Israel declares unilateral cease-fire in Gaza LMAO

From what I've read on this board, the embargo that was crippling Palestine were continued even before rockets came into the equation. Also, I've read that Hamas themselves weren't launching rockets (though I'm not so sure about that). So my question would be what should the Hamas actively do to get Israel to lift a) lift embargo b) help pay for the rebuilding of Gaza infrastructure and c) Stop the occupation of Gaza.

Or are we just going back to a world of might makes right?

 

Hamas launched 70 some rockets which is what provoked the Israeli military action. And Hamas should take responsibility for all rockets launched from Gaza, or they should admit they aren't in control and ask for outside assistence in policing gaza.

Which one is it?

If Hamas wants Israel to lift the embargo - they can start by recognizing Israel's right to exist, laying down arms, and offering a permanent peace. The settlements are gone from Gaza. There is not occupation. They only need to show that they won't use free trade to rearm to attack Israel.

 

Israel's right to exist where? Could Hamas agree to Israel's right to exist in Antarctica? Or perhaps within the original pre-1948 borders agreed to by the UN General Assembly (without Palestinian's consent, of course). Or maybe the post-1948, pre-1967 borders, when Israel expanded from 56% of mandatory Palestine to 78% while expelling and refusing right of return to hundreds of thousands of Palestinian Arabs? Or perhaps Hamas should agree to Israel's right to exist outside even those borders, throughout some 20-30% of the West Bank (even though, according to UN 242 Resolution, that land does not belong to them)?

This "right to exist" question is kind of tricky, when you think about it.

 

I don't think it's all that tricky. Right now, Hamas doesn't beleive Israel as a state should exist and it's existence is an offense to god. It has to be willing to make peace and live side by side with Jews. Obviously not in Antarctica

 

So that means one day after it expires it should launch 70?

 

What is the point of that thread? On Nov 4th, Israel went in to destroy a tunnel Hamas was building into near an Israeli military base, 1 soldier died, Hamas responded with mortar attacks, Israel launched an air raid that killed 6 more Hamas. Hamas launched 30 rockets.

Things then settled down...the ceasefire still was in affect. It expired on Dec 17th. Or 19th whatever....and Hamas said they weren't going to renew it unless Israel met their demands. Israel didn't, and they launched a massive mortar and Rocket attack from the 22nd - 24th.

That's is what Israel responded to. And unprovoked Rocket and mortar attack upon souther Israeli cities.

Why is Hamas attacking Israeli citizens - that's just stupid in my opinion, because when you do taht, hamas forces Israel to strike back against Hamas with massive force. In my opinion, Israel had no choice.

Hamas messed up. The should have sat at the negoiating table...launching the massive rocket attack was a mistake. Your claim that it was on Nov 5th is seriously erroneous. Check your facts man.

 

I don't know - why don't you ask Hamas why they still supposed "honored" the ceasefire until it expired on the 19th?

Clearly it was still intact if they were refusing to renew it on the 18th right???

I mean, you tell me...or ask Hamas. Because I can't answer why they decided to keep it in place after the actions on Nov 4th or despite the embargo.

Either way, none of that justifies launching rockets into civilian areas with intent to kill civilians - is Gaza is suppose to be a state, maybe they should start acting like one and follow the geneva conventions. Maybe then I'd call Hamas a legit gov't and not a terrorist group running the show.

 

Yes, let's check the facts.

http://ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=45350

[rquoter]
WASHINGTON, Jan 9 (IPS) - Contrary to Israel's argument that it was forced to launch its air and ground offensive against Gaza in order to stop the firing of rockets into its territory, Hamas proposed in mid-December to return to the original Hamas-Israel ceasefire arrangement, according to a U.S.-based source who has been briefed on the proposal.

The proposal to renew the ceasefire was presented by a high-level Hamas delegation to Egyptian Minister of Intelligence Omar Suleiman at a meeting in Cairo Dec. 14. The delegation, said to have included Moussa Abu Marzouk, the second-ranking official in the Hamas political bureau in Damascus, told Suleiman that Hamas was prepared to stop all rocket attacks against Israel if the Israelis would open up the Gaza border crossings and pledge not to launch attacks in Gaza.

The Hamas officials insisted that Israel not be allowed to close or reduce commercial traffic through border crossings for political purposes, as it had done during the six-month lull, according to the source. They asked Suleiman, who had served as mediator between Israel and Hamas in negotiating the original six-month Gaza ceasefire last spring, to "put pressure" on Israel to take that the ceasefire proposal seriously.

...
[/rquoter]

Basically, Hamas's "demands" were that Israel respect the original cease-fire agreement. Israel was unwilling to do that. But you're right. Hamas did mess up by firing into Israel. "Stupid" is a very good word for it.

 

That's actually tied directly to the article I posted. Hamas wanted Israel to abide by the original cease-fire agreement, which included them lifting the blockade for commercial goods. And Israel has continually refused to do, despite the impact it has on the population. What right does Israel have to control their border crossings? None.

 

Sweet Lou,

You really have to hate humanity to think this attack was warranted.

- Over 1000 dead, mostly civilians.

- Hamas didn't launch the Rockets, Isarel said so. It is Israel's attacks that has crippled their economy and infrastructure, which in turn means they can't control what goes out of their coutnry. It's like beating a man to death, then raping his daughter and saying that the man should've come to her aid.

- You say they should stop using human shields. But where has this been proven? Is this why Israel hit a freaking GRAVEYARD????? A GRAVEYARD!?!?!?

- Israel has broken the ceasefire by not choking Palestinians with the blockade. Had Hamas launched any rockets, it would have been justified, just like if someone choked you and cut off your oxygen, you would probably try to hurt them in any way possible. This is what oppression, poverty and isolation does to people. All humans behave this way. All of them.

 

Hamas has launched many rockets into Israel the past few months. On Nov 5th and December 27th for instance, total of 100 rockets launched - this was in fact by Hamas.


And yes, Israel's actions are completely justified. A nation has a right to take action against a hostile aggressor - to eliminate a realized threat. In fact, it has a responsibility to do so. Fully support what Israel did. I'm not even pro-Israeli - I've been very critical of the settlements and other actions throughout the years. But in this case, they are 100% in the right.

And Arab nations know this - which is why they have also been critical of Hamas this time around.