Sounds good to me. I think people are clicking on that thread thinking the discussion is about how great (or bad) the movie was and not expecting people discussing specifics of the story. reposting....Had a question... Spoiler While in the airplane, how did Fischer not wake up with the tubes in his arm? If you die in dream world, you wake up instantly in real world. How was it possible that they all awoke within seconds of each other AND without being connected to the machine? There's no way the flight attendant could have removed them from the machine so quickly. Any explanations?
people shouldn't be dumb enough to click on a thread for a movie that's out and not expect spoilers. why are people still using the spoiler tag?
It looked to me like Fischer was already awake and thinking about the whole "father/will" thing, as well as JGL/Page already seemingly wide awake. The only two who really looked shocked/just woken up were Cobb and Saito
Assume the Attendant had a time given to her by the team on when to remove the machine and everything. The team is working with a known countdown throughout.
Yeah, I don't remember seeing anyone wake up in the plane save for Cobb and Saito, since they were presumably well behind the others since Cobb had to go track down Saito. Now, with the extreme time dilation effects, it might have only been a few minutes after the others woke up, but it was definitely later. I would like to point out that this is the first movie I have ever seen where Cillian Murphy didn't creep me the hell out. That dude just has a weird look about him.
I'm not sure it if they made this point clear or not, but I don't think you have to remain connected to the machine to remain in the dream. It's more of an access point, and you remain there until you get a kick or the sedative wears off. Can anyone clarify?
One thing that sucks about being convinced that the entire movie was a dream was the meaning of that last shot changes on repeat viewings. In the theater, it didn't occur to me that ALL of it might be a dream (well, it did, but I thought Cobb's totem toppling a couple times was proof against that) so when we get that last shot of the top spinning and waiting for it to fall, or not, I was on the edge of my seat wondering, holding my breath. When I see it again, next, there won't be any of that feeling because I've already interpreted it to all be a dream. I understand that part of what Nolan is saying is that dream and reality are indistinguishable and our perception and belief are what makes any one reality the "true" reality, which is one reason why Nolan cuts before you get any real answer on the spinning top...it doesn't matter if it falls or not. Cobb's experience is his reality, and if it is a dream and not the flesh and blood world, from his perspective makes no difference.
So you are saying that person A can be in person B dream without being "connected" by the machine? Also I have another question... When Fischer awakens on the plane, shouldn't he be suspicious that the people around him on the plane are the ones who kidnapped him in level 1? So if level 0 represents reality, can you remember what happens in level 2? If the answer is yes, then Fischer SHOULD be able to understand what is going on instead of waking up thinking it was just a normal dream.
Possibly, but since they established in the movie that the idea of inception was impossible (or considered to be so by most people) I don't think he would have considered the possibility that the people on the plane were the ones that convinced him to dissolve his father's empire. Plus, since people already have difficulty remembering single layered dreams when they wake up, my guess is that remembering multiple layers deep is damn near impossible. In the first layer, when they are in the van, don't they only appear to Fischer wearing masks? So he wouldn't really remember if the folks on the plane were in his dream or not, right?
..was too lazy to click on all the spoiler buttons in the other thread.. so, not sure if this was discussed or not.. on the imdb boards, they are saying that the whole movie was a dream.. lol. Cobb incepts himself by creating this character Saito in his mind who can get him back to his children through one phone call. and some of the reasoning behind this is that in the beginning Saito says the same thing as his wife did.. "you have to have a leap of faith".. and also Saito was playing with that spinning totem too (in the beginning), which is suppose to be Cobbs.
I'm convinced. He was dreaming the entire time and was still dreaming at the very end. Whether the top fell or not was irrelevant because he was dreaming even when the top fell earlier in the movie. Why do I think this? Two concepts which were conveniently introduced in the movie: (1) The dream just starts. You never remember how you got there. How did Cobb learn how to steal ideas through dreams? Why is he the best? What was he trying to steal from Saito? Who were the guys after him? It's all vague and undefined, you just assume things. Much like a dream. (2) Things in a dream don't seem unreal while in the dream. A device that lets you enter people's dreams? Really? If we're basing ourselves in reality, that is not real. However, to everyone in the movie, it seemed like common technology and everyone seems to know about it. It didn't seem unreal to them and us moviegoers might just assume it's just part of the world. Nolan could be pulling a fast one on us though -- these devices don't exist in the real world, and it just seemed real to those in the movie because it was a dream. And since we accepted it as reality, we too were dreaming!
Saito and Cobb were in Limbo together and as someone mention the machine is just a portal. As for Fischer, I think it's a case of you not remember details about the dream if anything at all.
Also... how often have you met a group of people, or saw some people on TV, or whatever, or just any object, and suddenly you see those people or objects in the dream you have that same night, or even a few nights later?
My understanding is that Fischer does recognize that the people around him were in his dream(s)...but is that really so strange? Don't we regularly project real people into our dreams? Not to mention, we often forget most of what we dream as soon as we wake up (as we all know from experience, and as state by Cobb when he was initiating Ariadne at the cafe). On top of it all, when we're asleep, time flies. So although he was asleep for 10 hours and dreaming the whole time, it probably only felt like 10 minutes (just throwing out an arbitrary number, obviously). It wasn't a 2 1/2 hour experience for him like it was for us in the theater. Am I making any sense?
Fischer wasn't necessarily in Yusuf's dream as he immediately before he woke up. He could have been just asleep. Remember when Saito was unplugged earlier in the train he didn't immediately wake up. He wasn't still in the dream, he was just asleep. There's no way for someone to remember what happens beyond the first layer if they aren't aware of whats happening. Fischer is just dreaming, so everything would be very vague. And that's the point. The idea has to be implanted in the deepest recesses of his consciousness.
