Serge Ibaka traded to Toronto for Terrence Ross and 1st round pick

This is my sentiment exactly. Harden won't have MVP-caliber seasons every year, and with so many variables like injuries and team chemistry that are constantly at play, you can't keep kicking the can down the road hoping that one year it will all come together. Make hay while the sun shines, as they say. Right now, this is a team that can EASILY nab the 2 seed with a little more help on the roster, AND has the capability of hanging with the Warriors in a 7 game series due to our system and our shooting. But, we won't ever know unless we're willing to make a move that will bolster us RIGHT NOW. I'm not saying we need to overpay or get fleeced on a deal for a 2nd fiddle, but we need to be willing to make a move that will get us over the hump.

 

Like I said, I'm not mad they didn't get Ibaka. I'm actually not on the big man train to begin with. This is more in general about Morey's philosophy. We NEVER go all in. I've justified it in the past and I get why it makes sense, but sooner or later the game is over.

 

I follow Toronto ,,, 2nd favorite team with all the ex-rockets in recent years. It is an injury. He did not fall out of the rotation.

They are 10-14 since he first had the knee injury (a bone bruise/stinger). For the last month, what you read about in quotes is frustration over not being able to play their full rotation much.

They know how important he is. Remember, he was Team Captain here. He is a glue guy. Actually was Top 5 in the league in ORtg before the injury. Toronto loves PPatt. Now, whether or not they'd rather keep Ross is not what I am referring to in your post. Point is: They will continue to play PPatt now. He hasn't fallen out of the rotation, by any stretch.

 

This. Some organizations are just destined to be second rate. The Orlando Magic are a great example.

Biggest takeaway here: DM could have easily beaten Ross/1st, so you have to believe we didn't value him that highly.

 

what the hell out there we need to go all in? If not Ibaka, Plumlee?

and what the hell we can offer to go all in? Corey Brewer?

 

Actually what's stupid is what you're even saying here. How is it weak to say the Rockets aren't gonna win it this year? You yourself admitted they have 4 future HOF on the squad, how is Ibaka going to be the difference maker against that line up? Ibaka+Harden>KD+Iggy+Klay+Curry+Green? It's dumb to overpay for an asset that is gonna be a free agent in 6 mos, especially if Ibaka alone won't get it done. Of course anything can happen, maybe GSW's team bus gets in an accident and everybody dies. But what's the chance of that happening, maybe 1%? Most likely scenario is trading for Ibaka this year won't do anything, but the Rox give up major assets for a guy they can sign in the summer.

Do you even know why Ibaka ended up on the Magic? Because Rob Hannigan had the same mentality as you did, Orlando is still young and have amassed a pretty good young core the past couple of years, everybody knows they're not gonna do anything amazing this year but Hannigan thought maybe Orlando can get hot and sneak into the playoffs. Cleveland could get an injury. Orlando can get hot and knock out other teams to rise in the standings etc. It's like Dumb and Dumber scene where somebody tells you there's very little chance Orlando will do anything in the playoffs and Hannigan went "but there is a chance!" and traded Oladipo and a lottery draft pick for Ibaka. Well one year later we find out Orlando just gave Oladipo and a lottery pick for Ross and a low 1st rounder. And Hannigan could end up fired by the end of this season, and all because he had the same "all in" mentality you have.

Hoping for the best is just a dumb strategy, if that's your plan then why get a GM at all? When you do a trade you should have an expected result out of it, if the most likely result is it does nothing but you hope for the best then why do it? You reference last year as the rationale but honestly the main reason the Rockets ****ed up last year was because they went all in and hoped for the best, like you wanted them to do now. The year prior this the Rox just reached WCF, but in their matchup against GSW they got their ass handed to them 1-4. In retrospect Morey should have realized the Rockets were still too weak to do anything, but because of the WCF appearance he decided to go all in and hope for the best. He kept around the vets like Terry, JSmith and even Brewer to a 7M contract even if those guys were starting to play bad at the end of the year. Then he traded a 1st pick for Ty Lawson. We all know how that ended. If Morey just stuck to the plan then maybe we wouldn't be burned so badly, at the very least we'll still have our pick to use and help the team.

The Rox are not championship contenders but they made good progress this year. If you keep everyone on the team and add somebody in the offseason, then at the very worst you'll still get the same team this year which is a 3rd seed in the west and at best you seriously upgrade the team with a key acquisition. That's literally a no risk high reward move. On the other hand, if we give up assets to trade for Ibaka and it doesn't work out or Ibaka wants too much money then the Rockets just took a step back because they lost assets for nothing. Your strategy only makes sense if the NBA will shut down after this season. Since the NBA will still go on next year, it's dumb to take two steps back tom just so you can take 1 step forward now. I'm not against any trades but at this point they should be done only if they will 100% upgrade the team.

 

You assigned thoughts to me that I did not express so I'm not going to bother responding to you with a thought out post.

 

We get killed on the boards every time we play. A double team on anyone will be very hard when you have millsap waiting for the ball in the post.

 

Brewer or KJ + filler. They need some help on the wing... Brewer is help in a way.

 

Dude you must be drunk to even try to connect the Raptors sliding of late had anything to do with Ppat.

Its like saying the Rockets were playing bad defense in the last month because of Kyle Wiltjer had little to none playing time during that stretch.

 

Well CRAP...seems we could have matched or beaten that.

DD

 

We were in the same position a few years ago. James Harden changed all that. The value of Ibaka went down because of the uncertainty of where he'd sign. Orlando thought they'd have a better chance at keeping him than they did. If they had a Harden-type player on their team that would have changed everything. It's hard to get out of that hole when there are only so many superstars in the league..

 

Going all in to me means targeting players who will upgrade actual minutes, not just warm bodies. I'm not asking them to overpay for Ibaka. Depth players who can take Brewer's minutes would be good enough for me, but my definition of depth means someone who's actually better than Brewer, not just someone's scrub like a Tyler Ennis. Actual players that can contribute.

 

You don't understand the raptors dynamic very well then. He has been a leader of that team. Great chemistry guy and has been the glue of that team. His Ortg was the league's best for a good while until he got hurt. That doesn't happen by accident.

He absolutely is important and it is a reason why they have struggled

 

Well i understand that, but as today there're just few "major" upgrades available, and some teams have just more/better assets so it's not going to be easy in the first place...for minor upgrades yeah, i think Morey is doing some work and will eventually make something happen, but a PJ Tucker or a Andrew Bogut (those are the kind of player i think we can trade for) are not going to change our season that much anyway, that's why i'm not going to be mad if nothing will happen.

 

I'm glad you mentioned Dekker, Capela, and Harrell bc it took each of them at least 2 years to contribute which is back to my point. You have a Harden in his prime who you can't surround with rooks bc it's clear that we are def in a win now mode so yes let's hope something shakes up but I highly doubt DM trades those picks anyway which is what bothers me bc you can't rely on rooks to get you to the promise land UNLESS you're content with starting over which in this case we aren't. Trade the stupid picks and build a championship team bc we def as we stand we are not one.

 

<blockquote class="instagram-media" data-instgrm-captioned data-instgrm-version="7" style=" background:#FFF; border:0; border-radius:3px; box-shadow:0 0 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.5),0 1px 10px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.15); margin: 1px; max-width:658px; padding:0; width:99.375%; width:-webkit-calc(100% - 2px); width:calc(100% - 2px);"><div style="padding:8px;"> <div style=" background:#F8F8F8; line-height:0; margin-top:40px; padding:50.0% 0; text-align:center; width:100%;"> <div style=" background:url(data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAACwAAAAsCAMAAAApWqozAAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAAAFzUkdCAK7OHOkAAAAMUExURczMzPf399fX1+bm5mzY9AMAAADiSURBVDjLvZXbEsMgCES5/P8/t9FuRVCRmU73JWlzosgSIIZURCjo/ad+EQJJB4Hv8BFt+IDpQoCx1wjOSBFhh2XssxEIYn3ulI/6MNReE07UIWJEv8UEOWDS88LY97kqyTliJKKtuYBbruAyVh5wOHiXmpi5we58Ek028czwyuQdLKPG1Bkb4NnM+VeAnfHqn1k4+GPT6uGQcvu2h2OVuIf/gWUFyy8OWEpdyZSa3aVCqpVoVvzZZ2VTnn2wU8qzVjDDetO90GSy9mVLqtgYSy231MxrY6I2gGqjrTY0L8fxCxfCBbhWrsYYAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC); display:block; height:44px; margin:0 auto -44px; position:relative; top:-22px; width:44px;"></div></div> <p style=" margin:8px 0 0 0; padding:0 4px;"> <a href="" style=" color:#000; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; line-height:17px; text-decoration:none; word-wrap:break-word;" target="_blank">Thanks for all the love, I&#39;ll miss playing for Canada&#39;s team. Thanks to the team, the coaches, the city, and the country. Thanks for all the memories and the fun I&#39;ve had. Ready to take that next step.</a></p> <p style=" color:#c9c8cd; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; line-height:17px; margin-bottom:0; margin-top:8px; overflow:hidden; padding:8px 0 7px; text-align:center; text-overflow:ellipsis; white-space:nowrap;">A post shared by Terrence Ross (@3tross1) on <time style=" font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; line-height:17px;" datetime="2017-02-14T17:05:27+00:00">Feb 14, 2017 at 9:05am PST</time></p></div></blockquote> <script async defer src="//platform.instagram.com/en_US/embeds.js"></script>

 

It's fascinating to me

Don't make excuses for them. Oladipo had a much better chance at developing into this Harden level player than Ibaka does. This trade is the end result of a previous bad trade. A total swing & miss on part of Orlando management that will likely cost Hennigan his job.

Ibaka is what he is: a finished product, 14-7 player that plays basically like a poor man's LaMarcus Aldridge. In the right situation, he could be very valuable. But a franchise player? Not a chance.

 

Where I disagree is that I think Brewer being replaced with someone who can be counted on to make a 3 can be the difference in a playoff game.

On the bigs issue I think unless you are getting someone better than Capela it's hard to get worked up.

 

We went all in last year... didn't really pay off.