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The future of the EU and the UK, post-Brexit

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by MojoMan, Dec 4, 2016.

  1. dmoneybangbang

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  2. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Boris Johnson is implementing an ad campaign throughout the EU about the ramifications of a no deal Brexit to the people of the EU. This is brilliant. It is "Operation fear" targeted at the establishment leaders of the EU.

    UK Plans no-deal Brexit ad campaign in Europe

    LONDON — Boris Johnson's government is planning a Europe-wide media blitz to convince EU governments and citizens that the U.K. is serious about leaving, deal or no deal, on October 31.

    On top of a widely reported domestic public information campaign, officials are looking at taking out pages in major European newspapers and targeting online adverts at European citizens, directing them to U.K. government information on Brexit.

    Part of the European public information campaign will target and be tailored to U.K. citizens living on the Continent. But there is a wider aim to ram home the message to EU capitals that the U.K. is not bluffing when it says it will leave at the end of October.​

    You can see this chaffs them by their use of the phrase "ram home" in the last paragraph above. These people are accustomed to being the 'rammers'. Now they are going to experience what it feels like to be the rammees.
     
  3. Major

    Major Member

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    LOL. You do realize that no-deal Brexit is STILL not happening, right?
     
  4. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Actually, it is the current Parliament approved default which WILL happen on October 31, 2019, unless something is done to block that from happening.

    So, it very much appears that it is likely to happen.

    However, it is still my hope that the EU comes to their senses and becomes willing to modify their deal in a way that is acceptable to the people of the UK, as that would certainly be a better outcome for everyone concerned.
     
  5. dmoneybangbang

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    How would that be the best outcome for the EU? It’s funny how the Brexiters feel everyone else needs to adapt to them.
     
  6. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    Make up your mind.
     
  7. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Here is the entire sentence that you chopped the middle out of:

    "Actually, it is the current Parliament approved default which WILL happen on October 31, 2019, unless something is done to block that from happening."
     
  8. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    How soon could a general election happen?

    Even with a successful no confidence motion, it would be extremely tight to organise a general election before 31 October. MPs did not call a confidence vote before Westminster went on its summer break. That means 3 September, when Parliament next sits, is now the earliest opportunity to do so.


    [​IMG]

    Assuming the confidence vote is held and passed the next day, the 14-day period the government has to win back support would expire on 18 September. If that happens, the prime minister could choose to call the election the next day. That would mean dissolving Parliament on 20 September, signalling the start of the five week campaign.

    The House of Commons Library told the BBC, that such an scenario would leave Friday 25 October as the earliest possible election day - less than one week before Brexit day. To hold an election on a day other than a Thursday would be extremely unusual. In fact, you have to go back to Tuesday 27 October 1931 to find the last time this happened.

    Could the prime minister speed things up?

    A compliant prime minister could speed things up. Instead of having a 14-day period after losing any no confidence motion, the prime minister could decide to call an election. He would still need the votes of at least 66% of MPs, but that would trim two weeks off the election timetable.

    Could the prime minister slow things down?

    If, on the other hand, the prime minister was determined to leave the EU on 31 October, he could try to delay things. "Even if a vote of no confidence was successful, it doesn't guarantee the election will happen before Brexit day," says Catherine Haddon, from the Institute for Government think tank.

    That's because the prime minister controls the timetable. "For example, they could extend the wash-up [the period where some unfinished Parliamentary business is dealt with] before Parliament is dissolved," she says. By doing this, the election could be pushed into November - by which point the UK would have already left the EU.

    So ultimately, it is in the hands of the prime minster, rather than Parliament, to guarantee an election before Brexit is due to happen.
     
  9. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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  10. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    This is a very interesting comparison. Of course this is a sort of "Reformation" for the UK.

    The similarity is that the Catholic Church had grotesquely hijacked and deformed the Gospel of Jesus Christ, which is was the initial mission of the Church, and the EU has grotesquely hijacked and deformed what was initially agreed to be a free trade pact. Both organizations ultimately became obsessed with themselves and made themselves and their control over everyone under their rule their central objective.

    These people - meaning both the Catholic Church and the EU (and also the multinational globalist groups) - are not worthy of our worship and they should not be allowed to impose themselves on everyone in the way that they clearly want to. This realization resulted in the Protestant (Protest-ant) Reformation and is now resulting in Brexit, and also a lot of push-back around the world against this sort of unwanted, imposed centralized control. Obviously, people do not want that and they are not going to patiently accept it. Nor should they.

    The difference is that the Catholic Church had been 1,500 years in the making at that point, while the EU is only about 50 years old, in anything close to its current construction. It took about 10% of the relevant time to substantially unwind the tentacles of the Catholic Church. We are three years after the Brexit vote. If it takes 10% of the time that the EU has been in power, then we can expect about two or so more years of this, and then the EU (and the other multinational globalist groups) will be left to nurse their wounds in similar manner to what the Catholic Church did back in that day.
     
  11. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    dmoneybangbang likes this.
  12. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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  13. malakas

    malakas Member

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    I dont understand what is going on.

    Johnson's MPs are dissappearing out of nowhere.
    First he had 4 majority then I read it was 3 and then it was supposed to be 2.
    Now all of a sudden it's only 1?
    What the heck?

    There was only 2 byelections where did the other Tory MPs go?

    Anyway the 2nd referendum camp is already making preparations targeting warning and educating remainers in 100 seats, to strategically vote for only pro remain MPs. Even if its the opposite of their usual voting party.

    Like this Ian Duncan Smith dude, he barely won his seat by a few hundred votes. His seat is a prime target.

    Meanwhile the Brexit party has shown zero indication to cooperate with the Tories. It already cost them the byelection seat this week.
     
  14. malakas

    malakas Member

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    It has already happened once, very recently. No reason not to happen again.
    Especially since with Brexit the Tory Mps of Scotland are about to be decimated completely off the map.
    Scotland voted to remain and the nation is about to get dragged out against their democratically expressed will.
     
  15. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    They are talking about the margin of control. When you lose a by election, the other side wins. So that is a switch of two. It racks up faster than you think.

    In any case, if Boris Johnson gets the UK out of the EU on October 31, he will be well positioned to succeed in a general election shortly thereafter. If he does not achieve this before the next general election, the Tories could well be finished as a national party.
     
  16. malakas

    malakas Member

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    Can you finally grow up Mojoman?
    How old are you to actually believe that a country will fall out of the EU without a deal, because of a beauracratic loophole? :rolleyes:
    Do you think the politicians and diplomats are amateurs?

    In the worst case scenario it will be a national unity government, but more likely than not Johnson will have to call the elections himself very soon as a second referendum before he even has to face a no confidence vote.
     
  17. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    If it is a "National unity government," they will not be able to negotiate that before October 31. Which means the UK will be out of the EU when that group takes office. But the key question is, when does the next general election take place? Very likely after October 31, when the UK is already out of the EU.

    If that happens, Boris Johnson is very likely going to be straight back in as the Prime Minister, as the Brexit Party will be no more and the people that supported it will all jam the voting booths to vote for the Tories.

    Cheers!
     
  18. malakas

    malakas Member

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    No. The exact same reputable publication I am always reading, the guardian,was saying one month ago that he had a majority of 4 and now all of a sudden 1 with only a single byelection.
    I know a Labour brexiter MP turned independent recently maybe some Tories did as well while I wasnt paying attention maybe.
    There is zero chance there arent elections before 31 October.
    It doesnt have to do with Johnson its out of his hands.
    The numbers in parliament are clear and there are exact procedures.

    We have reached a point when senior Tory MPs and former ministers are publicly saying they will vote to throw the government and are having meetings with Labour out in the open. Its at minimum 5 most likely up to 40.

    The question is if Johnson will ask elections on his own or allow the humiliation to lose the no confidence vote and allow the opposition to try to form a government.
     
  19. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    First Labour has to be willing to back a no confidence motion. That is not a certainty at this point at all. As a result of their recent embrace of Remain and a second referendum as their party's official position, there are quite a few of these seats that are in Leave areas that they are now almost certain to lose in a general election.

    Labour does not want to have a general election right now. Not really.
     
  20. malakas

    malakas Member

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    You are mistaken if you think that the raison d' etre of the Tories is just to deliver Brexit.
    They are a majority historical party and their number one priority is and has always been to remain in power now and in the future.
    Even until recently they were proclaiming that they have to do everything in their power to avoid a general election so as to stay in power.
    Apart from some ideological fundamentalists like Steve Baker who are ready to die in a hill to achieve their goals, their agenda isnt Brexit but to do and say whatever to remain in power.

    Let alone that there are many powers and agents at work that wouldnt allow the Uk just to fall into no deal Brexit by a loophole.
    The Tories themselves wouldnt.
    Because then they would have no hope yo win the general elections the very next day.
     

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