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Morey on Nets backing out on Carmelo: "It put us in the game there a little bit"

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by HMMMHMM, Jan 20, 2011.

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jopatmc Contributing Member

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Melo is bluffing. It's too much money difference. Even when they cut the contracts down, they're cutting everybody down, so he's still losing the same percentage after the new CBA. He's bluffing. He wants a max extension and he wants to be traded to the Knicks.

The Nuggets should just hang on to him and hope they can franchise tag him after the lockout.

#61 jopatmc, Jan 21, 2011

everyday eddie Member

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jopatmc said:

Melo is bluffing. It's too much money difference. Even when they cut the contracts down, they're cutting everybody down, so he's still losing the same percentage after the new CBA. He's bluffing. He wants a max extension and he wants to be traded to the Knicks.

The Nuggets should just hang on to him and hope they can franchise tag him after the lockout.
Click to expand...

It's exactly what's happening, Melo is just trying to get the best of both worlds and hopes Denver panics from fears of Broussards report of NY or bust, once he realizes that it won't be possible he will possibly just choose the extension over the knicks.

#62 everyday eddie, Jan 21, 2011
sammy Contributing Member

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The Denver Nuggets blamed their counterparts in New Jersey for every press leak, accused the Nets of trying to pressure them into a deal before they were ready, and were generally just as spent as the Russian playboy billionaire sounded at his Nets news conference after five months of Carmelo Anthony trade talks managed to produce only two collapsed trades.

That, though, is not the whole truth.

Don't forget the part about how much the Nuggets are going to miss the Nets if rookie owner Mikhail Prokhorov wasn't bluffing with his repeated insistences Wednesday night that he's ceasing all interest in Anthony.

There's a reason why the Nuggets -- for all their frustrations with the public nature of negotiations and the long-standing doubts about whether Melo could ever be convinced to sign an extension with the team that toils in the Knicks' shadow -- negotiated almost exclusively with New Jersey since autumn.

Reason being: New Jersey has been the only team in the league willing and able to provide the Nuggets with two lottery picks and payroll relief in addition to prized teen bruiser Derrick Favors, along with the very useful likes of Devin Harris and Anthony Morrow, in exchange for Anthony. There isn't an available young player in the league that the Nuggets rate higher than Favors, with available being the key word.

So …

The Nuggets can make the legit claim that they were not completely blindsided by Prokhorov's abrupt withdrawal, since they were always fearful that Anthony's refusal to sign the extension would eventually bring a halt to talks with the Nets and force them to look elsewhere. But it's an undeniable blow for them, too, to get hit with this now … if New Jersey really does have the discipline and pride to suddenly bow out of the Melo Sweepstakes with 30-odd days to go before the trade deadline -- and stay out.

Sources close to the situation say the Nuggets were convinced that the Nets were never going away as a potential trade partner, because the Prokhorov regime is that desperate to have a face from Anthony's stratosphere to sell to its ticket-buying audience in Brooklyn starting in 2012-13. And that's why Denver's motivation to drag the talks out did not purely stem from the idea that every Nets loss potentially sweetened the quality of the first-round draft pick they'd be sending to Denver.

The Nuggets, sources say, increasingly hoped that Anthony would gradually warm to the idea of signing the extension with the Nets if a trade agreement was reached closer to the Feb. 24 trade deadline, based on the idea that securing an extension before the expected lockout this summer means even more to Anthony than winding up with the Knicks. The most common estimate of how much Anthony is likely to lose if he doesn't have his extension done before the next collective bargaining agreement is $40 million. Two or three weeks from now, if you buy this theory as much as Denver apparently did, that threat would have been more real to the All-Star scoring machine and nudged him to see the Brooklyn-bound Nets as a palatable compromise.

Yet it's a moot theory now unless the Nets -- as some understandably weary followers of the long-running Melo Drama suspect -- don't have the spine to live up to Prokhorov's declaration and get dragged back into three-team talks that also featured the Detroit Pistons because of that Brooklyn desperation. We should note that NBA talks presumed to be dead, when they go on for this long, more often than not get revived.

Denver, though, is obviously a "deliberate team" in the words of one rival exec, so taking a step back to reassess all of its options is a likely Step 1 for the first-year management duo of Josh Kroenke and Masai Ujiri. Word is Denver, furthermore, does now concede that negotiating more seriously with the Knicks is unavoidable, as our own Chris Sheridan has laid out, since New York is still the only team that Anthony is definitely willing to extend with.

Serious talks between Denver and the teams that are willing to gamble on an Anthony trade without his signature on a contract (headlined by Houston and Dallas, as we've been discussing in this cyberspace since Thanksgiving) will also begin in earnest this week. That's especially true if you buy the notion, as some teams do, that the NBA's next labor agreement will contain an NFL-style "franchise tag" provision, which will only encourage risk-taking teams like the Rockets and Mavericks to try to swing a trade for Anthony even without an extension.

The problem there, of course, is that no one can predict anything with any certainty when it comes to the next CBA. Sources close to the situation nonetheless continue to say that the Rockets in particular loom as the Knicks' new biggest threat, since Houston would appear to be the team that can come closer than any team outside of New Jersey -- with its combination of quality draft picks, trade exceptions and Yao Ming's expiring and insurance-sweetened contract -- to furnishing Denver with the long-term savings and assets needed to start over (starting with the 2012 first-rounder swiped from the Knicks last February).

That potentially changes if the Clippers are prepared to join the bidding, with a season-ticket holder of theirs who is somewhat familiar to ESPN.com readers helpfully suggesting via Twitter on Wednesday night that the Nuggets wouldn't be able to refuse an offer of Chris Kaman, Al-Farouq Aminu, Minnesota's 2012 first-round pick (which the Clippers possess from the long-ago Sam Cassell trade) and the requisite expiring contracts to absorb Al Harrington along with Anthony.

(NBA front-office sources continue to stress that Chicago, by contrast, will not emerge as a factor unless the Bulls are prepared to put Joakim Noah on the table, which they've consistently said they have no intention of doing.)

This much, however, is certain: Whatever's out there isn't going to excite the Nuggets like the various New Jersey scenarios did. No matter how worn out and queasy the Nuggets might have been from an emotional roller-coaster ride that began all the way back in September with the original near-trade involving Charlotte and Utah -- and fed up just like Prokhorov -- they were floored by such a firm public squelching from the Russian.

An undeniable sense of pessimism, furthermore, continues to emanate from the Nuggets when it comes to somehow convincing Anthony to just sign the extension if a trade can't be worked out with the Knicks and stay with the only NBA team he's ever known. You'd have thought the chances of Melo staying in Denver might have increased with the Nets walking away, but that's not the word we're getting. Definitely not given the consistent boos greeting Anthony at every home game now and his increasingly open admissions about wanting to get back to the East Coast.

Anthony even let it slip to Denver-based reporters Wednesday night after Prokhorov's decree, possibly for the first time, that he's indeed expecting to be dealt somewhere before the Feb. 24 trade buzzer.

"I think so," Anthony said. "I think so."

Melo's coach, meanwhile, might have had the line of the evening. Referring to Prokhorov, George Karl told those same reporters that "my billionaire friend from Russia has kind of thrown another curveball or knuckleball into the process."

Unless this all turns out to be "a ploy" or "a negotiation" from the Nets, to use more of Karl's words, call it a full-fledged screwball flung at the Nuggets that just cost them a good slice of leverage they never imagined losing this soon before the deadline.
Click to expand...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=stein_marc&page=Nuggets-110120

#63 sammy, Jan 22, 2011

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ThaShark316_28 Member

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People talk about an NFL-like franchise tag...

Would they add the same thing as the NFL? 2 1sts get you that franchised player...

If so, what would stop a team from getting him? Would they really give a damn about 2 1sts....?

#64 ThaShark316_28, Jan 22, 2011
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if we have the franchise tag...blake griffin would be stuck on the freckin clippers forever man

not too fond of that idea ay

#65 W22_STREAK, Jan 22, 2011
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Teams reconsider trading for Melo

The Knicks' timetable for trading Anthony Randolph could be pushed back a week or so because of New Jersey's pulling out of the Carmelo Anthony chase, sources said.

The likeliest trading partners for Randolph have been Minnesota and Indiana, both of whom would take him for a first-round pick that the Knicks in turn would put in a trade package for Anthony. But there's a possibility the Nuggets may be interested in Randolph as a player.

Sources also say sentiment around the league that Anthony will sign with New York is so strong that many teams that have been willing to trade for Anthony as a rental are now reconsidering. For instance, the Rockets have long been willing to deal for Anthony without his signing a contract extension, hoping they could convince him to stay in Houston long-term. But if the Rockets feel their chances of convincing him are slim, they're not going to offer much, if anything.

While Anthony certainly wants to sign the three-year, $65 million contract extension with the Knicks, several sources close to the Nuggets superstar tell me he's willing to play out the season in Denver (or Houston, etc.) and sign with New York as a free agent, even if it means taking less money under the new collective bargaining agreement. Anthony understands he can make up at least some of the money in New York through endorsements.

Even if it doesn't get Anthony, the Rockets are expected to make a move. Carl Landry is available in Sacramento and the Rockets do have interest in bringing him back to Houston.

Despite the Cavaliers' poor record, lots of teams are interested in their players, viewing them as guys who can play a solid role on a contending team. If a Cavalier is moved, it's most likely to be Anthony Parker.
Click to expand...

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/24117/discord-in-indianatrade-chatter

testy times ahead.......

#66 W22_STREAK, Jan 22, 2011
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The Knicks offered Wilson Chandler, Landry Fields and a first-round draft pick to the Nuggets in exchange for Carmelo Anthony but were turned down, ESPN 1050 Radio reports.
The Knicks are strongly considered to be a destination for Anthony, a free agent to be, now that the Nets have called off talks that also involved the Pistons.

Anthony did not attend Nuggets shootaround Friday but coach George Karl said he expects the All-Star to play against the Rockets.

Wednesday, Nets owner Mikhail Prokhorov pulled his team from talks with the Nuggets, saying they had become too expensive. The Nets would have parted with up to eight players and up to three first-round picks if the deal had been completed.

The Knicks said they would not rush into talks after learning of the Nets' withdrawal.

The first-round pick the Knicks would deal has not been acquired by them yet, the report says. Rumors have them sending Anthony Randolph to the Timberwolves for a first-round pick if need be.
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Don't know how reliable this may be..

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/knicks_offer_for_anthony_turned_TZulwtYJI1WIcLgTm8ywyK

#67 BDswangHTX, Jan 22, 2011

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Where are you guys getting this info about all contracts being rolled back (ie a 10% cut to all players currently under contract)? Legit link please? I definitely see players fighting over that one.

#68 Icehouse, Jan 22, 2011
HMMMHMM Contributing Member

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Icehouse said:

Where are you guys getting this info about all contracts being rolled back (ie a 10% cut to all players currently under contract)? Legit link please? I definitely see players fighting over that one.
Click to expand...

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wi...ba_seeks_rollback_of_existing_player_salaries

#69 HMMMHMM, Jan 22, 2011
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I'm not even in the camp that thinks Melo will be traded to the Rockets but...

IF he was, how much could the Rockets realistically offer him as far as his next contract?

Do they have his Bird rights?

What would be the difference between what Rockets and Knicks could offer him?

#70 DreamShakeFTW, Jan 22, 2011
HMMMHMM Contributing Member

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DreamShakeFTW said:

I'm not even in the camp that thinks Melo will be traded to the Rockets but...

IF he was, how much could the Rockets realistically offer him as far as his next contract?

Do they have his Bird rights?

What would be the difference between what Rockets and Knicks could offer him?
Click to expand...

The Rockets could either extend Melo to a 3year/$65mil deal or sign him to a max deal under the new CBA.

Melo's bird rights would get traded along with him and even though it's not certain that things like bird rights will carry over to the new CBA, I don't see why it wouldn't.

I obviously can't tell you how a such a max deal would look like under the new CBA, but here are some numbers that come close to what Melo would have gotten next year under the current CBA.

#71 HMMMHMM, Jan 22, 2011
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I am the WHATEVAH point on the Melo Maddness

Rocket River

#72 Rocket River, Jan 22, 2011
Icehouse Contributing Member

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HMMMHMM said:

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wi...ba_seeks_rollback_of_existing_player_salaries
Click to expand...

Ok, so basically a bogus site. LOL.

I would be shocked to see current contracts get rolled back, but we shall see.

#73 Icehouse, Jan 22, 2011

HMMMHMM Contributing Member

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Icehouse said:

Ok, so basically a bogus site. LOL.

I would be shocked to see current contracts get rolled back, but we shall see.
Click to expand...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4894018
http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports....-they-want-players-to-take-a-salary-rollback/

I don't expect it to happen either, dertainly not to the extent the owners seem to be pushing, but the talks about it sure are legit.

#74 HMMMHMM, Jan 22, 2011
pbthunder Contributing Member

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Icehouse said:

Where are you guys getting this info about all contracts being rolled back (ie a 10% cut to all players currently under contract)? Legit link please? I definitely see players fighting over that one.
Click to expand...

Larry Coon frequently speculates, when people ask him. I think he's probably pretty well plugged in for somebody that's not actually involved.

We'll see what happens.

#75 pbthunder, Jan 22, 2011
aelliott Contributing Member

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ThaShark316_28 said:

People talk about an NFL-like franchise tag...

Would they add the same thing as the NFL? 2 1sts get you that franchised player...

If so, what would stop a team from getting him? Would they really give a damn about 2 1sts....?
Click to expand...

In the case of the NFL they have two types of Franchise tags.

One is the "Exclusive" type and the player is not allowed to negotiate with other teams. You're gurarenteed that the player can't leave for another team but the tradeoff is that you have to pay him at least the average of the top 5 paid players at his position. It makes sense for superstars but not for other players unless you are willing to overpay them for a year to further evaluate
them. The Texans used the exclusive tag to retaine Duanta Robinson the last year he was here.

The other type of franchise tag is the "Non-Exclusive" type. The player is allowed to negotiate with other teams and reach a contract agreement. The players original team then has the right to match. If the team doesn't match then they instead receive two first round picks as compensation (that's what you were refering to). In the NFL first round picks are much more valuable than in the NBA so a price tag of 2 first rounders is very high. Regardless, if the team is willing to match the deal then again they can't lose the player. New England used the non-exclusive franchise tag to retain Vince Wolfork last season.

The NFL also has a "Transition Tag" where you agree to pay the player the average of the 10 highest salaries at his position. The player is still free to negotiate with other teams and if the player signs elsewhere then the original team gets no compensation.

The details would have to be tweeked due to differences in the NFL and NBA but the NBA could use some form of franchise tag to help prevent teams from losing star players.

#76 aelliott, Jan 23, 2011
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Here is some Nene news:

http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm

Thus far, Denver's stance has been to deal with Anthony first, but sources say the Nuggets are running out of time to get Nene to agree to an extension. And if Anthony and Chauncey Billups are traded in a clear step toward rebuilding, there is little doubt Nene will push for a trade. CBSSports.com
Click to expand...

http://www.hoopsworld.com/HeadlineStories.asp

If you think the Nuggets simply have to resolve the Carmelo Anthony saga and move on, think again. Denver has another issue brewing, one that has been largely ignored with all the attention on Melo. It's the impending free agency of another player we're on a one-name basis with: Nene.

Like Anthony, Nene has an early-termination option he can exercise after the season, and sources say he is upset with all the attention focused on Anthony's situation while his isn't being resolved. Nene, arguably Denver's second-best player, has made a list of three teams he's interested in signing with or being traded to -- and not surprisingly, one of them is Miami, where his fierce interior presence would be the missing piece for the Heat.

Nene is averaging 15.2 points and shooting .644 from the field, both career highs, and it could be argued that the 6-11 Brazilian would be just as coveted as Anthony if he were put on the trading block. Nene hasn't voiced any desire to be dealt yet, but sources say recently he has been among the most outspoken Nuggets in his anger about the distractions Anthony's situation has caused.
Click to expand...

#77 coachbadlee, Jan 23, 2011
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coachbadlee said:

Here is some Nene news:

http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm

http://www.hoopsworld.com/HeadlineStories.asp
Click to expand...

I saw that, too. Personally I say forget Carmelo, go after Nene. Carmelo wants NY, let him go. Try to get in on the Denver fire sale aftermath.

Use Yao's contract. That way you don't give up too much.

You would probably have to take on JR Smith or Andersen, but it would be worth it I think.

Just more assets to include in a trade for a SF upgrade.

#78 DreamShakeFTW, Jan 23, 2011

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DreamShakeFTW said:

I saw that, too. Personally I say forget Carmelo, go after Nene. Carmelo wants NY, let him go. Try to get in on the Denver fire sale aftermath.

Use Yao's contract. That way you don't give up too much.

You would probably have to take on JR Smith or Andersen, but it would be worth it I think.

Just more assets to include in a trade for a SF upgrade.
Click to expand...

NeNe and Chauncy for Yao's contract?

Chauncy was just the 1st name I thought of.
But we would have two starting calibre back courts
Chauncy / Martin
Lowry / brooks

Chauncy - Martin - Battier - Scola - Nene
Lowry - Brooks - Bud - PatPat - Hill

that team could HURT some folx

Rocket River

#79 Rocket River, Jan 23, 2011
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Rocket River said:

NeNe and Chauncy for Yao's contract?

Chauncy was just the 1st name I thought of.
But we would have two starting calibre back courts
Chauncy / Martin
Lowry / brooks

Chauncy - Martin - Battier - Scola - Nene
Lowry - Brooks - Bud - PatPat - Hill

that team could HURT some folx

Rocket River
Click to expand...

It would depend on who is left on the Nuggets after the Melo trade. I could imagine that Denver goes into full rebuild mode and tries to clear as much salary as possible.

Billups has another year but only $3.7 mil is guaranteed next year.

Nene has a player option, so if he bolts, you still have the capspace.

#80 DreamShakeFTW, Jan 23, 2011

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