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There are two teams that have beaten every playoff team in the west

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by what, Jan 18, 2015.

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  1. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    While I wouldn't be surprised if a seed 5-8 team makes the Finals from the West, I do put some stock in home court advantage.

    What was the Spurs lowest seed in a championship year? I think it was 06-07 when they were the 3rd seed.

    They can of course still finish as a top 4 seed. But they're 11-10 on the road this year.... though they've had some good road wins in there.

    I just think the age, the injuries, etc. that doing it on the road will be harder for them than say a team like the Thunder who might have to do that...

    But the Spurs prove people wrong, that's what they do.
     
    #41 JayZ750, Jan 19, 2015
  2. MourningWood

    MourningWood Contributing Member

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    [​IMG]
     
    #42 MourningWood, Jan 19, 2015
  3. what

    what Member

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    You can do that all you want. Back it up with the #'s. Mike Conley is the clutchest point in the nba:
    http://hoopshabit.com/2015/01/08/mike-conley-clutch-king-point-guards/

    Combine that with his top defensive skills. And his stellar pick n roll play and find me another point better than him.

    Not one that SHOOTS MORE TAN HIM. Or has better passing #s. You might not like Mike Conley, but the guy is better than MANY MANY MANY players. Especially in the 4th quarter, when it counts.

     
    #43 what, Jan 19, 2015
  4. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    He's better than Curry?

    Conley is usually a negative in defensive +/- metrics
     
    #44 Mr. Clutch, Jan 19, 2015
  5. what

    what Member

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    He is?
     
    #45 what, Jan 19, 2015
  6. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    In Box plus/minus and ESPN Rapm he is.

    Whether those actually mean anything is an open question.

    Big positive on offense tho
     
    #46 Mr. Clutch, Jan 19, 2015
  7. what

    what Member

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    Real Plus Minus? That is such a wonky stat. Especially defensively. Lebron James is 18th in Rapm at .20

    Danilo Gallinari and Gerald Henderson are ahead of him.
     
    #47 what, Jan 19, 2015
  8. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Everyone agrees LeBron has been having an off year and with that weird diet he wasn't as explosive initially.

    Last year LeBron was #1 in the league in that stat.
     
    #48 Mr. Clutch, Jan 19, 2015
  9. conundrum

    conundrum Rookie

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    Give me the spurs, grizzlies or blazers over the GS, OKC or Clippers. It's all about match ups.
     
    #49 conundrum, Jan 19, 2015
  10. what

    what Member

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    He was NOT #1 in defensive real plus minus. He was 24th. He was #1 in combined real plus minus because of his offensive number in real plus minus was SO much higher than everybody else's #.

    Face it, there is just not a GOOD stat to calculate how good a player is defensively, which was your original point about Conley: that his defensive plus minus was often a negative number.

    Conley has made the all defensive team as a point guard. The only other two that are usually on that list is: rondo and paul.
     
    #50 what, Jan 19, 2015
  11. what

    what Member

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    Oh and Patrick Beverly for all defensive team!
     
    #51 what, Jan 19, 2015
  12. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    That's what I said. The numbers aren't good for Conley but you have to interpret them.

    And votes for all NBA teams is an even worse measure. Would he get in if he wasn't on the Grizzlies?

    Wall has a good defensive reputation and he actually shows it in DRAPM.
     
    #52 Mr. Clutch, Jan 19, 2015
  13. what

    what Member

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    What I am saying is how do you explain Lebron's poor showing in DRAPM? Is lebron just not that good defensively?
     
    #53 what, Jan 19, 2015
  14. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    I think he's been conserving energy on that end because he is the whole offense
     
    #54 Mr. Clutch, Jan 19, 2015
  15. what

    what Member

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    or many the stat sucks. Lillard, a guy that let Beno Udrih punk him has a better # than Patrick Beverly, Mike Conley and Chris Paul: all three of these players have made the all-defensive team.
     
    #55 what, Jan 19, 2015
  16. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Votes for all defensive team is a terrible measure.

    Kobe was still making those in '11 and '12. SMH
     
    #56 Mr. Clutch, Jan 19, 2015
  17. what

    what Member

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    I agree that it is not fool proof. But the fact of the matter is, who else were you going to put on there, if not kobe?

    Stars usually get the benefit of the doubt. But the fact that Beverly (a basis nobody outside of the rockets fanbase until he took westbrook out) the fact that he got in tells you that voters are usually looking for players that are having great seasons: both offensively and defensively.
     
    #57 what, Jan 19, 2015
  18. JayZ750

    JayZ750 Contributing Member

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    I think Mike Conley is a fantastic player.

    I also think if you trade Conley and Steph Curry, the Grizzlies are unbelievable and the Warriors get worse. Not huge amounts in either direction, but enough to matter for both squads.

    Mind you, I think the same can be said about Curry and pretty much every other PG this year.. hence Curry being the best right now.

    So is Conley the second best? Maybe, but I think second best can be a tie at the moment between a ton of PGs. I don't think Toronto, Clippers, Blazers, Thunder, Wizards would trade their PGs for Conley at the moment. It'd be a lateral move for all teams, including the Grizzlies. Speaks to the strength at the position.

    The real differentiation will come at playoff time... so we'll just have to wait and see.
     
    #58 JayZ750, Jan 19, 2015
  19. what

    what Member

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    Curry is the only guy that I don't mind if people think he's better than Conley. The only real knock on Curry, in my opinion, is that he can be roughed up. Not that he is LIKE Blake Griffin. But he needs to prove that he can score when teams get physical with him.

    Harden, to a large degree, had that label till this year. This year Harden is making teams pay.
     
    #59 what, Jan 19, 2015
  20. Mr. Clutch

    Mr. Clutch Contributing Member

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    Chris Paul is clearly better too
     
    #60 Mr. Clutch, Jan 19, 2015
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