1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Is it not painfully obvious yet that the team is better without Patterson

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by CXbby, Apr 6, 2013.

  1. CXbby

    CXbby Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2002
    Messages:
    8,776
    Likes Received:
    10,980
    I'm not sure how anyone can say this objectively. We are winning more, beating teams by more, and for the first time this season, have beaten some of the top echelon teams.

    It certainly would make sense(for some) for the team to take a step back initially, but it isn't happening.
     
  2. thekad

    thekad Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2007
    Messages:
    2,541
    Likes Received:
    2,080
    Even in the face of overwhelming evidence, people will always stick to the conventional wisdom.
     
    1 person likes this.
  3. dharocks

    dharocks Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    9,032
    Likes Received:
    1,969
    We're playing better since the trade, but that doesn't mean getting rid of Patterson is the reason why we're playing better.

    I was in favor of the trade, for the record.
     
  4. pmac

    pmac Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Messages:
    7,977
    Likes Received:
    2,569
    I think a lot of it has to do with Patterson not having a short leash when he was here. He was a decent rotation player but his play didn't warrant such consistent playing time, even when he was having an off night. You'll see other players on our team (outside of the main 4 guys) get more sporadic PT and McHale will pretty much ride who's having a good night. So, those other guys' stats aren't hurt by off nights because they don't play much when they have one.
     
  5. rocketfaithful

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2012
    Messages:
    235
    Likes Received:
    5
    I agree 100% with this! Robinson can help us now and it is ashame that he isn't getting hardly any minutes! when he does get minutes he makes one mistake and gets pulled, its ridiculous. I think we toss him to the D-league since Mchale won't play him and let him work through his struggles at least until the D-League ends
     
  6. kumakun

    kumakun Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    Likes Received:
    16
    Nah Patterson was garbage as well as Morris. I've been saying since preseason PPat was soft and lacked that young drive to succeed. Like I saw more hustle from Jones and DMo in the preseason than Pat. I was surprised he was the starter and even did decent at times. Even Pats best had less rebounds than Smith so Smith is just soo much better.
     
  7. CXbby

    CXbby Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2002
    Messages:
    8,776
    Likes Received:
    10,980
    The team was 6-2 without Patterson before the trade.

    Patterson getting injured coincided with the first winning streak of the year, with the Rockets blowing out @NYK by 13, PHI by 22, MEM by 25, @CHI by 23. Back-to-back-to-back-to-back blowouts, the moment Patterson is out the lineup.

    Small sample size there, I admit. RAPM is not a small sample size, however. And over the course of the past 3 years he is rated as an overwhelmingly net negative player. I gave him the benefit of the doubt last year due to injury. This year, he is what he is.
     
  8. TheRealist137

    TheRealist137 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2009
    Messages:
    33,422
    Likes Received:
    19,298
    Before the trade the rockets had a bunch of tough games, the schedule was brutal. Since then, they have had a much easier schedule, with much more days of rest in between.

    The rockets were bound to play better, it is my judgment that with Patterson we would already be in 6th spot.
     
  9. Clutch

    Clutch Administrator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 1999
    Messages:
    22,668
    Likes Received:
    31,977
    Initially. They may have a power forward (Greg Smith) who makes them better (certainly a better post scorer), but they made the move thinking D-Mo/Robinson could fill the shoes and I don't think they helped the team as Patterson/Morris did. You may be right though ... I probably am leaning more on the eyeball test, but there are a few other factors also.

    All the feeling out process between the youngest team in the league was done with Patterson. After the trade, Harden-Lin-Parsons-Asik had some chemistry built already, and they were the builk of the scoring anyway. Jeremy Lin in particular has shown a lot of growth and progress since February. I don't think Patrick Patterson was holding him back. Patrick Beverley came on board in January. 12 of the 21 games since the deal were at home. Rockets also 2-0 without Harden, 2-0 without Parsons... even won a game without both, and I don't think they're better without them.

    Even with Patterson, this was the obvious spot to upgrade, so again -- I had no issues with the move. In fact, I loved it... even though Robinson has shown he has a long, long way to go.
     
  10. roxxy

    roxxy Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2012
    Messages:
    5,120
    Likes Received:
    162
    In the short term I don't think this team is better without patterson. But in the long term I d. I would take Robinson. Dmo, Greg & Jones upside over Pattersons average play any day. I could really care less about short term. I am more interested in long term.
     
  11. ling ling

    ling ling Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2002
    Messages:
    1,671
    Likes Received:
    93
    in b4 mi amigo.
     
  12. Naija Texan

    Naija Texan Member

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2009
    Messages:
    3,043
    Likes Received:
    55
    I was never a Patterson fan, didn't think he would be great long term and had the ceiling of being a poor man's Reshard Lewis giving all the shots he took and his softness under the basket. But I can't say he didn't have his moments and compared to all of our current PF options, while he certainly wasn't as raw.

    I think all of them have more potential (although I am not sure about Jones due to the small sample size) and talent so I am glad the trade was made.
     
  13. basketballholic

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2013
    Messages:
    17,516
    Likes Received:
    4,170
    Another point to consider is after the trade deadline a lot of teams are already playing for lottery position and next season so there starts to become this more distinguished divide between teams who are playing for playoff positioning and teams that are playing for lottery position. Like last night. Portland never challenged us. They jacked around and got the lead down to I think 5 but that was because our bench guys, mostly those young rooks we've just been talking about, were rolling around and mucking up the game. Once the starters got back in there, game over. You might want to take this into consideration when comparing our record before and after the trade deadline.
     
  14. CXbby

    CXbby Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2002
    Messages:
    8,776
    Likes Received:
    10,980
    Like I posted earlier in this thread, even if you take out the start of the season when the team was still building chemistry and Lin was playing subpar, and only looked at the last 20 games Patterson played with us, our record and point differential are still much better since the trade.

    The schedule lightening up and fewer back to backs and 4 games in 5 nights helps. But at the same time, some of those wins are against top teams, so it isn't just the schedule.

    Beverley has been the surprise of the season, and a huge upgrade over Douglas, who happened to be rated the second worst rotational player behind Patterson by RAPM. Funny how those were the two that got traded.

    I've mentioned this before on this board, current season RAPM are no longer publicly available because the owner of the site has been hired by an NBA team(Rockets?). I've exchanged a few emails with the guy and it is obvious that his metrics are legit.

    Losing Patterson, a net negative player, certainly doesn't hurt the team. While the collection of rookies are mostly net negative as well, it gives the coach the flexibility to go with the hot hand on any given night(perhaps evening out to net neutral), as opposed to sticking it out(stubbornness/comfort) with the more consistent Patterson(a guaranteed net negative).

    That, along with other factors, makes us a better team. Now.
     
  15. CertifiedTroll

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2012
    Messages:
    3,103
    Likes Received:
    924
    PPat claimed he would be the MIP. Morrey doesn't like liars.
     
  16. I'm Tom Brady

    I'm Tom Brady Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2011
    Messages:
    472
    Likes Received:
    21
    Hell yeah. A real power forward. I like Patterson and his smarts but some folks here said he's a small forward in a power forward's body.
     
  17. Blaster_333

    Blaster_333 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2012
    Messages:
    951
    Likes Received:
    40
    I'm glad i'm not the only one that sees this. It seems like there's very few Robinson supporters on this board. I didn't know much about him when he arrived in Houston, other than wanting him to do well for himself and his sister.

    Then I saw him on the court and saw that speed and agility, his ability to hedge and recover, ability to trap effectively especially with Beverley. He can easily guard 2-4, and probably smaller 5's and big 1's.

    He looks alot more lost than the other 4's....because they've been in the system for a whole season. Even Jones & D-Mo were in the system while at RGV.

    Not Missing U Patterson, not missing u whatsoever...
     
  18. cheke64

    cheke64 Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2009
    Messages:
    23,798
    Likes Received:
    15,152
    Yes, you are right my friend. I haven't rage quit since he left. I'm starting to follow the rockets again.

    Dat sof player.
     
  19. Z-Ro&Trae

    Z-Ro&Trae Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2009
    Messages:
    2,735
    Likes Received:
    41
    2Pat Suckur is garbage, but at least he's better than D-Mo. At least Patterson could knock down his three pointers. Watching D-mo play like crap makes me wish that Royce White was not crazy.
     
  20. ComeBack

    ComeBack Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    395
    Likes Received:
    4
    I don't know OP. Can't really say this team was together at the beginning of the season. Harden, Lin, Asik were all new players to a new system. Lin was coming off an injury and played horribly at the beginning of the season. I don't think you can make the point that we are better without Patterson after 3/4th of the season.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now