For starters, not giving up six picks. An all pro or two would be nice. But really having several guys who can be above average starters. CJ, Strong, and Blue are not that. What is your measure? If he doesn't get cut he's a good pick?
I told you my measure, you try and draft nfl players and we have for the most part while at the same time find a gem or two which we haven't done. But that's why I called them good not great drafts.
I think that you are overstating the number of "franchise" QBs. I guess we could argue over the definition of the word franchise. But let's not and said we did. I think that we can agree that the Texans *at best* have a QB that they are happy to roll with. The *at best* stop working when Arian Foster got injured. Getting back to the original argument ... Fans are not happy with the Texans. The product on the field is crap. The Texans needed a QB to carry the offense, once Foster went down. The Texans do not have this QB on their roster. Fans want to blame OBie for not finding a better QB. Better QBs are hard to find. Very few above average QB ever make it to FA. Finding QB in the draft is also very hard. Guessing here but ... 1 out of 3 cant-miss QB actually get drafted and make it. Wasting a first round pick on a QB that you are not sure on can be a Career Limiting Move for head coaches. You can easily see why HCs would draft more of a sure thing, than say a QB, in the first round.
Fair enough. I think we got a couple good guys in there. My issue is mainly how many picks they wasted trading up. And now we have depth issues
If Johnson and McKinney keep improving the way they have, the 2015 class may prove to be one of the better drafts we've had in a while (not saying much considering the 2013 abortion and still trying to feel out the 2014). Strong, Mumphery, and Covington have also shown flashes which is nice.
That's exactly what I'm saying. Drafts have been decent we just haven't hit any homeruns which is a concern because other FOs are hitting homeruns. I think there is some luck involved but there has to be "a little" science hitting a homerun.
I think it's the opposite. They're getting one or two homeruns (mostly in the first) but then a bunch of strike-outs. Nix, Swearinger, Montgomery, Tervardo, Hilliard, Strong (since they refuse to play him), Posey, Martin, Bullock, etc. That's a lot of strike-outs in four drafts.
Yep... exactly. Even just an "average" haul from round 2-4 over the years would put this franchise in a remarkably different place... when you completely miss as much as they have, regardless of where they were drafting, its going to put you in franchise limbo no matter how great your core players are.
This is a BOB thread so I'm only considering the 2 most recent drafts. We're not debating Smith here.
So that gets back to my point. You're suggesting the way to keep your job is just to not try to get a QB, because if you take a risk and fail, you might look bad. That's a terrible way to run a franchise - makes sense for a coach that's not confident in himself, but it should be unacceptable to management. You said 2/3rds of teams are looking for a franchise QB. That's about 21 teams. Here are 15 that are definitively NOT looking for new QB at this time: NE, GB, NYG, CIN, BAL, IND, OAK, ATL, DAL, NO, PIT, SD, CAR, ARI, SEA. That doesn't include teams like JAX, TEN, TB, and MIN that are hoping their guys are franchise QBs. That's 19 teams right there that I would suggest have a franchise or hope-to-be franchise QBs.
So, you're saying the Texans are the Astros of the NFL?:grin: But the Astros don't work in the NFL? I got you....
I thought we agreed to not debate this, but say that we did. Spoiler QB Index: Ranking the starters 1-32 Published: Sept. 10, 2015 Class of his own 1. Aaron Rodgers Top Shelf 2. Ben Roethlisberger 3. Andrew Luck 4. Tom Brady 5. Matt Ryan 6. Philip Rivers 7. Drew Brees 8. Tony Romo 9. Russell Wilson 10. Peyton Manning Next Level 11. Cam Newton 12. Joe Flacco 13. Matthew Stafford 14. Ryan Tannehill 15. Eli Manning 16. Sam Bradford 17. Carson Palmer 18. Teddy Bridgewater 19. Colin Kaepernick Stuck in the middle 20. Alex Smith 21. Jay Cutler 22. Andy Dalton 23. Blake Bortles 24. Nick Foles The Rookies 25. Jameis Winston 26. Marcus Mariota Question marks 27. Derek Carr 28. Kirk Cousins 29. Ryan Fitzpatrick 30. Tyrod Taylor 31. Josh McCown 32. Brian Hoyer <hr /> I think that my argument is that #1-10 are the franchise QBs. #11-#19 are their franchise's QB. :grin: They are above average. But are they good enough to put their team on their shoulder and carry it to victory? The gentle reader will note that #13 and #19 are now occupationally challenged. 2015 QBs ranked by rating
There's no need to make a case for Obrien yet. He's going to get a 3rd year. After that he'll be gone unless the team is playoff bound/succeeding with Hoyer OR OBrien and a new/young QB are rapidly progressing together
Well, Nix, Hilliard, Strong, XSF (so far), CJF(disappointment), Blue, McKinney FINALLY had a good game, Mumphrey (snore), and Hilliard (didn't even make the team). That's a lot for just two drafts.
You want to write off a draft class in half a season?!?!? Glad you're not running the show. Do you remember JJs first 8 games. I won't look it up for you but it was rather pedestrian. Never change CF, never change.
lol No one is writing them off. You can only judge what you see so far. The only players I mentioned from this draft are McKinney (I said he had a good game), Jaelen Strong (even the coaches don't think enough of him to make him active. Never happened to Watt), and Hilliard (got cut and cleared waivers). So far, Strong and Hilliard aren't "NFL players". So far your 3rd round pick (who you traded up for) and your 7th round pick aren't "NFL players"
I disagree with this in regards to last year. Foster played 13 games, produced 1200 yards on the ground, and 1500 yards total. The total passing attempts last year put the Texans in the bottom half of the league, and a near 50/50 run/pass ratio. They were reliant on the run game and it was much better than "without much".
