Sources: Jvg not interested in Rockets because of relationship with owner

can you post the tweet?

 

Don't know how sorry

 

No, he's at the top of the Lakers' list. They're going to wait until the spurs to win/lose in the finals to hire him

 

I've been saying that having a great coach goes beyond x's and o's forever, that is My case against Jeff Van Gundy. He strikes Me as a guy who knows more or less about the x's and o's of the game, but lacks in the intangibles department as a coach. That has been My argument about a coach for a while, it is not about x's and o's more than it is about unifying your team, and say what you want about the triangle, it played a huge role in unifying those teams for Jackson.

They played hard for Van Gundy, but couldn't even carry 2-0 series lead to victory from the Mavericks series after defeating them twice at home.

Not saying Van Gundy's teams did not play hard, but playing like warriors, or a team with a killer instinct, is not the case for a team who drops a 2-0 lead against their basketball rival and never gets passed the first round of the playoffs. If anything, those Knicks teams gained there mentality after a carry over from the Riley era rather than they did having Jeff Van Gundy instill it for the franchise.

Adelman was a better coach for the Rockets than Van Gundy ever was for the Rockets. Watching the teams play were like night and day, with the motion like offense of Adelman, compared to the stiff and predictable Van Gundy offense on the court. Not only that, Adelman was not afraid to fight for his team.

Hell, I hate to say it, but McHale was even a better coach than Van Gundy for the Rockets, he put across at least a semblance of a warriors mentality he had from his Celtic days, that at least helped his team get passed the first round and play hard despite not really having structure in the system.

I think you might want to get over your high horse with Jeff Van Gundy, judging on the past, he was not a good coach for the Rockets at the time. Maybe all right of decent, but not a great coach. It seems you are putting some qualities upon Van Gundy that you would like to see in a coach, but were just not there when he coached the Rockets.

Maybe he has changed, but I do not see him someone who was great or bad at unifying for the team. I do not think that was his strength as a coach, and I could care less what others players say about liking Jeff Van Gundy, not that many players even gush about Phil Jackson, no that other players opinions do not matter, but I rather go about judging by the coaches intangibles and coaching style, and what I see in the person in coaching people as a coach.

 

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">&quot;I'll be surprised if Jeff doesn't wind up with the Rockets. That's growing consensus of people around the league.&quot; - <a href="https://twitter.com/TimBontemps">@TimBontemps</a></p>&mdash; Red Nation Hoops (@RedNationHoops) <a href="https://twitter.com/RedNationHoops/status/725046844858978304">April 26, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

I never really held that series against them. Even Yao was not really all that much of a force... and given the refs scrutiny on his moving picks, he was often on the bench for critical stretches. That series was basically a prime T-mac vs. a Prime Dirk, prime Finley, prime Terry, prime Josh Howard (who was actually able to guard Yao in certain stretches). That same Mavericks team went on to the finals the following season, then was the #1 seed the year after that who got upset by the Warriors.

That was a tremendous series to be in that position (with the likes of Bob Sura, Bowen, and Wesley all playing heavy minutes... even missing Juwan Howard was critical)... and yes, they ultimately lost a commanding series lead... but do I ever consider it a choke or a series where the lesser team won? Never.

Pat Riley never coached Sprewell, Alan Houston, Larry Johnson or Marcus Camby... the heart and soul of that Knicks team. They went to the Finals in 1999. Riley stopped coaching there in 1995. IN fact, the only player remaining on that 1999 team that Riley coached was Patrick Ewing... and he was injured. Stop making stuff up to try and fit your beliefs.

And yet was his team really prepared to fight for him? Doesn't seem to be the case... not a lot of love outpours for Adelman from former players, as compared to JVG. It just is what it is. I too would have liked to see what JVG could have done with Lowry, Scola, T-mac, Yao, and Artest.

And based on your above reasoning/logic, I could simply say Adelman's teams were better simply due to the hard nosed mindset instilled by JVG... something lacking at Edelman's previous stints (but I won't say that... because your previous statement was not only moronic, it was factually incorrect).

Now you've basically revealed yourself... credibility dropping.

It seems like you're trying to detract from him based on a lot of fluff, stereotypes, and generalities... but yeah, McHale was a better coach... sure.

I'll trust the ex-players over who "you" see... and in this case, whether its Thibs, JVG, or some unknown... you need somebody to be able to light a fire under Harden and keep it lit. He's the key to everything. There is no point in getting a coach who he doesn't respond to or doesn't command his respect.

 

Adelman's teams did not fight for him, whether it was the Kings or Rockets?

I mean, look at the results, Adelman did his best work without McGrady, and you can argue an inferior roster compared to what Van Gundy had at the time.

Whether it was the Mavs series, where Van Gundy choose to play it calm and collective rather than get kicked out a few games to send a message about the horrendous officiating after game 2, or the Jazz series, there was always a sense of disappointment with the team when Van Gundy coached.

I did not feel that way when Adelman coached, he got the most out of his roster and if anything, overachieved with his rosters, not underachieve with his teams.

And McHale, although he was infuriating to watch at times, during the playoffs, he lit a fire under his team after the first two games the Rockets lost to Portland at home, I do not think he did a bad job during the playoffs, even though I did not feel he was a good coach in many other respects on the court.

 

No, you can't. In no universe is a roster that is giving rotational minutes to Sura, Wesley, Padgett and Bowen better than anything Adelman had to work with. Additionally, Yao was a finished product (a dominant low-post big man) entirely due to JVG's regime by the time Adelman inherited him... and attempted to Brad Miller him.

That's fine and dandy... thank goodness nobody is asking him to come back and coach those teams.

You do realize neither of those two are coming back. One was just fired and the other wants nothing to do with Les/Morey ever again.

You've pretty much lost credibility by flat out giving incorrect statements regarding the Knicks team... and stating that JVG's teams were more talented, at any point, than the ones Adelman inherited.

As it is, I'm still not sure what any of this has to do with the current state of affairs...where its clear this team needs a mental lobotomy and needs a coach who can get their best player to be even better (and we've already discussed what likely happens with any coach that this player doesn't respect or effectively clashes with).

 

I was talking about the Jeff Van Gundy Rockets rosters, compared to the Adelman Rockets, not the Knicks. My fault if I did not clarify on that, thought it might have been understood. And did not Van Gundy coach the team after Riley left the organization? How is that incorrect? I could be wrong but still does not change My opinion on Van Gundy.

Having McGrady in his prime is still a special talent to have, whether Yao was developed or not, does not excuse the collapse they had against the Mavs and the loss to the Jazz. Adelman did not have McGrady in his prime for the playoffs when they got passed the first round, so it could go both ways. And compared to the averages, Yao was averging less points per game under Adelman compared the Van Gundy, so a "finshed product," maybe, but the team still played more like a well coached team under Adelman. Mike James and Juwan Howard were not so much of bad players at the time either for the Rockets.

It took a great coach such as Adelman to finally get past the first round and restore playoff success to the organization.He did that with Ron Artest as his second best player. Whether the team had a better roster, I think is a matter of opinion, but still feel the teams underachieved during the Van Gundy era compared to Adelman era.

Not sure what you mean about the fine and dandy comment.


Did not Jeff Van Gundy have a somewhat ugly divorce wit h the Rockets also, I know McHale was let go 11 games into the season, but I though the whole point of this thread was that Van Gundy does not like Les because the way the previous divorce went with the team.

 

I am too. Sura, Wesley, Bowen, Padgett, Barry were the role players JVG had with the Rockets. I would have loved to see what JVG did with a lineup up Lowry, Artest, T-mac, Scola and Yao (Adelman's starting 5)... that's probably the most talented lineup the Rockets have had since the championship era. And it featured a dominant Yao that JVG didn't have for the entirety of his tenure.

Also, Pat Riley left the Knicks after the 1995 season. By the time they made the finals in 1999, with JVG leading the #8 seed, there was only one player from the previous era who was still around... and he was hurt (Ewing). And of course Riley helped influence JVG. He doesn't hide that fact or continue to sing his praises every chance he can get. Thibs, Clifford, JVG, SVG, Spoelstra all owe a ton to what Riley has taught them... and pound for pound, it is the most viable and productive coaching tree there is.

Did you really think the Mavericks were inferior to the Rockets? Hell, even the Jazz potentially had more overall talent (a young prime Derron Williams and Boozer who was a matchup nightmare for any of the Rockets bigs).... but I agree that they should have won the latter series, and I agreed at the time that they not only needed more overall talent, but they might as well see if a set of fresh eyes could get better results (even though Adelman did not get better results against that same Jazz team the following year).

Fair enough... but regardless, Rick Adelman is not walking through that door. And its still not debatable that he had less talent than the JVG teams (and you saw what happened the very next year with Adelman at the helm against the Jazz... they lost in 6).

You're comparing JVG's coaching abilities to how he handled those teams... with those players... against the competition of the time. The only thing that matters is whether or not he can get this band of merry men to give you some better results.

I suggest you go back and read... there's been enough sources (sauces) to speculate that if JVG does want to coach again, and Houston wants him, that he'd be open to listening.

JVG could have denied any and all interest at any point thus far. He's never going to openly stump for any sort of job if there's already another coach in place, or the coach hasn't been fired yet. Hence, he won't speak on his true interest for this job while the Rockets are still int he playoffs... but that wouldn't preclude him from denying any and all interest in potentially not on only coaching again, but coaching in his adopted hometown again.

 

The dude was fined $100,000...ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS....did you want him to punch a ref? Losing 100k is calm and collective? Good lord, some of you people say the darndest things.

No s#$t there was disappointment with JVG's teams. We never made it past the first round. We were always injured. And we never had any decent talent surrounding Tmac/Yao. Everyone was old and decrepit. I give JVG a ton of credit for making those teams somewhat relevant when it literally was just Tmac and Yao carrying the load.

That being said, the 04 team is one of my favorite teams since the championship days. Bobby Sura, Jon Barry, and crew.

Compare the roster talent of JVG's teams to Adelman and McHale. Those two had much better teams to work with, though I would say Yao and Tmac (when healthy) are better than Harden and Howard as a duo.

 

Probably not as talented as the Mavs previous roster, but talented enough that when spotted a 2-0 lead the a series, along with the next 3 out of 5 games being played at home, they should probably win the series at the time.


But agree to disagree about on Van Gundy I guess, I just worry this organization will squander Harden's prime as it did with McGrady and Yao at the time. I feel if they hire him to coach this team, he just might not have the interpersonal skills to connect on a deep level with superstars, and in two years Harden will be off for the Lakers due to not fulfilling the potential of the team.


I could be wrong, but giving what happened in the past with Van Gundy as Rockets coach, and all the wasted potential, I find no reason not to be cautious or skeptical about the potential of Van Gundy being hired again as the coach given that Houston has another great player.

And My fault about the calm and collective comment, I has going off the hip off of what I remember and I might have bad memory, I probably did not know, or forgot, if he did get fined all that money. Still does not chance My stance that Van Gundy was not a great coach for the Rockets, feel like there was maybe a better way to galvanize your team by going after officials during the game rather than after the game. But props to him for standing up for his players at the time.

 

"squander Harden's prime"? hahahaha. talent-wise, he's a notch below mcgrady's. dont talk like it's never been seen before.

and if you dont want/like jvg, fine. but at least provide a couple of other available names that you consider clearly better?