos Arroyo are two guys I'm really high on, but it's best to wait a little before declaring them anything other than great-looking up-and-comers. Evan
kidd,jason bibby,mike davis,baron cassell,sam nash,steve marbury,stephon francis,steve arenas,gilbert billups,chauncey jackson,bobby parker,tony payton,gary williamson,jason fisher,derek miller,andre snow,eric vanexel,nick hinrich,kirk ridnour, luke ford,t.j.
1. Jason Kidd - Still the best passer in the league 2. Mike Bibby - Good all around player with great shooting touch 3. Starbury - Got the Knicks to the playoffs. 4. Sam Cassell - Maybe a little favoritism, but still solid. 5. Baron Davis - Can't argue against his stats. 6. Andre Miller - great passer, hasn't won much though. 7. Chauncey Billups - Takes the last shot, great defender. 8. Steve Francis - Gives everything on the court. Not a natural 1. 9. Steve Nash - falls because of his sorry defense. 10. Kirk Hinrich - all around threat 11. Tony Parker - Moves way up if he improves his jumper. 12. Gilbert Arenas - Can light up a scoreboard. 2nd round steal. 13. Nick Van Exel - instant offense 14. Jason Williams - maturing under Hubie 15. Bobby Jackson - Instant energy, best suited as reserve. 16. Eric Snow - good leader. 17. Jason Terry - super quick with good outside shot. 18. Speedy Claxton - Really impressed with GS last season. 19. Damon Stoudamire - Still a capable player. 20. Carlos Arroyo - Maybe the system, maybe one year wonder, maybe he is just that good.
1. kidd,jason 2. cassell,sam 3. nash,steve 4. parker,tony 5. bibby,mike 6. marbury,stephon 7. francis,steve 8. davis,baron 9. billups,chauncey 10. wade, dwayne 11. arenas,gilbert 12. williams,jason 13. terry,jason 14. snow,eric 15. payton,gary 16. mcinnis,jeff 17. jackson,bobby 18. ford,t.j. 19. arroyo,carlos 20. barbosa,leandrin
I still question people who say Marbury's shoot-first when he leads the league in total assists. That's a huge contradiction, almost an oxymoron. It's like saying a guy doesn't have a presence on defense even though he leads the league in blocks. I think this is the best list: dharocks 1. Jason Kidd - Best passer, defender, and rebounder of all these guys, when he's healthy. 2. Baron Davis - Good passer, good defender, streaky shooter. He still has room to grow and improve. 3. Sam Cassell - Clutch shooter, strong passer, arguably the most well-rounded offensive player of any of these guys. Weak defender though. 4. Steve Nash - Great penetrator, extremely unselfish, effective, if weak finisher. Deadly shooter. No excuse for his poor defense, though. 5. Mike Bibby - Extremely clutch, unstoppable in the high pick and roll, great shooter and passer. Very effecient on the fast break. 6. Stephon Marbury - Marbury has all the physical gifts and instincts to be one of the greatest of all time. If he ever learns to trust his teammates with the ball, he'd be the best PG in the league. 7. Steve Francis - All-World talent and a CBA brain. Good guy, great energy, but he just doesn't know how to play winning basketball. 8. Andre Miller - Miller puts up monster stats when he's allowed to dominate the ball and create. 9. Gilbert Arenas. Great scorer, questionable decision making. Steve Francis with less athleticism but better scoring instincts. 10. Jason Williams - Can't shoot, plays zero defense, but he's probably the best ballhandler on the list, and right up there with Kidd in terms of passing ability. He's really improved his decision making in recent years. " Good explantions, I agree.
Shoot first is a phrase that should be outlawed. Now Marbury for most of his career has led all PGs in shots per game, is the only PG in the league that can shoot 30+ times a game, he's usually top 3 in assists too, why? Because he dominates the ball WAY too much, WAY more than any other PG in the league, he makes his team play his game. No matter how talented his teammates are he has to play it his way, his way usually leads to a shot or a chance at an assist. Raef LaFrentz is usually in the top 5 in block shots, does he have a presense on defense?
1)Baron Davis 2)Jason Kidd 3)Sam Cassell 4)Steve Nash 5)Mike Bibby 6)Steve Francis 7)Stephon Marbury 8)Chaucey Billups 9)Tony Parker 10)Dwayne Wade
