Sources: CP feels betrayed by Morey and Harden

SF3isBack!! · Jul 13, 2019

basketballholic said: ↑

IT HAD BETTER WORK.

Because @Clutch nailed it. We threw away our future with this move. In my opinion more in terms of relationships and doing good business more than in terms of assets and trade flexibility relinquished.

IT HAD BETTER WORK!!!

Because if it doesn't...... it might be time to put the screws to Harden and trade him to Toronto.

Remember...... what goes around.....
Click to expand...

Houston wanst going to do **** with those Picks. We were never a rebuilding team we always try to win and those picks if Morey has his way will be near worthless.

biff17 · Jul 13, 2019

jerryclark said: ↑

follow the nba and you will find out
Click to expand...

Really?

That's all you got.

Cstyle42 · Jul 13, 2019

basketballholic said: ↑

1. Harden recruited Paul. For a whole year Harden recruited Paul. All throughout the 16-17 season. Harden called him. Talked to him during Rocket/Clipper games. Talked to him during All- Star break. Harden told Paul he wanted Paul here, he needed him. They talked about sharing the basketball. They talked about roles, how they were going to play. They talked about contracts. Harden told Paul we would max him out if he opted in and asked for a trade.

They also discussed playing with other players. Specifically Kevin Durant, Paul George, Lebron James, and others (Love). Lebron and Cp3 were and are close friends. Cp3 wanted to know that Harden would be agreeable if LBJ wanted to come. Harden told him YES. Harden wanted to recruit Durant and George. Cp3 was agreeable to that.

2. After talking back and forth many many times Cp3 decided to ask the Clippers to trade him to Houston by him opting in after the season before free agency in 2018.

CP3 did this because Harden ASKED him to do it. We were not going to be able to create space to give CP3 a max contract without giving away one of Capela or Ego or including one of those two guys in a SnT after the moratorium.

So James (after consulting with Morey and being notified that signing Paul outright to a max deal in July of 2018 would cost us Eric or Clint) asked Cp3 to go to the Clippers with the opt-in trade scenario.

The Clippers wanted to keep Cp3 and had already told him they were offering him a 5- year max deal. Ballmer loved him. But Harden repeated to Cp3 what Morey had told Harden. Cp3 would not lose a dime by opting in and being traded here rather than opting out and signing a 5- year max with the Clippers.

(On a side note: If Cp3 had signed a 5-year max deal in 2017 and stayed with the Clippers he would have made a little over $200 million over 5 years, his cap hit for 2019-20 would have been $43 million, and he would be on a roster with George and Kawhi...or possibly Lebron and George. All sorts of what ifs for Cp3.)

Cp3 opted in because he was committed to James and the Rockets and he took a $16 million haircut to do it. Over the same 5 seasons he's going to make $184 million. Yes, that can be justified with lower cost of living, no state income tax, etc. if he plays out the deal in Texas. That's not the point.

3. When Cp3 approached the Clippers about the idea of an opt in and trade he informed them he was leaving and going to Houston but he was selling to the Clippers an opt trade so the Clippers could trade him and receive some value back.

But, remember the real reason. He did it this way because James asked Cp3 to do it this way so we could keep both Eric and Clint. He did it because he wanted to win by playing alongside James Harden on a team that had the assets and salary cap position to add another major piece. He did this because it represented the best chance for Paul to win a championship.

Look at the risk he took. He played on an ending contract to get here. Yes he had assurances. But in light of the what happened afterward.... what does that mean? We DUMPED him!

What if he had suffered a terrible devastating Achilles injury (like Durant just suffered) during that 17-18 season.... that would have cost him at least a year?

Do you think for one minute that we would have flipped out a 4 year max deal to Cp3 like the Nets for KD????????

The answer......... in hindsight....... is a resounding Thunderous (pun intended) ...... NO! We would have used #TwoChoppers as a convenient excuse to get out of paying Cp3 after he made the sacrifice to get here. #TwoChoppers wouldn't do it would be the excuse. And Cp3 would have been screwed out of $100+ million right there. This elf have been the narrative after we'r had basically promised hin a max deal to get him to come here.

Fast forward to today.

Cp3 BUSTED HIS BUTT for this franchise. He played hurt. He played on one leg last year against the Warriors until it finally give out!!!!

Everything Cp3 does is about winning! Talking in the huddle??? Being bold??? Pointing out bad basketball play and giving the correct solution??? It's all about winning with Cp3.

Harden knew all that. He knew what Cp3 was all about. And Harden CHOSE Cp3 to recruit him to play together. Harden can plausibly deny recruiting Dwight. He can put that off on Morey. He CANNOT deny recruiting Paul. He knew Paul's age and physical limitations when he recruited him. He knew Paul's temperament. He knew exactly how it was going to be with Paul.

Harden made commitments. And Harden bailed on his commitments. Harden is MORE bullheaded and stubborn than Chris Paul is. And his character as a man of his word is now virtually non-existent.... especially when you compare his word to Cp3's word.

So does Cp3 feel betrayed by Harden and Morey??????

Betrayed is putting it mildly. There's another word for it. Starts with an F. That's really how Cp3 feels here.

Is that important? You tell me. Harden and this organization just screwed over the president of the players union, one of the major clients of Leon Rose, and the best friend of Lebron James, who incidentally is like the vice president of the players union. Oh Iggy??? He's up there too. Heavily involved. Do you think Iggy wants to come here now??????

Go look at the list of clients of Leon Rose and Rich Paul, Lebron's agent. How do you think those agencies feel about Harden, Morey, #TwoChoppers, and the Rockets organization??????

In case you can't figure it out..... the answer is NOT GOOD!!!!

We just made a ton of enemies in the world of basketball. This hurts Morey's ability to transact and it hurts our franchises ability to attract primo free agents for the next 10 years at least. Player agents have their way of evening up the score.

That's why this deal wreaks. We'll now have to pursue a championship through trader and we'll have to worry about acquiring players that lay down on us. This was a terrible deal in terms of PR.

And yes, Paul and many other powerful NBA people are pissed at Morey, #TwoChoppers, Harden, and the Rockets about it.
Click to expand...

Lol Rondo spit in his face and Tyson Chandler signed with us hours after the deal. People understand this situation and knew CP3 was handicapping us on a contract he really shouldn't have got. Opportunity knocked and the Rockets answered the door JUST LIKE ANY OTHER ORGANIZATION WOULD HAVE DONE TO PUT THEIR ORGANIZATION IN A BETTER POSITION TO CONTEND/WIN.

Clutch City1993 · Jul 13, 2019

basketballholic said: ↑

IT HAD BETTER WORK.

Because @Clutch nailed it. We threw away our future with this move. In my opinion more in terms of relationships and doing good business more than in terms of assets and trade flexibility relinquished.

IT HAD BETTER WORK!!!

Because if it doesn't...... it might be time to put the screws to Harden and trade him to Toronto.

Remember...... what goes around.....
Click to expand...

We threw away our future when we maxed out Paul

Corpusfan · Jul 13, 2019

Once again, we see that the argument about Carmelo being a "risk-free" signing that the team could easily get out of if it didn't work, no harm done, was wrong. We're still seeing the effects of that disaster.

I do understand Paul's frustration. It's true that when he came back from injury, the gameplan had changed. Harden was coming off that amazing one-man show of 30-plus-point games and didn't want to go back to sharing the way he had in Paul's first season with the team. But that system had gotten them really close the year before. I love Harden, but I think he got a little arrogant.

It's a shame it ended this way with Chris Paul. He chose to come to Houston.

Eddie Cecco said: ↑

Hey guys, yesterday I received a lot of information and decided to share it with clutchfans.

I am going to leave here some lines so that you understand the "why" of the things that have happened.

The first sensations of discomfort appeared when Chris discovered (months later) that James played an important role in the decision to part with Carmelo. Decision in which Chris did not participate but he accepted because he understood that Carmelo, with his attitude, was not accepting the role he had proposed and this seriously complicated the chemistry of the entire team.

Fertita asked Chris to talk to Carmelo and make him see some things, Chris did, but when everything seemed to indicate that there would be an opportunity to see if Carmelo is coupled, they separate him from the squad.

Before Chris's injury, (December 20), the Rockets were playing in a way, the ball was shared more and there were more off-ball plays and player movement. After that, Harden took on a huge role and the team could never return to that formula that everyone agreed to play to win the championship. When Chris returned from that injury, he realized that the game system was different and did not have the participation he needed. A very reliable source tells me that nothing can be changed because Mike D'Antoni was very comfortable leaving everything in Harden's hands.

After the season ends for the team, and as has been seen, Chris and James have their differences, the guys go on vacation and someone close to the organization expands the rumor that Chris wants to leave Houston, according to a very reliable source, this rumor was installed "from inside" to check CPs market.

After denying this rumor, Chris had a meeting with Daryl, who assures him that he will not be traded and that he does not know where the rumors come from. They organize a meeting between him, Chris, Tilman and James when James returns from his European commercial tour.

One day before the transfer, Chris is informed that Westbrook was at the door and that his name was on the table.

The trade happens.

Greetings to all, have a nice day.
Click to expand...

HP3 · Jul 13, 2019

Reeko said: ↑

a ton of people didn’t even like CP before he came here, and he was only here for 2 years, so people aren’t attached to him

he was injured often, declined heavily, and his contract was an albatross...it’s not surprising that many aren’t singing his praises on his way out
Click to expand...

Who cares about what they thought about him before, that one year he was year is one of the greatest seasons in Rockets history, regular season and post season.

Ahhhh here we go all the negative crap, he was also a great floor general, a clutch player, a great TEAM defensive player(you could see how much our defense got better with him on the court) a great guy for the community. Im sorry i expected people to show a little respect god.

Reeko · Jul 13, 2019

HP3 said: ↑

Who cares about what they thought about him before, that one year he was year is one of the greatest seasons in Rockets history, regular season and post season.

Ahhhh here we go all the negative crap, he was also a great floor general, a clutch player, a great TEAM defensive player(you could see how much our defense got better with him on the court) a great guy for the community. Im sorry i expected people to show a little respect god.
Click to expand...

I’m simply telling u the reality...it is what it is

SF3isBack!! · Jul 13, 2019

HP3 said: ↑

LOL whatever bro, you dedicate yourself to a team and community and within a matter of moments you are somewhere else. Harden was emotional when he got traded too. I love how you arm chair gms are very understanding that this is a business Again the trade wasnt inherently wrong, it was how it was done.

God man.
Click to expand...

Doesnt that make you an armchair GM as well. I dont see anything wrong about this trade. Ofcourse he's mad a team didnt want him but thats all he should be mad about.

biff17 · Jul 13, 2019

basketballholic said: ↑

1. Harden recruited Paul. For a whole year Harden recruited Paul. All throughout the 16-17 season. Harden called him. Talked to him during Rocket/Clipper games. Talked to him during All- Star break. Harden told Paul he wanted Paul here, he needed him. They talked about sharing the basketball. They talked about roles, how they were going to play. They talked about contracts. Harden told Paul we would max him out if he opted in and asked for a trade.

They also discussed playing with other players. Specifically Kevin Durant, Paul George, Lebron James, and others (Love). Lebron and Cp3 were and are close friends. Cp3 wanted to know that Harden would be agreeable if LBJ wanted to come. Harden told him YES. Harden wanted to recruit Durant and George. Cp3 was agreeable to that.

2. After talking back and forth many many times Cp3 decided to ask the Clippers to trade him to Houston by him opting in after the season before free agency in 2018.

CP3 did this because Harden ASKED him to do it. We were not going to be able to create space to give CP3 a max contract without giving away one of Capela or Ego or including one of those two guys in a SnT after the moratorium.

So James (after consulting with Morey and being notified that signing Paul outright to a max deal in July of 2018 would cost us Eric or Clint) asked Cp3 to go to the Clippers with the opt-in trade scenario.

The Clippers wanted to keep Cp3 and had already told him they were offering him a 5- year max deal. Ballmer loved him. But Harden repeated to Cp3 what Morey had told Harden. Cp3 would not lose a dime by opting in and being traded here rather than opting out and signing a 5- year max with the Clippers.

(On a side note: If Cp3 had signed a 5-year max deal in 2017 and stayed with the Clippers he would have made a little over $200 million over 5 years, his cap hit for 2019-20 would have been $43 million, and he would be on a roster with George and Kawhi...or possibly Lebron and George. All sorts of what ifs for Cp3.)

Cp3 opted in because he was committed to James and the Rockets and he took a $16 million haircut to do it. Over the same 5 seasons he's going to make $184 million. Yes, that can be justified with lower cost of living, no state income tax, etc. if he plays out the deal in Texas. That's not the point.

3. When Cp3 approached the Clippers about the idea of an opt in and trade he informed them he was leaving and going to Houston but he was selling to the Clippers an opt trade so the Clippers could trade him and receive some value back.

But, remember the real reason. He did it this way because James asked Cp3 to do it this way so we could keep both Eric and Clint. He did it because he wanted to win by playing alongside James Harden on a team that had the assets and salary cap position to add another major piece. He did this because it represented the best chance for Paul to win a championship.

Look at the risk he took. He played on an ending contract to get here. Yes he had assurances. But in light of the what happened afterward.... what does that mean? We DUMPED him!

What if he had suffered a terrible devastating Achilles injury (like Durant just suffered) during that 17-18 season.... that would have cost him at least a year?

Do you think for one minute that we would have flipped out a 4 year max deal to Cp3 like the Nets for KD????????

The answer......... in hindsight....... is a resounding Thunderous (pun intended) ...... NO! We would have used #TwoChoppers as a convenient excuse to get out of paying Cp3 after he made the sacrifice to get here. #TwoChoppers wouldn't do it would be the excuse. And Cp3 would have been screwed out of $100+ million right there. This elf have been the narrative after we'r had basically promised hin a max deal to get him to come here.

Fast forward to today.

Cp3 BUSTED HIS BUTT for this franchise. He played hurt. He played on one leg last year against the Warriors until it finally give out!!!!

Everything Cp3 does is about winning! Talking in the huddle??? Being bold??? Pointing out bad basketball play and giving the correct solution??? It's all about winning with Cp3.

Harden knew all that. He knew what Cp3 was all about. And Harden CHOSE Cp3 to recruit him to play together. Harden can plausibly deny recruiting Dwight. He can put that off on Morey. He CANNOT deny recruiting Paul. He knew Paul's age and physical limitations when he recruited him. He knew Paul's temperament. He knew exactly how it was going to be with Paul.

Harden made commitments. And Harden bailed on his commitments. Harden is MORE bullheaded and stubborn than Chris Paul is. And his character as a man of his word is now virtually non-existent.... especially when you compare his word to Cp3's word.

So does Cp3 feel betrayed by Harden and Morey??????

Betrayed is putting it mildly. There's another word for it. Starts with an F. That's really how Cp3 feels here.

Is that important? You tell me. Harden and this organization just screwed over the president of the players union, one of the major clients of Leon Rose, and the best friend of Lebron James, who incidentally is like the vice president of the players union. Oh Iggy??? He's up there too. Heavily involved. Do you think Iggy wants to come here now??????

Go look at the list of clients of Leon Rose and Rich Paul, Lebron's agent. How do you think those agencies feel about Harden, Morey, #TwoChoppers, and the Rockets organization??????

In case you can't figure it out..... the answer is NOT GOOD!!!!

We just made a ton of enemies in the world of basketball. This hurts Morey's ability to transact and it hurts our franchises ability to attract primo free agents for the next 10 years at least. Player agents have their way of evening up the score.

That's why this deal wreaks. We'll now have to pursue a championship through trader and we'll have to worry about acquiring players that lay down on us. This was a terrible deal in terms of PR.

And yes, Paul and many other powerful NBA people are pissed at Morey, #TwoChoppers, Harden, and the Rockets about it.
Click to expand...

Dude you are in fantasy land.

Do you ever get tired of making **** up?

https://www.clipsnation.com/2017/6/...itted-to-offering-chris-paul-max-deal-rockets

https://nba.nbcsports.com/2017/06/2...d-to-offer-chris-paul-five-year-max-contract/

All of those words and you are dead ass wrong.

ApacheWarrior · Jul 13, 2019

I believe CP3 did not like the way the Melo situation took place by all parties involved. I don’t know if Harden was
involved, but I did see CP3 post up on the left block (facing rim) several times in the following games as a
show of defiance......like saying, “Melo could be doing this!”

Both CP3 and Harden slow the Pace too much this past season: Harden because the Rockets (Harden) force a
switch, that mismatch (say Curry) escapes the switch, so the Rockets have to reset the screen again.....then
dribble, dribble, dribble to get past said mismatch. Sometimes Harden just needs to go after the first screen
as the mismatch player is escaping the switch (and scrambling away), attack.

CP3 needs to set up a half court set predominantly and slow things down because he can not handle the
fast Pace of most of today’s NBA. Age-related deficiency that Westbrook probably gives us more of a sped
up Pace for greater length of time.

Greater Pace, equates to more opportunities and hopefully negates the less efficient Westbrook. Westbrook
surrounding cast (of main perimeter shooters) in the regular season shot 33% from 3, while the
Rockets (CP3) surrounding cast (of main perimeter shooters) shot 36% from 3 (minus Gary Clark stat).
Westbrook had a great Ast% (assists) with less quality perimeter shooters. Now with Houston should
have an uptick. Takes two to tango or have an assist.

Sorry to lose CP3 and I respect him a great deal; but the NBA has changed and favors the faster pace, imo.

TEXNIFICENT · Jul 13, 2019

kjayp said: ↑

no disrespect... but yer talkin out yer a$$ if u dont think CP3 coulda pulled a max deal 2 years ago... mightve even been a 5 year deal instead of 4... look at all the stupid contracts getting handed out...
Now it might've been a lesser market or lesser team... but I'm confident the contract woulda been there...
I agree that Houston was prob the best option for the contract and staying relevant and chance to win a championship... thats why he lost money by opting in for the last year... but dont fault the guy for taking what Murray was offering - and then holding him to it!
...
Click to expand...

https://www.clipsnation.com/2017/6/...itted-to-offering-chris-paul-max-deal-rockets

https://nba.nbcsports.com/2017/06/2...d-to-offer-chris-paul-five-year-max-contract/

LorneMalvo · Jul 13, 2019

roslolian said: ↑

Harden is not god but guess what **** for brains, he is the franchise player. What kind of moronic team sides with another dude vs their franchise player?

Just because everyone knows more motion needs to be done in the offense doesnt mean you challenge Harden in front of everyone else and tell the coach to sit his ass down. Cp3 forgot his place, forgot that Harden is the one who brought him here and gave him another chance to compete for a title after he fcked up in NO and in LA. More importantly instead of challenging Harden he should've worked on his game more, lost more weight and maintained his quickness and health. A leader is supposed to LEAD the change and not tell others to change for him. If he was scoring lights out instead of missing 1/4 the season due to injury and playing like trash in the playoffs then Harden would've listened to him.
Click to expand...

Harden is a loser then. Franchise is not doing **** with this guy over the likes of LBJ/Curry/Kawhi.
Have fun with that because we all know its true. At least now with probably the only other supposed star in the entire NBA with lower substance than Harden right next to him.

Challenging these morons to improve the offense should not be a thing of taking sides. And dont feel profound with that shitty leader is supposed to lead quote, stupid. Absolute bullshit that means nothing.

roslolian · Jul 13, 2019

LorneMalvo said: ↑

Harden is a loser then. Franchise is not doing **** with this guy over the likes of LBJ/Curry/Kawhi.
Have fun with that because we all know its true. At least now with probably the only other supposed star in the entire NBA with lower substance than Harden right next to him.

Challenging these morons to improve the offense should not be a thing of taking sides. And dont feel profound with that shitty leader is supposed to lead quote, stupid. Absolute bullshit that means nothing.
Click to expand...

Well then go root for LA then wtf are you still doing here?

Also a leader leading by example is not BS, it's true everywhere you go whether that's corporate or sports. But I wouldnt expect you know that cuz all you know is to whine that James Harden isnt LBJ.

Seriously who are you to call a multi millionaire a loser? You might be up to your ears in debt but still calling other people a loser lmao

LorneMalvo · Jul 13, 2019

roslolian said: ↑

Well then go root for LA then wtf are you still doing here?

Also a leader leading by example is not BS, it's true everywhere you go whether that's corporare or sports. But I wouldnt expect you know that cuz all you know is to whine that James Harden isnt LBJ.
Click to expand...

How in the **** does he lead by example, stupid? Hijacking the offense?

He was already calling plays off-ball quite a bit.

The actual powerful and leadership are dumb career losers in D’Antoni and Harden. That’s the problem.

DaonlyLA · Jul 13, 2019

He Betrayed himself with the Antics!

Nook · Jul 13, 2019

ThatBoyNick said: ↑

People will talk **** but I don’t feel good about how we did CP3. Felt like the dude just got here, felt like he was going to retire a Rocket. He left LA for us, brought his family over and had long term plans here.

What I want to know @Eddie Cecco, there was a rumor by shams I believe that CP3 met with Morey and said he’d be okay with being moved, but isn’t demanding a trade and is fine with staying as well. More then told him he was staying for sure and they they were going to build with him.

Is the part of him going to the FO saying he’s okay with being moved true at all?
Click to expand...

Yeah that was before Westbrook fell from the sky for Paul and two first round picks.

tc0330 · Jul 13, 2019

Clutch City1993 said: ↑

We felt betrayed when he took the max and financially crippled us. I thought it was about rings
Click to expand...

a-f*cking-men

tc0330 · Jul 13, 2019

i got 40 million reasons why i dont feel bad for him.

ickaruto · Jul 13, 2019

I just don't want Morey's name sullied within NBA players circle ...

That sh*t is bad for business.

rocketchamp · Jul 13, 2019

Heres the problem. The Rockets were better when CP ran the offense. The flow was better, and everybody got shots. Guys like Faried, EG & Green got off. So I understand exactly what CP's gripe was. James doesn't really run the offense or hit guys when they're open. All CP was saying is let's get others involved, because it makes us harder to guard. But ofcourse MDA & James ignored him & it cost us a series

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