i would not trade cato as i feel he will have a breakout season this year and compliments our guards well. P.S.: Those interested in playing fantasy football go to the thread fantasy football in the bbs hangout forum and reply as i have 9 spots available and its a league designed to include clutchcity.net posters so come give me your input ------------------ How Sweet It Is! How Sweet It Is! Gene Peterson on the rockets winning the 1995 championship over the Orlando Magic
That line-up Rocked in the 4th quarter. Lack of defense is offset by our ability to force the other team to sit down a big player, making it a battle of mismatches. It worked last yr yes, but does anyone seriously think this is a good long term solution? The goal should be to win long term in the playoffs and build the team in that fashion. The last thing the Rockets want is a good regular season team that stinks it up in the playoffs. The playoffs is a completely different brand of basketball than the reg season. The frontline needs a lot of help. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
Because I like to talk about what I saw on the court, not what I would like to see once we land a dream Popeye trade. 3 guards can win with a great front court defense, just ask Detriot. But will it happen again, I don't know. I just don't understand your interest in talking about what we COULD do if we COULD land a popeye trade. Fact is right now, we are 3 guards in search of a defensive front line. We do not need a small forward, and we will suit up with or without a scoring-machine big man. And I will be here all year talking about it. What are you going to do MManal, talk about What If scenarios all year? in short,,,we all agree with you MManal. We all want Duncan. But we still want to talk about the current Rockets. [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited August 05, 2000).]
We do not need a small forward, and we will suit up with or without a scoring-machine big man. And I will be here all year talking about it. What are you going to do MManal, talk about What If scenarios all year? Nope, what I am talking about is the big picture, winning a title down the road. This team is re-building right now, I am talking about how I personally want the team re-built and how I feel they need to be down the line to win something big. What Im doing is different from dreamcasting b/c Im not sitting here saying, well lets get Webber, Lewis, and then following that up with a flowchart of players and positions, and then saying "man that team would kill the Lakers". What I am talking about is we need this type of player on our frontline. Projecting is a part of the game esp when your re-building. If this is the final product which it isnt, we're in deep trouble. Might as well forget about having those June parades ever again. Its called planning, and I happen to think its a very important part of basketball. Suiting up is great and all, but all that matters in the NBA is jewelry. Regular season success is nice and all, but it does not provide any summer parades. For now, this team has no choice but to go with a higher frequency of three guard sets. However, the point I am making is that they need a lot of work on the frontline and that INCLUDES the SF spot. Also, what Im trying to say is that using a 3 guard lineup with such a high frequency as the Rockets did last season is not good for long term success. A team built like that just is not going to win a title in this current NBA day and age. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net [This message has been edited by MManal (edited August 05, 2000).]
Historically, small ball hasn't worked, this is true. But there are new rules now which make it easier for teams with quicker perimeter players to excel. The Pacers are one of the slowest teams in the league. They have virtually no defense. Yet they were in the Finals, and it was a series, because they had guys like Rose and Croshere that LA couldn't guard on the perimeter because they couldn't put hands on them. At least one team scored 100 points in EVERY game of that series. Look at these final scores from the Finals: 116-111, 120-87, 120-118, 111-104. Don't give me "Defense wins championships" after watching that series. That doesn't apply anymore, and that's the way the league wants it. The new rules are causing these high scores. Sure, LA played the best defense last year, but that's not why they were champs. They were champs because they had the best player in the league (Duncan got hurt), just like always. The Pacers had NO, I repeat NO post threat! This is what everyone on the BBS has been screaming for. Why? The league is changing, and the Rockets are preparing for it. ------------------ "I'm real sorry bout the shape I'm in I just like my fun every now and then"
MManal, you are not considering how important maintaining chemistry and a team focus is to success. Injecting some prototype small forward who needs 35 minutes would have a ripple effect throughout this team. Injecting a PF who has potential in the low post, is fine and great, but what is the point of constantly talking about it. How many different ways can we say it. I am not disagreeing with you. But I will say, you are going to be surprised by what 3 guards can do with a defensive frontline in the NBA. For the future, we first must make Francis and Mobley a dynamic duo. Did you not read that Mobley signed for 6 years?! [This message has been edited by heypartner (edited August 05, 2000).]
in short,,,we all agree with you MManal. We all want Duncan. But we still want to talk about the current Rockets. Thats fine and all, but the impression I am getting out of reading this thread, basically the debate btw you and Nike is that you think a three guard lineup of Francis-Mobley-Anderson can be the backbone for an eventual championship team. You seem to be in favor of them playing a significant portion of the game together on the floor. I am not and feel this frontline needs to be upgraded b/c my eventual goal is a championship, and I dont feel a three guard lineup can provide that. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
You are similar to dreamcasters in your habit of assuming additions never subtract. Adding players can easily hurt this team in the long-run by robbing us of chemistry. We definitely do not need a small forward. So yes, give me Duncan and I can still play the 3 guards. This offense can play 3 guards with a superstar PF. Yeah babe, give me Duncan. But until then, stay out of the low post, you are just in the way and will hurt the team's chemistry. Just like they told Jordan's teammates.
TheFreak, the rules have changed the NBA game some, but it has not affected the entire complexion of the game to the point that defense means nothing. Defense still wins championships and always will. However, its not that simple. You need a complete basketball team that can play the post game, the perimeter game, defend and rebound. The only teams last season that really had all these ingredients were the Blazers and Lakers and those were the top two teams in basketball. The WCF should have just been called the NBA Finals since the Eastern Conference was such a big joke last season. This season, though, Miami has added the perimeter piece to the puzzle in Eddie Jones that should be able to put them over the top. They will be my pick to make the NBA Finals this yr from the East. I just want so bad for the Rockets to get a legit post threat to go with their perimeter game. If they can do that they will have all the basic ingredients and then can fill in the pieces and develop into a championship level team. However, I just see too many holes right now. Having a three guard lineup (Francis-Mobley-Andeson)with two shot blockers in the middle is not going to win a ring no matter how much we try to rationalize it. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
Francis/Mobley/Anderson with a young Mutombo and Theo Ratliff Do you think that can win a champsionship? The best defense in the league can always threaten to win a championship. Give them two go-to guys and you indeed can win a championship. But landing Duncan or Webber makes for no brainer. I have the distint impression you are a prototype dreamcaster. You really do need to surround yourself with prototype players to feel happy with your future. Not me....GIVE MOBLEY THE BALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Gotta agree with MManal...While I loved watching this lineup last year and the fresh approach Rudy took, I can not see us becoming serious contenders to the lakers without at least one serious addition to the front court. Cato shows flashes but will offer little to stop Shaq if he cant stay on the court. He has to stay out of foul trouble in order to provide a low post presence. More importantly, he has to come to play EVERY night. I think points would be a nice bonus but the other end of the court is where his contribution is most needed. It is ironic, that everyone looks to CWeb and next offseason as the promised land, when in fact, after Webber, it is a pretty dismal crop of FA's compared to this one. I feel that the player who best fits the Rockets needs is available NOW in BGrant, though it appears doubtfull that the Rocs have the resources to make it happen. ------------------
So yes, give me Duncan and I can still play the 3 guards. This offense can play 3 guards with a superstar PF. Yeah babe, give me Duncan. But until then, stay out of the low post, you are just in the way and will hurt the team's chemistry. Just like they told Jordan's teammates. Tim Duncan isnt the only good PF in this world yanno. I have not mentioned any exact names b/c I am not dreamcasting. However, this team needs a legit post presence in addition to its guards if its going to win something and that guy does not have to be Tim Duncan b/c thats a stupid and unrealistic aim. Even using Jordan's name in the same sentence with what we have on this team is a total and complete insult to him. If we had a guard that could shoot consistently over 50% every yr he is in the league and having the game of a post up and perimeter menace I wouldnt even be talking about this. Having Michael Jordan makes a lot of other things unnecessary. For a 2 guard that takes such a high volume of shots yr in and yr out to shoot over 50% consistently is just insane. No our team does not have that. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
MManal your position is you think additions always add to success. that makes you a dreamcaster. I don't. Additions can subtract...and usually do. I have much more respect for team chemistry and status quo. that's my last comment on this.
I don't really consider Francis, Mobely and Shandon a true "3 guard" lineup. Anderson can board and defend the 3 spot as well as Ruben Patterson, Sprewell, Kendall Gill, & Shawn Marion to name a few big guards who are playing small forward. And there are countless 6-7 3's in the league, does an inch make that much difference? And didn't we win a championship with 6-5 Mario Elie getting most of the minutes at 3 while Horry checked H. Grant at the 4? I think Francis Mobely Anderson Dream and somebody, anybody at the 4 will be the most productive lineup we put on the floor. I just saw on NBATalk that now Toronto wants Maurice Taylor, and that could make Antonio Davis expendable. I would start him over anyone we have on the roster right now. j ------------------
Francis/Mobley/Anderson with a young Mutombo and Theo Ratliff Ok Im being charged for dreamcasting here and your talking about a player that doesnt even exist in a young Mutombo. Mutombo is approaching his mid 30s and even now is near to impossible to deal for. I can see your basic premise though, would a lineup of Francis, Mobley, Anderson and two shot blockers be able to win a ring? I dont think so, but we'll see in time how this develops. My take on a team built like that is consistent regular season success but also consistent playoff exits and no rings which is unacceptable in my book. I have much more respect for team chemistry and status quo. I feel team chemistry is important also, but we have to be realistic, the Rockets are re-building and that obviously requires changes. We were a lottery team for crying out loud. We're not just going to magically become a playoff team then championship team w/o any additions. If you keep sitting at status quo, you will keep being a bad team. The current group of players is going to have a tough time as it is just to make the playoffs, they need some additions to the frontline. In conclusion, and this is also my last comment on this, I have always thought that the three guard lineup used for a majority of the game is a major gimmick. Its flash w/o substance. I am hoping (and I think they do) that the Rockets realize the importance of proper frontline players and dont get got into the flash and dash Jerry Colangelo style. We'll just have to see how all this develops. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
I don't know why you guys are so disappointed with Cato, there were absolutely no expectations of him coming here in the Pippen trade. You got spoiled last pre season. ------------------ Who's ya daddy?
Man,,,I thought this thread was about some new weird religion. There is a center in all of us, and it starts with Cato!!!!
Nike: This entire board seems to be addicted to athleticism... and anyone who doesn't have a blinding amount is underappreciated. The truth is, Shandon was a better player than Mobley last year, and when he was hot, he was more valuable than any other player ont he court for the fact that he PLAYED DEFENSE TOO... something Mobley and Francis seem oblivious of. You also didn't see Shandon jacking up idiotic shots. If Mobley can learn how to play defense, he MAY become more valuable than Anderson (but even that is iffy, given Mobley's smaller stature and inability to post-up)... but for the immediate future, Anderson should remain the #1 SG for Houston. (of course, there's nothing to say Anderson won't improve his offense as Mobley improves on D). ------------------ The lottery sucks. Playoffs 2001.
haven-Right on! Shandon improved his PPG EVERY month, and check out this alarming stat: In games we won, Shandon averaged 15 points, 5.6 rebounds, and 3.4 assists, while shooting a scorching 50.7% from the field! In games we lost, Shandon averaged 10.4 points, 4 rebounds, and 2.5 assists, while shooting 44.1% from the field. For Mobley, in games won, Mobley scored 16.6 points, 3.6 boards, 2.9 assists, while shooting 45.5% from the field. And get this funny stat: Mobley played less MPG in games we won, than in games we lost. In games we lost for Mobley, he scored 15.1 points, grabbed 3.6 boards, with 2.3 assists, while shooting 41.3% from the field. For Francis, in games won, Francis scored 19.1 points, 5.8 boards, 7.5 assists, while shooting 48% from the field. In games we lost for Francis, he scored 17.3 points, grabbed 5 boards, with 6 assists, while shooting 42.1% from the field. What this tells me is we're best when Francis is passing more (getting more assists), Mobley is taking better shots/passing to open man (he scored more in less time and had more assists) and when we're getting Shandon involved. ------------------ The more lefties on your team, the better. Collier is Seven Foot and Left Handed. How can you go wrong? Trade or bench Kenny Thomas.
NIKE that is no argument. When the other team guards Mobley and Francis too closely, we win. Thus, Shandon gets to score more. That is what is going on. btw: you should really throw out all stats before Christmas. If you want to analyze our new offense through stats, then measure just that...that is, the part of the year that didn't involve Barkley's ISO.
