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Some annoying/concerning tendencies of the Adelman offense

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Nitro1118, Dec 25, 2007.

  1. Nitro1118

    Nitro1118 Member

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    Note- This is NOT a bashing thread. I personally feel that we DO have the right pieces on this team (although an upgrade at PG would be great) to get things done, including players and coaches alike. This thread is for me to vent some frustration about the motion offense/Adelman's coaching and some annoying trends I see nearly 30 games into the season.

    1) Wen T-Mac is hot...get him the damn ball. I am sick of him starting off 5-6 or 5-7 (Philly, 2nd Detroit game, Nets, etc..) then the team completely go away from him or Adelman benches him. I understand the reasoning...this is a motion offense, and when T-mac is running iso after iso it stagnates the offense. This is fine, but when a streak scorer like T-Mac is hot and he can drop 50pts in any game, he must be milked until he gets cold, which happens if you stop feeding him the ball or bench him. If we do not use his streak scoring to our advantage, then he is an expendable player.

    2) On the point of T-Mac, he MUST be used in iso's on the wing or off ball. When you force him to run the pick and roll 28ft out or make him take the ball up the floor, it just encourages bad shots for him to take. If you give him the ball18ft out with driving lanes open on both sides, shooting %'s will dramatically increase (as seen with his 47% shooting before Adelman started using last year's sets, which happenned right around when he first got injured).

    3) Scola has to be given more offensive freedom. He must have plays ran for him. He is a highly skilled player who can take it to the rim, post up, hit the midrange jumpshot and make nice passes. He must be given more touches in both the low and high post.

    4) Mike James has to be given more PT as a SG. He simply cannot run the offense, but if he is given open 3s from the corner or the ball in situations he can take it to the rim, he can be deadly. He simply is not selfless enough to be PG.

    5) Yao has to get the ball a lot during the game, but you can't force it down there. Like with T-mac, this can stagnate your offense, and unlike T-Mac it will often result in an offensive foul or TO. Use Yao as a high % offensive weapon rather than an option you must force throughout the game.

    6) One playmaker always must remain on the floor...the offense goes to hell without T-mac or Rafer on the floor. I have not seen Brooks enough as primary ballhandler/playmaker to make a case for him being in the starting lineup, but Franics/James don't cut it at PG.

    7) Stop using Battier as a post player, or 3pt shooter from the top of the arc...he is a great spotup 3pt shooter from the corners...that's IT! He simply cannot shoot from straightaway, and he is a TO machine when he puts the ball on the floor.

    8) Use Landry more, possibly in front of Hayes. He gives you the hustle of Hayes but can actually finish strong at the rim from passes by T-Mac...he needs to be used more.

    9) USE MORE SET PLAYS!!! If you watch the Lakers, you will see they have he same basic sets leading to the actual plays being ran that the Rockets do, but unlike the Rockets they have actual plays to use out of those sets, while the Rockets are often all over the place. Eventually the offense will be ran off instincts, but that is months down the road...when Adelman has used set plays with his offensive templates of the basic triangle offense, the offense has looked crisp and accurate.


    That's about all.
     
  2. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    Regarding Battier, he's actually shooting worse from the corners (either side) than any other spot above the arc.

    left corner: 7-22 (31.8%)
    left wing: 11-26 (42.3%)
    top: 5-10 (50%)
    right wing: 15-36 (41.7%)
    right corner: 13-37 (35.1%)

    See for yourself and google nba hot spots.

    You seem to be saying that we need to get the ball to Tracy, Yao, Mike, and Scola more. There's only one ball, unfortunately. And Landry's defense is so awful, I don't see him getting extended minutes anytime soon. I thought it was a mistake that he played so much against Toronto.
     
  3. cjstukenholtz

    cjstukenholtz Member

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    There are games in which the motion offense isn't even there. The players need to play it consistently in every game. Too many times, it's three players just standing around and just watching Yao and T-Mac doing their thing with the basketball, which just makes it easy for the team's opponent to defend.

    In order for that offense to be played consistently, the players need to not have lapses of being lazy.
     
  4. YugoRocketsFan

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    I have to agree with all of these, great post.
     
  5. pryuen

    pryuen Contributing Member

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    May I ask how often is he that hot ?? :rolleyes:

    The problem with TMAC even when he is healthy and not injured is that very often he requires alot of shot attempts before he finds his feel and rhythm.

    And we can't afford having him to score 1/10 FG% by half time, and then erupts towards 3Q or 4Q to end up with him scoring 25 to 30 points (10/30 FG%) but losing the game.

    He has recently be acknowledged as a certified national professional ironsmith in China for continuously clanking iron !! :D


    [​IMG]
     
  6. Yetti

    Yetti Contributing Member

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    Since the first couple of games I have been unaware of any motion offense!!
    Regarding set plays, very difficult when players do not even know their roles and the direction/character of the team.
    Coach needs to go back to fundamentals and present his plan for the team, it will help the players, management and fans. :p
     
    #6 Yetti, Dec 26, 2007
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2007
  7. KeepKenny

    KeepKenny Contributing Member

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    I'm annoyed when Tmac is on the floor, and we just run repeated isos for him, and everyone else stands around and watches.

    Then, when he sits out, we get tons of ball movement and go on a run.

    Then, when he comes back, it's the Tmac iso offense again. At least when we run the pick and roll he gets other guys some shots.

    Sure, the iso offense looks good when he's hot, but I'm not convinced that it gives us the best shot to win.
     
  8. MayoRocket

    MayoRocket Contributing Member

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    I think his point was that when McGrady starts off really hot, keep feeding him until he starts missing. I'd do the same thing for Yao. If Yao is beasting then keep dumping it down low. If not, bring him out and run the motion offense.

    By the way, what certificate do you get in China for getting the ball stripped from you game after game by scrubs? ;)
     
  9. jump shooter

    jump shooter Contributing Member

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    Durvasa, how can you possibly say Landry's defense is awfull when he's only played 17 minutes for the season. Even rookies screw up and if given some regular minutes you know Landry will settle down.
     
  10. AroundTheWorld

    AroundTheWorld Insufferable 98er
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    Wasn't that different last year? I think he was most effective from the corners.
     
  11. Nitro1118

    Nitro1118 Member

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    Very often. In the past 2-3 weeks he has started off on fire against Philly, Detroit (2nd game) and NJ...starting off 5-6, 5-7 and 7-10 respectively. Then Adelman would take him out for the first 6min of the 2nd quarter, and the rest of the game the team would get away from him. When he is hot, keep him on the floor and milk him for a 25pt+ half. When you have that ype of talent on your team, you use it to its fullest.

    durvasa-

    Interesting stats on Battier...seems to be a huge contrast to what I am seeing on the TV. Thanks for posting that.

    Oh, and I am saying not necessarily that T-Mac, James and Scola need the ball more, but they need to be used differently. Instead of using T-Mac as primary playmaker and a guy to be ran off pick and roll after pick and roll, he should purely be used in iso situations or off ball like he was before the elbow injury where he was averaging 29PPG on 47% shooting. For James, I feel he should simply be moved from PG to SG, where he is most effective. And for Scola, instead of simply wandering around and being a freelancer, he should be having some set plays ran for him.
     
  12. TeamUSA

    TeamUSA Member

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    The problem with Tmac's offense is it's so damn PREDICTABLE.

    So when he is hot it's ok. But it's very rare to get hot in the last minutes when D is all over him.

    We should use more team plays in the fourth Q to break the D. PERIOD.
     
  13. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    We need Tmac to play off the ball and buy into the everyone touches it system...

    Then all will be better.

    DD
     
  14. Nitro1118

    Nitro1118 Member

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    If it was so predictable than guys like Artest, AK-47 and Prince wouldn't always get burned by T-Mac, no matter what time in the game it is. Next to Kobe and maybe Bron (due to lack of consistent jumper), no one is as difficult to guard as T-Mac. Perfect example is the Detroit game...he starts off taking simple jumpers over Prince which are virtually unblockable, then takes the ball to the rim and finishes with his left hand, runs the floor for a dunk, and then because Prince had been torched with T-Mac's jumper before, he buys on the pump fake and T-mac drives right past him and gets to the FT line. Outside of Kobe no one in the league is as well rounded as a scorer.

    I also feel at the end of games ball movement is key, which is why I loved the end of the 1st Pistons game...T-mac running off ball, Yao getting the ball on the block, etc.. It wasn't people standing and watching T-Mac, they were keeping the defense guessing with the off ball movement. But, when T-Mac is hot, especially at the start of games, he needs to be milked for all he is worth
     
  15. Nitro1118

    Nitro1118 Member

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    He DOES buy into the system...he was FLOURISHING in it the first 8 games of the season. It wasn't until Adelman went to the old JVG set plays (to promote better team ball movement) did he, and the team, start struggling.

    But, you can't just run T-Mac off ball...that is not taking full advantage of your best player's abilities.
     
  16. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

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    I've seen him play in regular season and preseason. His defense looked bad in both cases. I can only judge based on what I've seen. Maybe Adelman is seeing something different in practice.

    And, as you say, rookies screw up. They tend to not be good defenders. That's why they usually don't play much, particularly on non-lottery bound teams.

    Landry has some nice offensive skills, though nothing that differentiates him much from Scola. Compared to Chuck, I don't think you gain enough offensively to make up for the defensive drop off. Chuck plays a critical role in our team defense. When you lack mobile defenders in 2 of your other 4 positions (Yao and McGrady), it pays to have a PF who can cover ground quickly and make smart decisions defensively.
     
  17. TeamUSA

    TeamUSA Member

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    It is indeed virtually impossible to guard Tmac with his jumpers because of his height advantage and jumpbing ability. But that itself proves my point of being predictable. He likes to jumpshot over his opp.

    About "When he's hot give them the damn ball". I completely disagree with you on this. This is not good forthe team. We should at all times play as a team. except during desperate time like the SA game.

    One thing that I like LJ last night is he seeks first for his teammate to score. And KOBE has been doing the same thing recently. And they still manage to average 20+ a game.

    I don't want tracy to score 20 points in the first quarter and then stay quiet in teh remaining periods. That's sick. I want tracy as playmaker to take advantage of the doubleteaming and pass to the open man. Then if it's too late, he can still shoot over his man.
     
  18. Nitro1118

    Nitro1118 Member

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    As does Kobe, as does Arenas, as does Carter, and more and more LeBron is becoming a jumpshooter (over 4 3PA a game for him). But T-Mac's versatility to how he can get his jumper off (fadeaways, pullup jumpshot, etc...) and how he can get himself space to get himself a quality shot is what really seperates him from the 2nd tier of perimiter scorers in the league (Kevin Martin, brandon Roy, etc..).

    I am not saying let T-Mac go all Kobe of 05-06 over the defense and take 40+ shots, but if he is hot milk the hot hand until he starts missing a shot or two. Phil Jackson, who has won 9 rings in the last 16 years, would always give MJ, Kobe and Shaq the green light to shoot whatever they wanted to when they got hot. If you have as dangerous of a weapon as T-Mac, you have to use him where he is at his best, which is streak scoring. If all you are going to do is use him as a playmaker, then he is a very expendable player.

    T-Mac does the same when you ask him to. Last year JVG wanted him more as a playmaker and a second scoring option, and he averaged a career high 6.5APG and led the league in usage rating. But, it didn't translate into playoff success, which is what you should expect when you try and transform a 6'9'' natural scorer into a do-it-all playmaker.

    And BTW, while those 2 have been looking for their teammates, they also average more FGA than T-Mac. Not to mention they have had teams that have been together for 2+ years now with coaches they have had for 2+ years...in other words, consistency in coaching and teammates production is very steady.

    I agree, you don't want T-Mac hot in the first quarter than do nothing. To keep him hot, you can't bench him for the first 6min of the 2nd quarter and start getting away from him on the offensive end like the Rockets have done a lot of this season.

    And again, if all you are going to use him for is to draw double teams and get the occasional basket, then he is a very expendable player. He it too great a talent to minimize his greatest attributes like that.
     
  19. TeamUSA

    TeamUSA Member

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    Well, if you have Yao on your team, you're not going to , or should not, get a lot of FGA than a one-man superstar. But it's too close.
     
  20. jump shooter

    jump shooter Contributing Member

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    Agree with you completely on Chuck, but I've seen Landry in college and he's a pretty effecient defender. When you've never played any real minutes in the league as a rookie like Landry has, you tend to enter the game all scattered brain and not cognizant of your surroundings when all the adrenline is pumping. Landry is probably pound for pound the strongest and one of the best athletes on the team and I definetly see him in the rockets future. Wouldn't surprise me if he's the starting PF next season.
     

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