1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

The case for giving Amen Thompson starter's minutes

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by OremLK, Jun 24, 2023.

?

Should Amen play more than 25 minutes per game as a rookie?

  1. Yes, he's already 20, he's ready.

    37 vote(s)
    33.0%

  2. No, he's too raw, he should come off the bench.

    30 vote(s)
    26.8%

  3. Maybe (depends on what point guard the Rockets can acquire).

    45 vote(s)
    40.2%
Page 1 of 5
  1. OremLK

    OremLK Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    16,120
    Likes Received:
    10,336
    Ime Udoka wants a veteran point guard for the Rockets, and that makes sense. The team needs structure and veteran leadership and needs somebody who can get players open looks. As an Amen booster, even I have been onboard with the plan of getting a good veteran to start in front of him for a year or two and letting him come along slowly, given that the adjustment from OTE may be particularly difficult, and considering we're trying to win a lot more this season.

    However, I do think there is a case for letting Amen start right away. He's such a unique player that there are not a lot of good 1:1 comps out there, but let's look at a few of the names that have been thrown out there as potential "ceiling" outcomes and see what happened during their rookie seasons:

    ---

    Russell Westbrook, age 20:
    65 games started, 15.3 points, 5.3 assists, 4.9 rebounds, 1.5 stocks, 3.3 turnovers, 40/27/81% shooting

    Ja Morant, age 20:
    67 games started, 17.8 points, 7.3 assists, 3.9 rebounds, 1.2 stocks, 3.3 turnovers, 48/33/77% shooting

    Ben Simmons, missed entire rookie season, first year on the court at age 21:
    81 games started, 15.8 points, 8.2 assists, 8.1 rebounds, 2.6 stocks, 3.4 turnovers, 54/0/56% shooting

    Penny Hardaway, age 22:
    82 games started, 16.0 points, 6.6 assists, 5.4 rebounds, 2.9 stocks, 3.6 turnovers, 47/27/74% shooting​

    ---

    Now, this would be great company to be in, and there's a high chance Amen ends up being much worse than these guys, or even if he does become that good of a player, he could be a lot slower to adapt. But I can imagine him coming in and getting close to this production level if he plays starter minutes right away; he's a beast in transition and that part of his game should translate right away.

    So, what if the "veteran point guard" we bring in is not planned to be the starter--or at least not expected to play more than ~25 minutes a game even if he does start? What if we get a backup point guard instead?

    One name that jumps to mind is Kyle Lowry. I know he doesn't have a ton left in the tank, but he's still a tough veteran leader with championship experience who is more than capable of bringing up the ball and doing the little things to play within a team concept. And he's a GD Rockets legend, so show some respect. But there could be other possibilities as well; perhaps a defensive specialist like Jevon Carter or Alex Caruso?

    ---

    What say you? Should Amen play 25+ minutes per game as a rookie, whether that's as a starter or not?
     
    #1 OremLK, Jun 24, 2023
    Arnel, MultipleSauces, FrontRunner and 6 others like this.
  2. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2008
    Messages:
    18,369
    Likes Received:
    18,391
    I would also put in a more explosive Lamelo as a comp. Everyone was worried about Lamelo’s shooting.

    Ok with giving him starter minutes but I’m not ok with the 48 being split between him, KPJ and Tyty. Not enough experience there, we should not cross our fingers and hope it works out.

    Would be happy with a very average PG like Schroeder or Monte Morris.

    Amen’s shooting progress should determine his minutes mostly.
     
    #2 Mathloom, Jun 24, 2023
    Rokman, Rashmon, theDude and 1 other person like this.
  3. OremLK

    OremLK Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    16,120
    Likes Received:
    10,336
    Good call, LaMelo was also in that general range as a rookie:
    15.7 points, 6.1 assists, 5.9 rebounds, 2.0 stocks, 2.8 turnovers, 44/35/76 shooting.

    I would be surprised if Amen gets that much better as a shooter before the season starts, but you never know--LaMelo was also a terrible shooter as a draft prospect (27.9% from three, 70.0% from the free throw line).
     
    #3 OremLK, Jun 24, 2023
    Mathloom likes this.
  4. PatBev

    PatBev Member

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2017
    Messages:
    3,092
    Likes Received:
    4,560
    If we don’t sign FVV, Conley, or somebody like that I’d let him start as long as we have a respectable backup point guard

    I’m gonna laugh when KPJ is the starter though
     
    #4 PatBev, Jun 24, 2023
    DCHAMP, Arnel, mac_got_this and 2 others like this.
  5. J Rock

    J Rock Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2022
    Messages:
    2,432
    Likes Received:
    2,769
    Give him minutes behind the starter. Let him learn without feeling he has to force anything. His time on the floor will be his classroom. When he makes small mistakes let him play through them, but when he is Fing up royally pull him and explain why and what he has to correct. Once he gets acclimated to the NBA game transition him to more responsibility on the court. Some people thrive when thrown into the fire but most don’t.
     
    #5 J Rock, Jun 24, 2023
  6. Two Sandwiches

    Two Sandwiches Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2002
    Messages:
    22,619
    Likes Received:
    14,225
    Pat Bev is the perfect point guard for this team.


    The number 4 pick should get heavy minutes. Maybe not 30, but he should get at least 20-25 mpg.


    If we sign FVV, he's going to want 4 years.


    What's the point of signing a guy for 4 years when you just drafted a point guard of the future at pick 4? I don't understand that...
     
    #6 Two Sandwiches, Jun 24, 2023
    bcast89, Corpusfan, keeez and 5 others like this.
  7. a time to chill

    a time to chill Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2012
    Messages:
    2,935
    Likes Received:
    5,440
    I think we need to find out what we have in Amen this year. Assuming we are able to sign a veteran PG, Amen should back him up off the bench. It would be a shame if Amen can’t get minutes on a bad team as the #4 pick. We aren’t a team with championship aspirations this year. Would not be a good sign if Amen couldn’t crack the rotation his rookie season.
     
    #7 a time to chill, Jun 24, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2023
    Arnel, bcast89 and Two Sandwiches like this.
  8. Dankstronaut

    Dankstronaut Way, way out here.
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2008
    Messages:
    8,618
    Likes Received:
    11,875
    Definitely want to see him start the year on the bench. Whether it's Porter, Vanvleet or anyone else I think we picked an oopsy-daisy handing the keys to Porter so quickly.

    #4 pick should have no problem showing out against 2nd units. By the end of the year he'll be starting.
     
    #8 Dankstronaut, Jun 24, 2023
  9. cml750

    cml750 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2002
    Messages:
    5,885
    Likes Received:
    3,517
    Simmons 3 pt and FT percentages stand out. I hope Amen can do better than 56% from the line. Simmons apparently did not even make a single 3 pointer as a rookie.
     
    #9 cml750, Jun 24, 2023
  10. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2003
    Messages:
    58,923
    Likes Received:
    36,483
    The strategy of "toss the prize new pony the ball regardless" had resulted in 2 years of pathetic, mostly unwatchable basketball with no tangible returns.

    Those of you process braining yourselves to death should remember how horrible and miserable it was to watch Rockets games basically from December onwards.

    It was not fun. Not interesting. You knew they were going to lose and be embarrassed in some way every night.

    Yes, i know, blahblah was all silas. Sure.
     
    #10 SamFisher, Jun 24, 2023
    justtxyank, BallSoHarden, No Worries and 1 other person like this.
  11. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    124,119
    Likes Received:
    33,008
    He basically just played high school plus ball, he is going to need to adjust to the NBA, he may need time in the g league.

    He will start when he is ready.

    we are now in win mode, players no longer play because they were drafted.

    DD
     
    #11 DaDakota, Jun 24, 2023
    BallSoHarden, topfive, Ren ason and 4 others like this.
  12. Denovo

    Denovo Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2019
    Messages:
    1,318
    Likes Received:
    2,665
    He should play big minutes but off the bench.

    Behind FVV or whoever we sign
     
    #12 Denovo, Jun 24, 2023
    Arnel and theDude like this.
  13. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    72,927
    Likes Received:
    111,111
    no problem with him starting if that's what Ime decides
     
    #13 Os Trigonum, Jun 24, 2023
    jamisonrocket likes this.
  14. Hemingway

    Hemingway Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2016
    Messages:
    6,121
    Likes Received:
    8,125
    I dont remember Ime saying he needed a vet pg specifically. He did say they were going to try and find vets to round out the team and help the youthful core to continue to develop. KPJ is going to start and bring up the ball and hand it to Sengun. Amen will come off the ;bench and play a more traditional pg role. KPJ should shine as part of a sg tandem with green.
     
    #14 Hemingway, Jun 24, 2023
  15. invocux

    invocux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2022
    Messages:
    2,627
    Likes Received:
    3,416
    They will not send him to the gleague i reckon but he was playing with 15 yos couple months ago so he shouldn't start for his own sake. He should come off the bench for a while then couple months later you end KPJ experience, put KPJ on the wing and make Amen our PG.
     
    #15 invocux, Jun 24, 2023
  16. StevieCrossover

    StevieCrossover Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2007
    Messages:
    900
    Likes Received:
    253
    I wish there was a vet point guard, he can backup to. There is no true vet point guards on this team yet.
     
    #16 StevieCrossover, Jun 24, 2023
    saleem likes this.
  17. OremLK

    OremLK Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    16,120
    Likes Received:
    10,336
    A team with Amen playing the majority of the minutes (or about 50/50) at the 1 is probably due for another sub-30-win season, yes. It may depend on who we do add via free agency/trade, though. Is there a path to 30+ wins with Amen Thompson as the primary ballhandler for 25-30 minutes per game?
     
    #17 OremLK, Jun 24, 2023
    No Worries likes this.
  18. J.R.

    J.R. Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    107,606
    Likes Received:
    156,640
    He didn’t say it. It was reported he wants one.

    “New Rockets coach Ime Udoka is believed to covet a veteran point guard, according to league sources, and VanVleet is among a wide list of targets for Houston this offseason.”

    https://rocketswire.usatoday.com/20...int-guard-for-rockets-fred-vanvleet-a-target/

    “They also said acquiring a veteran point guard is Houston’s primary objective…”

    https://rocketswire.usatoday.com/20...int-guard-james-harden-leads-list-of-targets/
     
    #18 J.R., Jun 24, 2023
    xtruroyaltyx, TimDuncanDonaut, charlieaustin and 5 others like this.
  19. invocux

    invocux Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2022
    Messages:
    2,627
    Likes Received:
    3,416
    I might be wrong but LaMelo wasn't 65% from ft line. LaMelo's ft fg percentage was high enough to be optimistic about his 3pt shot. Besides his shot wasn't broken. If it was broken he wouldn't have gone from .25 (5.6 attempts) in Australia to .35 (5.1 attempts) in NBA in less than a year.
     
    #19 invocux, Jun 24, 2023
  20. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2017
    Messages:
    9,212
    Likes Received:
    12,344
    Westbrook rookie year: Thunder 23-59
    started out 1-12 got PJ Carlesimo fired.

    Thunder had a team 35.2% (3P%) ranked 18th but was mainly
    Durant at 42.2% and Jeff Green at 38.9%

    Ben Simmons rookie year: Philly 52-30
    Philly was 14th in 3P% at 36.2%
    Inside-out-game of Embiid with shooters:
    (that season):
    Bayless 37.0%
    Belineli 38.5%
    Covington 36.9%
    Ilyasova 36.7%
    McConnell 43.5%
    JJ Reddick 42.9%
    Saric 39.3%


    Ja Morant rookie year: 34-39
    Memphis had: (that season 3P%) :
    Dillon Brooks 35.8%
    Brandon Clarke 35.9%
    Grayson Allen 40.4%
    Solomon Hill 38.1%
    JJJ 39.4%
    Tyus Jones 37.9%
    Anthony Tolliver 41.5%



    Has anyone heard Apache saying, "get us some 3-point shooters!!"

    Hello, anyone out there? I'm talking to myself?

    If Stone is presenting a "5 year plan" he'll be fired by the trade deadline
     
    #20 ApacheWarrior, Jun 24, 2023
    DaDakota, Ancient Moabite, Verbal Christ and 1 other person like this.
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 1 of 5

Share This Page

Toggle Width
Style
ClutchFans Original

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Rockets Content

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now