They need a good coach to somehow fit Harden and Westbrook in order to fully utilize them. they can't have 2 ball dominant play makers and not have one suffer. someone has to learn to plan without the ball. I know Harden isn't great at it.
If you read my post. I quoted his first post where the fact of them losing was not discussed. Thanks.
Meh... They drafted four players collectively better than Curry, Thompson, Green, and Barnes. But I don't see any rings on their fingers so it's all just talk. I understand this is hypothetical, but it's not like they traded Harden away as a rookie or something. They got years together and they didn't get it done before losing guys to financial issues. Warriors did. Others (Spurs, etc) have done it too.
Seems like a model that usually falls apart before getting results. Suns had something in 2004-05 with Nash (I know he didn't come in the draft), Stoudemire, Marion, and Joe Johnson. Johnson left. T-Wolves had the start of something with Garnett and Marbury. Marbury left. Shaq and Penny -- Shaq left. Thunder, Harden left and then Durant. You can usually get 2 young hotshots to co-exist, 3 is harder, and 4 is apparently unstable. Kudos to the Warriors for keeping it together as long as they have.
$ plays a huge factor. gotta remember these super teams can be built today as with more $ being available to be spend. JJ left for money, harden left for money, shaq left for money, marbury chased money as well.
I read that the OKC super team doesn't exist anymore and that a bunch of 'what if' scenarios popped up
Eh, I wouldn't say those guys left for money. The Suns had the right to match Joe Johnson and he publicly asked them to not match. He wanted to be the primary option on his team. Maybe he figured that was more money down the road, but he could have had the same contract with the Suns. Marbury too, he wanted the limelight for himself and not be second fiddle to Garnett. Same thing for Shaq, he could get the same money in Orlando but saw fame and endorsement money awaiting him in LA. Harden -- well OKC could have kept him if they didn't have a brain defect. Durant left to ride someone's coattails to rings, it wasn't about the money.
No Joe johnson made it known he was upset with phx's initial offers to re-sign bc they were well below his market value so with that rift he told them not to match. so obviously money was the factor. Marbury again chased money. he wanted to go a market with more opportunities and even reports saying he was jealous of KG's contract. in the end money was the factor Shaq's situation has been well documented even by him publicly. No he wasn't going to get the same money in Orlando. He was insulted when the organization questioned whether he was worth max type money. He addressed this in the orlando years documentary, if they weren't going to pay me what im worth so im going to go somewhere else. at the time it wasn't realistic to keep harden if you're okc. we can look at it now and it's easy to say they should have gone over the cap maxing him out wasn't really ideal. of course people are going to have different views on this but if the game was played like it is today for the past few seasons where wing play is an absolute priority, they may have just kept him. the durant situation doesn't really need to be addressed. he wants to win period. He makes plenty of money and he'll make plenty more in his next contract
I won't keep arguing about the other stuff. But, on harden, people here at the time -- even before Harden was traded to Houston -- knew Presti was making a mistake choosing Ibaka and Perkins over Harden. Not everybody, but a good large contingent of posters. Perimeter play was already the clear strength to exploit in the NBA and Harden's numbers all looked fantastic. We were bashing the Thunder for considering not paying up. And we've had nothing but vindication since.
when you're young and fortunate to step foot in the league, you use every opportunity period to get as much money as you possibly can bc these guys know it could end at any time. that's just the reality of it. using a message board isn't much of clear indication on what they should of done. You still needed a big at the time. Ibaka was very much on the rise and fit what they needed. people are kidding themselves if they thought they knew all along harden would blossom into the player he is right now. they won 60 games without him and the 2nd best record in the league behind Miami's big 3 team at 66 wins. 59 wins the following year. then you have the injuries that are well known that affected their runs even though every season wb and kd were healthy in the playoffs they were no less at the WCF.
