glad he's happy. i would've liked to have seen him with this bucks team - they would be downright terrifying on defense (feel for you malakas). but happiness comes first.
As a mental health professional i thought I'd throw my 2 cents in. Mental health is where brain function, psychological wellness, and personal responsibility converge making it difficult to always assess what the root issues are. Addiction, Bipolar, Depression, etc can all be as much about a disease (brain functionality) as it is about needing to do serious psychological/therapeutic work, and as it is also about what stage of change and readiness a person is to do the work. It's difficult to know which or how much all three factor into a person's mental illness and well being without getting to know them. It can take months for a mental health professional to properly assess which areas effect a person the most. That's why I'm always cautious of making a judgement or assessment without really talking to a person. Sometimes there are indicators that might tell you a person just isn't ready to take personal responsibility yet (take Johnny Manziel pretreatment for example), but it's still hard to be definitive. People can easily get hung up on addiction and anxiety as laziness or discipline issues when they observe the person not taking responsible steps to self care. Something like addiction doesn't mean a person isn't motivated to manage it, but it doesn't mean they are powerless and a victim to it either.
guaranteed contracts...stupidest thing the nba ever did - thats why the nfl is fighting against them so much....
Batman Jones, I totally understand what you are saying. I have to deal with mentally sick persons, though not serious ones, and I know of several people who have family members with serious mental illnesses. However, I don't think you can simply compare mental illness with physical illness. It's not as simple as society being aware of it, although it certainly is important. The key difference between mental illness and physical illness is that while the latter is about physical conditions, the former is about behaviors. We are supposed to be responsible for our own behaviors. The problem lies in here. What if you honestly cannot control your own behaviors? Are you still responsible? How do you know a person absolutely cannot control his behaviors? Is it a yes-or-no thing or is it a matter of degrees? If it's degrees, how much is the person responsible? Physical ailment can mostly be diagnosed by physical tests. Mental illness's diagnosis depends heavily on the patient's verbal and behavioral responses. It is extremely hard to fake physical illness, but mental illness can conceivably be an excuse for character issues. This is why it seems "right" to yell at a mental patient but everybody knows it's not right to yell at someone with physical problems. This is why most people are not sympathetic of a guy like Royce White. Sanders's case is a lot more understandable to me. But it is really difficult to draw the line.
Those are very good questions. And it's true too that "depression hurts everyone" as the commercial says, the ones that have it and the ones that have to deal with them. To go back to the Mitch Hedberg joke, I understand why alcoholics get yelled at and I understand why people with bipolar disorder get yelled at. I am both of those things and I don't look at either as an out for myself. Whether those conditions were cause for my past bad behaviors or not I take responsibility for their consequences and I am extraordinarily sorry for every misstep. I don't know if my regret could equal the hurt I've caused and certainly it doesn't do anything to fix it but I do feel regret and I do feel remorse. My conditions aren't an excuse for my behavior even if they might provide an explanation for it. I'm not aware of Larry Sanders having behaved badly. I'm sure he has as most people do and especially most people with mental health issues do. But I don't think that quitting one's job because one is too ill to do it is bad behavior. Should he give the money back? Would he if he couldn't play because he had cancer? If yes, yes. If no, no. Because this particular situation doesn't have anything to do with bad behavior. It's about a sick person that got too sick to continue in his job. In this case I don't believe any distinction should be made between a physical or mental illness. They can be equally debilitating.
Larry posted in twitter one year before this happened that will leave as soon his extension kicks in and he gets the money "they owe" him. He got into a fight with a fan and posted it then deleted it, but it was saved from someone who took a screenshot. Maybe instead of everyone immediatelly buying into him being the innocent victim one should also consider the possibility that he takes advantage of mental illness debate and tries to get paid millions for free. Thats what I believe and thats why everytime he tries to be the spokesperson of people with depression I find it infuriating because I suffered from depression myself and here I see someone faking it. Nothing is black and white in the world. Maybe he is trully ill but maybe he is not. For me it is too much coinsidence. He wouldnt even have gotten the contract extension he got if it wasnt for a classic contract year perfomance. Right after he got the extension signed by the poor idiot Herb Kohl who trully believed in him he started immediatelly acting out. The puppies abuse the bar brawls another lockeroom fight. Then the team tried to get help him and get him to rehab- besides the one mandated by the nba- but he wouldnt stay. The NBPA tried to intervene and help him too and negotiate with the team but he wouldnt stay even then in the rehab they chose and he insisted even against his agent and the NBPA advice that he wants ALL THE MONEY. I dont care if he pretends now that he left money on the table by his own choice, that isnt true. He wanted every single penny and wouldnt go to rehab or even think to rejoin the team or travel together. And u know what was the incident that started it all? A hard practice after a loss. Kidd pushed them and Larry just got up and left. Like this forum has some legit insiders so has the Bucks forum and a lot of info spilled out at that time. After he agreed to the buyout he said he would go get help then immediatelly went to the carribean for vacation. Too many coincidences. Sorry. I dont buy Larrys story and I in contrast with you all was actually one of his biggest fans.
The NFL system is crap. It protects the team against player getting injured or sucking but there's no quid pro quo. The best system if you want no guaranteed contracts is for their to be no long term deals. 1 year contracts for everyone. Everyone becomes a FA after 1 year. The owners would of course never go for that. In a normal working environment, Harden would've renegotiated his contract 2 years ago or left the Rockets for a team willing to pay him his market value following that breakout season. But instead he must play for the Rockets at around half his value. In return, he gets a guaranteed contract in case of injury. Career freedom for financial security. It's a fair tradeoff.
NFL players can get guaranteed money... at least the upper level players.. many have it worked into their contract... the quid pro quo is you take less overall money for a higher guaranteed amount... Do you want 5yrs/15m yr and can be cut - or do you take 5 yrs/10m yr guaranteed... it's a bargaining tool - which is nonexistent in the NBA... hence your Royce White/Larry Sanders episodes....
The NFL has weakest union. If the NFLPA had any sort of leadership instead of gene upshaw the NFL players would have been much better off. However the NFL players break pretty easily. Maybe it has to do with the fact they have the shortest careers.
I don't get this thinking of people. It is not dumb. Teams have insurance to cover injuries and disabilities. And they come off the Salary Cap nearly immediately. Why would you care that the Billionaire owners have to buy insurance on their guaranteed contracts. It doesn't hinder the GM at all. Are you talking about cutting players for lack of performance who aren't injured? That's not the issue here.
Sanders is a disabled player retiring. That guaranteed money comes off the Salary Cap. It's doesn't affect the team. And owners have insurance for this. This is not the same issue as cutting a player for "lack of performance" -- as defined in the CBA. And if someone like White just stops showing up, he is in breach of contract -- guaranteed or not. Besides: Good GMs / Owners are measured by not strapping themselves with bad contracts. It actually helps the Rockets because Morey is so good at it. Being able to cut people like the NFL is a cop-out for bad GMs who are making poor decisions. If all contracts are guaranteed for "lack of performance", then they have to be smart about their signings. Retirement due to injury or disabilities is a different issue, which doesn't apply to Salary Caps
Sanders did a contract buyout and the money count for the salary cap of the team both now and in the next 7 years. He was stretched. I dont see how you can say that taking out a part of the salary cap doesnt affect the team, and only the owners pockets. Its not as much like Detroit and we were lucky with the upcoming cap rise but he still counts and will count for a long time. so he has harmed the team longterm.
^ actually the buyout was the owner's decision The ADA protects Sanders as having a disability. He can retire at full guaranteed salary which would not be a cap it
If he retired he may have taken all the money and wouldnt count in capspace, but he didnt retire and left the windkw open to come back (when hes out of money). and as I said there has been a lot going on that you dont know. He had been caught too many times with drug violations. If they had order a test again he would be suspended without pay and risk to have his contract voided by the league. And that was a part of the negotiations you bet.
If you never played basketball up to a high level yourself (college, professionally), you got no right to judge. Seriously. I understand completely. It IS possible to lose love for the game.. And sometimes for good reason. All I'm going to say on this, flame if you feel.
So we have no right to judge players if we didnt play pro or college ourselves? Thats news to me. Whats the forum then for, they should close it down.
