1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Kyle Lowry is still starting?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by ShiniKashi, Jan 2, 2011.

Tags:
  1. T-Slack

    T-Slack Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2009
    Messages:
    2,893
    Likes Received:
    81
    Mills flat out spanked Brooks and asked him who's his daddy and make you this thread? :rolleyes:
     
  2. napalm06

    napalm06 Huge Flopping Fan

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2008
    Messages:
    26,406
    Likes Received:
    29,596
    ... Maybe you should call Adelman and tell him about the blatant error he made.
     
  3. TheFreak

    TheFreak Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 1999
    Messages:
    18,262
    Likes Received:
    3,226
    Why is +/- for one game not relevant when one player supposedly lost the game for the Rockets ("When Brooks sucks, he loses you games")? Why do we need to look at sample size when tonight's game was supposedly a perfect illustration ("Tonight's game perfectly illustrates the difference between Lowry and Brooks")?

    None of this proves anything. I could say your 'leveraged moment' was only possible due to the starters and Lowry sucking so bad the bench had make up for it.

    Yawn.
     
  4. YaoMac09

    YaoMac09 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2008
    Messages:
    4,898
    Likes Received:
    2,552
    He would have died from old age before the phone call ended.
     
  5. Codeo

    Codeo Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    193
    Likes Received:
    9
    How does one player losing the game for a team have anything to do with +/-? Are you ignoring the fact that his teammates could be carrying the load that leads to that positive +/-? He stated that tonight's game was a perfect illustration, he never said that a very misinterpreted statistic (+/-) was a perfect illustration.

    You could say that it was Lowry's fault, but then you would just be ignoring the fact that Brooks made terrible plays at the worst times.
     
  6. CXbby

    CXbby Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2002
    Messages:
    8,776
    Likes Received:
    10,980
    I can do nothing for you if you cannot step outside the boundaries of your limited and rudimentary understanding of +/-.

    But because I am a very nice guy, I will try nonetheless.

    Many things contribute to a player's +/- for any particular game. Namely, the 4 other players you are playing with, and the 5 other players you are playing against. This is why for one game alone, there are way too many variables to make any conclusions.

    However, if a player has a consistently positive/negative +/- over time(sample size!), then we can isolate HIM as a key contributing factor.

    This is how Brooks can have a relatively tamer +/- tonight, and still be a key catalyst in shutting the door on our failed comeback. I am in no way blaming the loss entirely on him. Just pointing out the fact that his 2 dumb, costly turnovers leading to breakaways put the nail in the coffin. Lowry's poor game on the other hand, contributed neither to winning nor losing. As someone put it, he was "invisible".

    I never said we need to look at sample size for tonight's illustration of the difference between Brooks and Lowry. In fact, the mere idea of an illustration or example precludes itself from sample size: it's just one example!

    You are confusing an argument for the proper use of +/- statistics, with a simple illustration of a difference between players that is founded upon a career of examples. Again, reading comprehension.

    Look, I don't have time to get into drawn out explanations of rudimentary basketball statistics that even your casual fan should understand.

    The moral of the story is, before calling other people's posts "crap", make damn sure that your counter-argument isn't based on a flawed logic(and statistic) that even a 6 year old can "crap" all over.
     
  7. Happii

    Happii Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2010
    Messages:
    399
    Likes Received:
    2
    That guy will never get here. But it doesn't hurt to hope. :cool:
     
  8. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    Messages:
    10,809
    Likes Received:
    373
    larsv8 is not to be taken seriously at this point with his Brooks at all costs agenda. At least DD's sanity has returned regarding Brooks.

    Having said that, I think Brooks ran into a guy who was having a career night offensively...not much he could do against that. What angered me was how he let the guy out-hustle him. Brooks will win us games all by himself in the future but his on court demeanor when things are not going his way is disturbing.

    Brooks is the ultimate 6th man if he will accept that role willingly.
     
  9. trugoy

    trugoy Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    1,383
    Likes Received:
    139
    How is Brooks any different than Earl Boykins?
     
  10. saitou

    saitou J Only Fan

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2003
    Messages:
    3,490
    Likes Received:
    1,503
    Over the last 5 games or so, Lowry's role in the offense has diminished (and I tend to think it's his own fault since he's the PG). Instead of trying to dribble and create something (which he was doing more of when he was on that hot streak), now he just dumps the ball into the high post after bringing it up on most possessions. Is there a reason for this? Playing against better defenders? Playing against better transition D? Mentally, just not as aggressive? The team desperately needs someone who can create (collapse the defense, beat his man, anything), and a lot of that needs to come from Lowry or Brooks.
     
  11. saitou

    saitou J Only Fan

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2003
    Messages:
    3,490
    Likes Received:
    1,503
    ^and of course I don't mean do it on every possession. A lot of the offense will still start with Scola/Miller, but we need more variation, especially when Scola is struggling.
     
  12. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    124,355
    Likes Received:
    33,260
    Both Kyle and AB have struggled lately, Kyle is not shooting as well and has become less aggressive, and AB is shooting worse than CBud....which should tell you all you need to know about that.

    Usually the team can win when one PG is doing well, the Toronto game was the first one I can remember where both AB and KL sucked, and the team still won.

    In order for the Rockets to win, ONE of them has to be playing well.....doesn't matter which, but one of them does....

    And please stop with the +/- bull****, that is one worthless statistical measurment.

    DD
     
  13. saitou

    saitou J Only Fan

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2003
    Messages:
    3,490
    Likes Received:
    1,503
    With Kyle it's not just his shooting. I miss those drives and kick-outs to the open shooters.
     
  14. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    124,355
    Likes Received:
    33,260
    For some reason, when Kyle is not shooting well, his aggression wanes, and when AB is not shooting well, he shoots MORE.....

    It is bizzare, like a character flaw for both of them.

    DD
     
  15. saitou

    saitou J Only Fan

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2003
    Messages:
    3,490
    Likes Received:
    1,503
    haha agreed, drives me nuts when they do that.
     
  16. trugoy

    trugoy Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    1,383
    Likes Received:
    139
    Not so strane, Kyle is a PG by nature, so he looks for others.

    AB is a SG by nature, so he looks for his own shot. Amazingly TWill might be able to salvage AB in Htown, he has the vision to play a point-forward role, and that could put Brooks off the ball and free to play SG.
     
  17. trugoy

    trugoy Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    1,383
    Likes Received:
    139
    it's cos his minutes have gone down with Brooks coming back. He has less time to get a feel for the game. Notice that his best games are always when he plays huge minutes this season.
     
  18. saitou

    saitou J Only Fan

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2003
    Messages:
    3,490
    Likes Received:
    1,503
    When DaDa says "aggression", I'm pretty sure he doesn't mean shoot more. He means try and drive to create something. When he's with the starting unit, Lowry is by far the best ball handler.
     
  19. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    124,355
    Likes Received:
    33,260
    He played great last year in limited minutes, had plenty of games where he was awesome.

    Maybe his hot streak has ended.

    DD
     
  20. ROXTXIA

    ROXTXIA Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2000
    Messages:
    20,099
    Likes Received:
    11,810
    You're right about accepting-the-sixth-man role, but he won't. And the fact that he didn't get his payday is affecting his game.

    I'm not an AB hater, but I still can't help but think he'll be dealt to Sacramento or some other team with a playmaking 2 or 3. Pairing him with Kevin Martin is a disaster, defense-wise. But leaving him in "demotion" 6th-man limbo (granted, he's coming back from an injury) will simply exacerbate his lack of focus.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now