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Is Steph Curry the GOAT?

Discussion in 'NBA Dish' started by Cohete Rojo, Dec 21, 2015.

  1. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    Well, you can say that.

    It is misleading because people take it as an "advanced" stat that measure the total performance of a player. I've often see people compare PER between players and say this player is greater than that player as if that's the legit evidence. It doesn't help that PER stands for "player efficiency rating" which doesn't really measure efficiency.

    Again, PER is just a way to combine traditional boxscore numbers that anyone can just look at. It's not some kind of new measurement of a player's all around performance.
     
  2. intergalactic

    intergalactic Contributing Member

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    Curry is great, but we play in an era where PnR dominates offense, zone defense is legal, and refs don't bother to call defensive 3 seconds.

    Jordan would shut Curry down 1v1, and Curry could never stop Jordan 1v1. But the game has changed so much that there is still a credible argument that Curry is better. It's almost impossible to compare meaningfully.
     
  3. J Sizzle

    J Sizzle Member

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    Judging by the their careers, no, there is most certainly not a credible argument that Curry is better than Jordan.
     
  4. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    Maybe not "AT" but he is the greatest in the game right now.

    DD
     
  5. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    He's not probably going to finish with it, but if he did yes statistically and objectively it would be among the best of all time.

    If I recall correctly, Anthony Davis was on a similar pace last year but tailed off - it's a long season.
     
  6. intergalactic

    intergalactic Contributing Member

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    Lol, didn't mean to offend. Jordan wins in almost every possible way, of course. However, Curry is doing something amazing in this limited sample size, and in ways alien to how Jordan played. Curry is the certainly the better shooter, and it's just strange to compare because the current NBA values shooting far more than it used to. A lot of Jordan's skills, like post play, man defense, and ability to blow by his man 1v1, are devalued by today's zone rules.
     
  7. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    Except that it's pace adjusted and normalized for the season in which the player is playing - a box score or traditional stats are not.

    It's not simply an aggregation of box score stats. That's just flat wrong.

    It's kind of silly to critique PER for an individual season of players that log huge minutes - if there's anything that it's a good measure of, it's precisely that kind of an inquiry.

    A quick glance at the top 10 PER seasons shows that the greatest individual seasons were turned in by

    Peak Jordan
    Peak LeBron
    Peak Wilt

    Let's see, teh top 10 best seasons of all time were turned in by 3 guys who are all considered to be legitimate contenders for "greatest to ever pick up a ball" at various times. But no that's not "legit evidence" to you because...it's not true? :confused:
     
  8. SunsRocketsfan

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  9. rm365

    rm365 Contributing Member

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    Maybe that has something to do with DH manning the middle for Houston or the relative lack of excellent offensive 2 guards vs point guards.
     
    #49 rm365, Dec 22, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2015
  10. smoothie

    smoothie Jabari Jungle

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    needs 5 more rings, 5 more MVPs, and 5 more finals MVPs
     
  11. lionaire

    lionaire Member

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    If he keeps this up for the next 4-5 years then maybe he could work his way into that conversation. At his current state I still think there's players in the league right now better than him so no.
     
  12. kevC

    kevC Contributing Member

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    "More Finals MVPs"? How about "A Finals MVP"? :grin:
     
  13. HtownRock

    HtownRock Member

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    lol, so true
     
  14. conquistador#11

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    he is always chewing on something, looks like a goat.
     
  15. arusinov

    arusinov Member

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    And?? It would be convincing would You take guy who is 25th in AFG% and say "what's so great with it, he shoots like Jae Crowder?", or the one who is 79th and like "what's great to shoot like Zach LaVine?" or the one who is 90th and "like Marcus Morris"... You're invited to see who those guys (especially the second of them)
    But Steph's second in AFG%, and Casspi is 4th (1st and 3rd are actually Deandre Jordan and Whiteside - they are not shooting like Curry and Omri as they are superhigh percentage around basket centers never shooting 3).
    So all You can see from is that Casspi is shooting really great this year so far, and nothing else.
    And yes, Omri can do it because he's not taking many shots and always waits for good look or easy layup... which makes him really good roleplayer. But Steph is star of the team, he can't use this strategy
     
  16. freeze00up

    freeze00up Member

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    I hate the damn 80s and 90s thing. Imagine if Lebron could handcheck anybody too. Also why has TS% stayed relatively constant throughout the decades even though rules have changed to make offense easier? By that logic every offensive player has just gotten worse even with defense getting easier.
     
  17. calurker

    calurker Contributing Member

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    GOAT? You mean if the 1984 draft class + Curry was being held in June 2016, you'd take Curry first pick? Seriously? And that's just the 1984 draft class we're talking about.
     
  18. intergalactic

    intergalactic Contributing Member

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    Not sure where you are getting your stats from, but here is the basketball reference data.
    http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_stats.html
    They don't show TS% but eFG% shows a clear trend associated with rules changes. Since the 3pt shot was introduced, the lowest eFG% year was 98-99 at 0.466 . The NBA reduced hand-checking by rules changes (simultaneously allowing zone defense) several times over the next few years and eFG% started to go up. By 2006-2007 eFG% was up to 0.496, and it's been steady there ever since. That's a 6% increase in offense.

    But then the offensive improvement isn't evenly split. Perimeter-based offense is easier, and post-based offense is harder. So players like Curry are getting an even bigger bump in their stats from the rules changes.
     
  19. zeeshan2

    zeeshan2 Member

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    <blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">YOOOOOO this Steph Curry/Dell Curry Burger King commercial they just found on the Warriors broadcast is EVERYTHING <a href="https://t.co/B9P9nFulLt">pic.twitter.com/B9P9nFulLt</a></p>&mdash; Rob Perez (@World_Wide_Wob) <a href="https://twitter.com/World_Wide_Wob/status/684232107367858176">January 5, 2016</a></blockquote>
    <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
     
  20. aussie rocket

    aussie rocket Member

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    Not even top 10 as of today.
     

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