Jones can make a play in transition with the ball, yes. But not in half-court sets. You give Terrence the ball high and ask him to do something with it against playoff teams and they just melt away from him and dare him to shoot it. So much for face-up. Then he's got to either pass the ball or he's got to attack basically a packed down zone because his man is so far off him. (I'm describing the Portland series to you now.) The only face-up game Jones has is if he get a rookie/stupid defender on him who isn't aware he can't shoot and the defender faceguards him. That doesn't happen with good teams. They know he can't shoot. They dare him to shoot it. Because they want him to shoot it.
You are wrong. Jones will get a pass, and he will face up and take them to the hole, then make a spin move into a baby hook. He transitions from a drive to almost a post up with the spin move close to the basket. He does it all the time. He uses his speed to drive to the hole to get deep position. I mean, just watch his highlights from the game against Brooklyn. You can see every shot he made: <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/cZFvWI_n8GQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
I'm not nit picking, when the Rockets put the ball in TJ's hands and he creates his own offense (regardless of in the post or out on the floor) he is not a garbage player. Dennis Rodman was the very definition of a garbage player. Teams never passed him the ball with the intent of him creating his own shot unless he was wide open by himself under the basket. pretty much 90% of his points came from put backs or the break. You have tried to paint TJones in this picture but that is grossly unfair.
And I forgot to mention Jones can also run the pick and roll. He's not a garbage man. And yes, the vast majority of his baskets come within a few feet of the rim, but so does Motiejunas'. Apart from the occasional 3-pointer, Motiejunas is shooting right around the rim too.
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And if you didn't watch the video, here is each play: pick and roll lay-up post up, face up, take man to hole for a lay-up transition finish in traffic post up, face up, take to hole baby hook dish off from Smith drive, free throws pick and roll lay-up tip-in drive to the basket from perimeter, lay-up in traffic post up baby hook shot Most of his points came from posting up/facing up and pick and roll. He's good at getting to the basket and finishing whether that is driving in from the perimeter, facing up and taking it inside, or finishing on the pick and roll. That's where most of his points come from. Only some of his points come in transition or from put-backs.
Nothing to see here. He posted up Joe Johnson, a small forward, and on another possession, Brook Lopez lets him catch the ball midpost and then Lopez overplays him stupidly instead of peeling back. That's the Nets. Bad team. The rest of the plays were finishes in transition, pick-and-rolls, and garbage putbacks. While those plays are nice and appreciated, they're not unique. The vast majority of young, athletic bigs can duplicate those plays. They're a product of our system and getting in transition and running. Most garbage men can run a pick and roll and finish. And yes, most of DMo's shots are at the rim. The difference between DMo and Terrence though is DMo can go in there and post up centers, make moves on them, and get his hook shots. Take a look at DMo and Terrence shot charts in the paint area. 90% of Terrence's shots are at the rim. While DMo's shots are distributed throughout the paint area relatively evenly and with greater overall effectiveness. DMo can create in the low post. TJones cannot create in the low post against true bigs. C'mon guys. Surely you can tell a difference in the offensive games of DMo and Terrence. Yes, Dennis was the quintessential garbage man. Jones isn't Dennis. He's nowhere close to Dennis defensively and on the glass. But this idea that we pass the ball to Terrence for him to create his own offense is hogwash. Doesn't happen. We pass the ball to Terrence because he is open. He either shoots it or passes it. Our offense is in no-wise built around getting Terrence the ball so he can create. It's built around James creating. Terrence gets the ball as a result of James and others creating and then he finishes it.
And to whomever brought up Asik as a garbage man....LOL. Good luck with that one. Asik can't hardly catch the ball. When he does catch it, he brings it down and gets it stripped way too often. Then if he actually makes it up to finish, he's so slow getting up that more athletic players can contest and block him. Asik is a terrible garbage man. Asik is a defender/rebounder. EDIT: Asik is 55% for his career at the rim. That is very pedestrian for a 7-footer. And that doesn't account for a turnover rate of close to 20%. He is god awful with the ball in his hands. The only time Asik should touch the ball is tipping it in after it's already been shot or pulling down the offensive board and passing the ball, or catching and finishing when there is no defender within 3 feet of him at the rim.
He breaks a players ankles going to the rim and that is not creating his own shot? You think any power forward in the league does that? :roll eyes: You cling to your opinions like crap to toilet paper. You refuse to let them go even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary. Here is yet another video of Jones creating his own shot. You will notice multiple times in this video that he gets the ball and either posts his man up or creates his own shot by dribbling around his man and going to the basket. <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/jL2ogxrsiKE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Very first play is exactly what I was talking about when I said Jones likes to face up and take his man to the basket off the dribble and spin to get deep position for either a lay-up or baby hook. He does it all the time and he's good at it. I don't know what basketballholic is seeing. He's very unwilling to change his mind even when he's obviously wrong.
All this is doing is verifying what I'm saying. Here you got the Celtics, a lottery team not even trying to win games, outside faceguarding TJones at the 3-point line and biting on shot fakes. Do.you.really.think.playoff.teams.are.going.to.play.this.way? Then he throws in a 3-pointer off the window. And the only big defender in that whole sequence that Jones didn't outsize was Kelly Olnyk, a 7-footer who is widely known as a terrible defender, who was one of the guys faceguarding Terrence out there and did respond to a 3-point shot fake. Do.you.really.think.playoff.teams.are.going.to.play.this.way? This video is fools gold crash.
If Basksetballholic doesn't respect Brooke Lopez on defense maybe he will respect Nene on defense <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/5Ukc7Lg6Fh0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
I never said Asik was good at it. I said that is the kind of offensive player he is. A garbage man is just a big man who doesn't really have any offensive skill. The only points he scores are just gimmes. Putting back an offensive rebound, catching a dump off for a dunk right under the basket from a driving guard, trailing the fast break for an easy dunk, etc. That's what a garbage man is. What Jones does (scoring in transition not as a trailer, scoring in the pick and roll, taking his man to the basket, facing up and scoring, etc) is not what a garbage man does. He is a skilled basketball player.
We are discussing Terrence Jones' style of play. That has nothing to do with the team he is competing against.
LOL. A big man who doesn't have any skill is a 15th man and a 6-foul man. He plays to foul other poor free throw shooting bigs. He doesn't play to finish garbage.
At the ripe old age of 32, I'm beginning to think I've never seen someone more incapable of admitting he is wrong -- that Romney thread was a hoot and a half. This is an interesting character study, for sure.
Here is TJ throwing down 18 points & 10 rebounds against Kevin Love and complete with a nice block and a couple of really skilled assists. <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/5Ukc7Lg6Fh0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Terrence style of play is not effective in half-court sets against playoff teams. He is effective in transition. But transition basketball is very suppressed in the playoffs. All those shot fakes and drives.....don't happen against Portland, Memphis, Clippers, Spurs, Mavs, Thunder, and Warriors. They're too smart. Why can't you see this?
