ugh, i think they have "insiders" info too. it's not like the rest of the NBA is oblivious to what is going on with the tmac situation. if anything, they have a more negative interpretation with what's being reported. so his value can't be any lower. it can only go up, and the only way it can go up is if he plays. if he doesn't, his value is what it is: an expiring contract.
I can definitely understand the logic about Tmac laying in the bed he made, and the fact that him coming in here not completely healthy might not be a good idea, but the concept of T-mac being a ballstopping dominating dude is annoying and frankly downright wrong. Most guards are either off the ball guys or dominating guys. You have your Rip Hamilton, Peja Stojakovic and Mike Miller. On the other hand you have your Kobe, LBJ, Dwade and Chris Paul. All of those guys dominate the ball. The difference is whether your dominating is hurting the team offense or not. Guys like Kobe do indeed hog the ball, but they give the rock up when someone is in a better position to score. On the other hand guys like AI have no concept of team offense at all, they hog the ball even if a pass would result in a higher percentage shot. We all know Tmac is one of the better playmaking guards in the league, so this whole "Tmac will ruin chemistry/bog the offense" doesn't make sense at all. If LBJ comes here, would any of you actually create a thread asking him to change his game and become an off the ball player? I think not
Exactly, I think people don't realize he was injured all last season, but im sure people didn't complain when he was healthy and surrounded by guys like david wesley, head, alston, weatherspoon etc.
A great comparison, because Tracy McGrady and LeBron James, at this stage in their careers, have the same amount of talent, and neither is more injury prone than the other. :grin:
Yeah, I am tired of the same old arguments...and them going nowhere. If he plays, he plays, if he sits, he sits.... DD
Finally, I mean people can't predict his future playing or his future with the Rockets. If he plays, he plays, if he sits, he sits. That's the right idea, all we have to do is wait and see what happens.
I don't think it would hurt. I still have a soft spot for T-mac. I guess i still appreciate the good things he has done and the excitement her brought here. Sure he has made his share of mistakes, but he is still a Houston Rocket and I support him still
disagree. you keep pointing to this statement that "microfracture was always an option", whereas in reality, microfracture is always an option for any athlete that has cartilage damage in his knees. microfracture surgery is used to create scar tissue on the bone surface to take the place of cartilage that has been worn down, removed, or destroyed. the mri's that tracy got on his knee didnt reveal it to be necessary, because the "lesion" on the knee was very very small, and shouldn't have been the kind of injury that should cause such limitations. so yes, microfracture was always an option, in the same way that microfracture is always an option for any athlete that wears down the cartilage in his knees. there are literally hundreds of athletes that could go get microfracture surgery and see some benefit. having fluid drained out of joints is hardly big news either. do a google search on having fluid drained out of knees and you'll see what i mean. it's only a big deal with tracy. i'm right. rehabbing properly and rehabbing completely are two different things. rehabbing properly involves doing the right sorts of exercises, stretches, and caring for the joint. rehabbing completely involves doing those things until the joint is recovered and back to full strength. they know he rehabbed properly because they gave him the list of things to do. that does not mean he took it to heart and really devoted himself to it. matter of fact, after his "rehab", he clearly had atrophy in that leg, so you know he had not completed the rehab and was not back at full strength. and just for the sake of it, i also just plain old know that he didn't do it. back with this again. microfracture is not an excuse. he did betray the players, organization, and fans by having this surgery. the season was built around having tracy present as a player. that means that before the season started, he was put through the tests and physical examination, and it was determined that he would be able to contribute this year. as I said a moment ago, he was clearly not done rehabbing, but apparently he told the organization that he would be able to play his way back into shape because that's what he has always done. unfortunately he obviously underestimated just how bad his body had gotten, and just how weak that leg was, and never gained confidence in it. do you think that daryl morey would have traded his draft for a 1 year rental of ron artest if he knew tracy would bail on him midseason? it makes no sense. do you think that the players who entered the season with a certain role appreciated having to pick up the slack for a player that's supposed to take them into the playoffs and beyond? do you think the fans appreciated being sold a championship dream only for tracy to suddenly pull the plug on it out of the blue? the fact remains that no doctor or mri suddenly discovers that a huge piece of cartilage is missing, or that all of a sudden a lot of cartilage damage has happened. whatever the situation was, it was known, and it was determined, and agreed upon that tracy would rehab and play the 2008-2009 season. tracy bailed on that plan because he was not prepared to handle the work that such a commitment required. ok, so really the only point you seem to have is that tracy had a bad knee. we all know that. that's not a point that you need to prove. but let me ask you, if he could play through it in 07-08 in the playoffs and do everything he did, what changed so quickly that all of a sudden he couldnt jump, shoot, run, practice, dunk, defend, or play? according to you this is the same issue that he had, yet all of a sudden his play goes down the toilet? you tell me. his knee got worse because of all the nothing he did in the offseason? his knee got worse because the doctors went in and repaired it? no, no, no. his knee got worse because he had it cleaned up and didn't rehab it, then tried to play NBA freaking basketball on one leg. news flash, you cant do that tracy. your rehab was there for a reason. you were supposed to do that BEFORE teh season started, genius. but he didnt. so he failed. what he did in the playoffs in 07-08 is about as irrelevant as what color underwear you are wearing, honestly. organizations cater to superstars because by and large they are irreplaceable. tracy took advantage of the organization in so many ways, and they bowed and scraped to give him what he wanted because he's a superstar and they need him. both of his knees worked in 07-08, i promise. his knee just needed clean up for its long term health, and because some of the things in there were clearly irritating the joint. not because his knee was falling apart at the seams and he was being a warrior or whatever you are trying to suggest here. look, simply put, playing basketball is tracy's job. the organization did a lot of things to enable him to do his job better, in the short term, and the long term. many of those ideas were what tracy told them he needed. so they gave him every opportunity. he failed them. simple as that. i would like that. honestly. i wish we could be rid of him, so we can be done with this soap opera. if he ended up in a nuthouse in a white jacket, i don't think i'd lose any sleep.
Ok last time responding and i'm moving on. You keep referring to cartilage damage in his knees as being atypical of thousands of other athletes. your right knee cartilage damage is common in many athletes with knee pain. this common knee cartilage damage that you are referring too is cartilage damage of the menisci. http://orthopedics.about.com/cs/meniscusinjuries1/a/meniscus.htm http://www.maci.com/patient/knee-cartilage-damage.aspx http://74.125.93.132/search?q=cache...ge&cd=12&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a Tracy however had articular cartilage damage. which is damage to the joint lining the articular cartilage. Jones and Clanton specifically said this in the video explaining the knee problems. http://www.sportsinjurybulletin.com/archive/cartilage-injuries.html The treatment for menisci cartilage damage is rice, which is common. you just play through it. or if it's too much for you arthoscopic surgery. http://www.teachpe.com/sports_injuries/knee/meniscus.php You wanna know what the treatment is for Articular cartilage damage which is what the doctors say tracy had..... of course you do. You guessed it surgical treatments are athoscopic surgery and microfracture surgery. ( Plus some other surgeries i never heard of. ) http://74.125.93.132/search?q=cache...age&cd=9&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a http://www.sportsinjurybulletin.com/archive/cartilage-injuries.html So let's recap. every player has cartilage damage. yes you may be corect but the kind of cartilage damage they have is key. Menisci cartilage damage which is what most refer to when saying cartilage damage is treated by RICE and or/ arthoscopic surgery. Articular Cartilage Damage is treated by RICE, and surgical options which include Microfracture Surgery. Every player that has cartilage damage has microfracture surgery as an option is incorrect. Every player that has articular cartilage damage microfracture is usually offered as an option. The two can coexist where the menisci damage leads to articular damage, which is usually when a microfracture is perforemed. ie, tracy mcgrady, amare stoudemire, kenyon martin. There's a difference in not rehabbing at all. and not rehabbing completely. You imply he didn't rehab at all. Jones and Clanton imply he did rehab and david cohen is who he rehabbed with. see long post one. microfracture was an option and a serious one for the injury tracy had. Still is no excuse for how last year went down. See if you looked at the video......... Timeline Training Camp 07/08 season: a lil after was the initial injury, mri showed bone bruise and tendon strain. Note no cartilage damage was found on this mri. He played like himself during the year i believe 3team all nba, towards the end knee started bothering him some more. They had to take some fluid off it a couple times. And gave him injections. He played through it. Immediately after the season he was examined again and they decided to have the knee scoped. This mri showed there was articular cartilage damage. They knew this before having the knee scoped. So they knew that microfracture was indeed a possibility. They knew immediately after the 07/08 season that his knee had a articular cartilage damage and microfracture was indeed a possibility. his knee didn't get worse after the scope it never got any better. The cartilage damage was still there. and apparently for tracy was too much to handle. why would anyone lose any sleep over any athlete or famous person. Unless it's halle berry. boy i would..... lol we'll just have to agree to disagree, (although i'm right j/k. ) sorry for the long post.
This is the approach I have taken in these past few weeks. Why stress yourself out with "no end" arguments?
