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[Melo Thread] Who ME?

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by justtxyank, Nov 30, 2017.

  1. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    The Rockets inner circle isn't perfect. If you think they aren't glad Melo isn't here, you aren't being reasonable.
     
  2. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    Fortunately I don't have to devote that much time to evaluating Melo -- Morey and his team have done the work and agreed that Melo would have worked in Houston. I'm going to trust their decision over random internet fans making knee-jerk reactions. You don't know that Melo would have failed here because he did poorly in OKC -- it's a totally different situation and culture. The Rockets inner circle isn't perfect, but they've been on a hell of a hot streak -- I understand piling on 'the dodged a bullet bandwagon' is easy, but please take some time to consider the work Morey put into trying to make that trade work. They wouldn't have wasted all that time if it was just a complete shot in the dark to grab a big name. Regardless things have worked out amazingly well and this season will be remembered along with those magic seasons in the 90s -- our front office has been incredible.
     
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  3. MrButtocks

    MrButtocks Contributing Member

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    The front office also badly wanted Ryan Anderson and brought him in on an $80 million dollar contract. Let's not act like we can't make mistakes and haven't dodged some bullets.
     
  4. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    Please drop the "trust the professionals" argument. It's a cop out. Why even have a discussion since the pros (whether coaches or front office) know more than we do?

    Try discussing the facts instead.
     
  5. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    The anti-Melo circle jerk is boring - I believe he would have performed much better in Houston which is why Morey put so much energy in making the trade work. KD left a team he went to the finals with and won an MVP - he was that sick of Westbrook. It was clear early in the season that the cobbled together big 3 in OKC wasn't going to work.

    Westbrook hero ball leaves little room for for players in the twilight of their career to work into a new role - KD didn't want to deal with the disfunction in his prime but had plenty of options out. Melo obviously is no longer in his ball dominating prime but Harden and CP3 would have kept him viable and helped him carve a new role. With Westbrook running the show we saw a frustrated old vet playing out of position and rhythm a situation that wouldn't have happened in Houston.

    Don't discount team culture - MDA is fun to play for - the situation in OKC is a nightmare and has been for a long time. Remember they could have Harden, Westbrook, and KD now they probably won't be able to keep PG on the team. I understand that Melo can be an ******* but I think this time the blame needs to be focused elsewhere. I'm convinced Morey was certain he was trading for Olympic Melo a perfect piece to his never ending puzzle of assets. Melo was ready for a new role - at 33 the grind of having to run the offense every night wasn't a realistic option. Anthony to OKC was a big risk that looked interesting on paper, but failed miserably for what are now obvious reasons.
     
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  6. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    We also drafted Royce White and traded for Dwight Howard yet Morey continues to maintain a very solid success rate. It's not difficult to find obvious mistakes in any GMs resume.
     
  7. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    It's possible Melo wouldn't have flamed as badly on the Rockets as OKC, but that isn't saying much and it doesn't prove trading for him would have helped the team. His mid-range, iso-ballhog, poor catch and shoot, no defense skillset doesn't fit the Rockets system. Then you have to factor in his ego. It took Harden and CP3 a while to click together on the court. Adding Melo to the mix would have seriously complicated things. Also don't forget he and D'Antoni couldn't stand each other on the Knicks.

    The Rockets team culture is so good because they only have two guys to placate and both are top 10 players. Adding a delusional guy in decline could have killed that chemistry. Melo's recent exit interview was a confession he has an attitude problem. He's never been a fun teammate. CP3 made it clear from day 1 this was Harden's team and he was here to be a compliment. I have serious doubts Melo ever would have accepted his place as 5th most valuable player on the Rockets. Remember 43-3?

    When it comes to playing out of position, where did you think Melo was going to play here? Same as at OKC: PF.

    Take a look at the per game points, minutes and FGAs for the Rockets. The distribution is almost perfect IMO. The Rockets offense was historically great. Melo wouldn't have made it any better, probably worse. On defense, his effect isn't even debatable (he is TERRIBLE!).

    Rockets and Morey dodged a bullet. Just like they did when Chris Bosh re-signed with Miami. Just like when David Stern vetoed the CP3 trade to the Lakers that would have resulted in the Rockets investing big money into Pau and Nene. Morey is a great GM, but at least 3 times (in a major way) he avoided mistakes by being lucky instead of good.

    Rockets had their best regular season in history, had one of the best offenses in NBA history and have a legit shot at a championship. Morey has no regrets about Melo not being here. Neither should any Rockets fan.
     
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  8. MrButtocks

    MrButtocks Contributing Member

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    And we traded for Ty Lawson. And traded a first round pick for Terrence Williams. I know Morey is great and not perfect, so why act like Melo would have been guaranteed success here just because we pursued him? We rolled out the red carpet for Dwight and his attitude destroyed the locker room. It's not like there weren't red flags with Dwight. He burned bridges with multiple teammates and coaches even before we signed him. And he's continued to have the same attitude with two more teams.

    I don't see much difference between Melo and Dwight at this point. Neither are willing to sacrifice and be good teammates, both are obsessed with their own scoring and aren't willing to do the little things. Rather than blaming a third city for his shortcomings, how about we just be glad we didn't take that chance on Melo and have a drama-free season to show for it? I was a ardent believer that Melo would be an upgrade over Ryno too, but he's got a history that I'm not going to absolve him for.
     
  9. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    A quick answer to both your posts- I think Houston had a solid plan for Melo in Houston and he was aware and comfortable with the change. When the trade blew up and he expanded his options OKC got a steal and rolled the dice. OKC had zero plan for his use and Donavan and Presti played everything on the fly causing Anthony to make season long adjustments to his game. Melo was terrible last year and I just don't think he fell off that much. The primary reason for his drop off was the OKC system that had no real idea how to play him that only got worse as it became clear he didn't fit in OKC. MDA had big problems with Melo in New York but this was addressed and planned for - MDA specifically spoke about the 2012 Olympics and their work together along with Harden and Paul and burying the hatchet.

    So much of the anger and alpha bs we're seeing with Melo again is a direct result of his treatment in OKC. Interesting article on his exit interview.

    Carmelo Anthony: Observations from Melo’s intriguing exit interview

    What role Billy Donovan played in the his transition to the Thunder

    Well, I think it wasn’t so much of making the transition from New York to Oklahoma City, it was more so making the transition of playing a certain way for 14 seasons and then switching to a completely, totally different style of player in this one season.


    And it was more so me going to Billy and asking him what did you need from me in order for this team to be successful. And like I said, all of that happened on the fly. I had to learn that on the fly. It wasn’t planned. Maybe Billy had a plan of how he wanted to go into training camp, and then you had another component of me being traded in the 24th, 25th hour, so now it was like, oh, how are we going to implement this component into what I already have going on. There’s a lot of things that went into play this season. -Anthony

    Melo initiating the conversation with Donovan about how he was going to be used is striking. Players should not feel the need to ask their head coach how are they going to be used. Unless of course, this is a free agency meeting.

    If Carmelo Anthony wouldn’t have had this discussion with Donovan, would Billy D have initiated the conversation himself? Or would he have left Melo to figure his role out on his own. Either way, this feeds the debate about whether or not Donovan is afraid of his players.

    https://thunderousintentions.com/20...observations-melos-intriguing-exit-interview/

     
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  10. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    olympic melo is no longer realistic. give it up. he sucks now.
     
  11. Deuce

    Deuce Context & Nuance

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    I as trying to rack my brain thinking of at least 1 potential team he could go to with his 28M contract in a TRADE. Portland is the only team I could think of that would make sense in terms of being a "win now" "have the contacts to match" "need shooting: and "desperation for change." Not sure how much it helps them though.

    More likely IMO is Melo picks up his option and gets bought out or stretched. But I don't think he is back in OKC next season.
     
  12. J.R.

    J.R. Member

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    Saw the a few HEAT writers speculate Melo-Miami? Maybe? Maybe no?

    OKC may not be interested but the HEAT have a few "bad" contracts they could shed.

    Whiteside (obviously not a need in OKC with Adams)
    James Johnson
    Dion Waiters
    Kelly Olynyk
    Tyler Johnson's contract balloons to $19M

    http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/...at-ask-ira-carmelo-anthony-s043018-story.html

    Q: Can the Miami Heat trade Hassan Whiteside for Carmelo Anthony? New starts for two disgruntled players. Maybe this gives Dwyane Wade some added incentive to come back and play with a friend. And maybe other players would want to come to Miami. Also, we would have one-half of the banana boat. -- Stuart.

    A: First, the Heat will not be making trades in order to entice Dwyane Wade to return. That is an entirely separate issue from anything else this summer. As for Anthony, I'm not sure what, if any, level he would make sense on for the Heat. At this stage, he only is a power forward, one that does not defend particularly well. So that would mean moving James Johnson to small forward. Anthony also has said he would not be willing to come off the bench. So why would a team want to take on that type of issue? Plus, even with a contract that expires after the coming season, it still would not give the Heat tangible salary-cap relief in the 2019 offseason, because of the rest of the payroll. Beyond all of that, the Thunder have Steven Adams, so why would they need Hassan Whiteside

    http://heatzone.blog.palmbeachpost....anthonys-large-contract-to-shed-future-money/

    [...]

    Miami has its issues with the cap and could be a trade partner for the Thunder. The Heat, though, likely would have to shed long term money to make it worth paying nearly $30 million for one year of a fading star.

    With center Steven Adams under contract for three more years and $77.5 million, unless this turns into a blockbuster, including Hassan Whiteside ($25.4 million next season, $27.1 million in 2019-20) in a deal could be difficult.

    More realistic would be Miami packaging two contracts, say James Johnson ($14.4 million next season, three years total remaining) and Tyler Johnson ($19.2 million each of the next two years) and take back an additional cheaper contract to make the deal work.

    The Thunder, who, like the Heat, already are significantly over the cap next season, would then get two players they could plug in around Westbrook, with James Johnson as their starting power forward and Tyler coming off the bench.

    The Heat would get a player with one season left but even in that one year Anthony would probably be their leading scorer. Anthony averaged 22.4 points two seasons ago in New York and believes he has something left. He said as much following the playoffs when he went on a rant on how he was used this season and on his future, most notably telling reporters he was not going to “sacrifice” and come off the bench. “So that’s out of the question,” he said.

    [...]

    Unless Pat Riley has other deals in mind that would make the Heat an instant contender, this would be more about the future while keeping Miami somewhat competitive next season. And, with Wade and Anthony being close, perhaps the thought of playing alongside Anthony would help keep Wade around another year.

    Now, if the Heat and Thunder really want to make a splash then they could pull off the mega-deal with the Heat shipping James Johnson, Tyler Johnson and Whiteside to OKC for Anthony and Adams.

    That would change the looks of things and solve some cap issues.
     
  13. zeeshan2

    zeeshan2 Member

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  14. Houston112

    Houston112 Member

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    I can't help but feel all of this Melo hate by the media is too try and distract or make us forget about Westbrook.... last year's reigning mvp getting outplayed by a rookie and attacking a fan while also for the 2nd year in a row, choose not to shake hands with the opponent that knocked his ass out of the 1st round
     
  15. Vivi

    Vivi Member

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    The media which is hating on Melo (basically making him the scapegoat just to protect their embarassing vote for the MVP last season) right now are the same people that were kissing Presti's ass for getting him few months ago, they're pathetic and they have no shame.

    As a long time Melo...uhm, not sure how to say it, hater is definitely too much, but let's say i've never been a fan of him, with that said, i'm pretty sure he would've worked better here, no question about it, the difference between Harden and Westbrook alone would've been enough to make Melo more efficient.

    I agree, and even a trade with the Blazers would be hard to complete imo, at least if George leaves, cause the Blazers would basically offer what they offered to NY last summer so, i guess a mix of Harkless, Turner, Leonard...i don't think Presti would have any interest in those players since they're also meh/bad contracts and actually longer. Maybe if George stays...in that scenario i can see Presti being ok in getting Harkless and Turner or Leonard just to make the bench longer since the team would be set for years.
     
    #75 Vivi, Apr 30, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2018
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  16. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    You don't understand what is being discussed.
     
  17. YOLO

    YOLO Member

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    I didn't specifically quote anyone did I

    My post still stands
     
  18. got em COACH

    got em COACH Contributing Member

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    Not once but TWICE!!! Lol Glad he sign with the knicks for bigger pay day 5 years ago and so glad knick held their ground to not trade with us over the summer last year.
     
  19. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    So why do you insist that wanting Melo was not one of those mistakes? Because you like Melo?
     
  20. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    From everything I read that allowed a bit of insight to the mindset of the Rockets front office and players everyone was very excited about Melo being a part of the team -- it seemed like a home run. I've been taking Melo's side because for whatever reason I'm tired of the never ending circle jerk rooting for his demise. It's also been amusing playing flat earth, but all good things must end.
     
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