I Wouldn't Trust My Mother Unless I Get It In Writing First!

you ain't a very good son then.

I am sure that the Rockets personel probably thought of all these things and i wouldn't be surprised if a deal has already been worked out OR the Chinese basically told the Rockets to trade him but the Rockets in return wanted them to not let this be known to the public because that would lower the value of the #1 pick and a lot of teams would think that the Rockets are desperate to trade the pick. We probably only know less than half of what happened in China but i am fine with that.

 

Agreed wholeheartedly. You're right on point here. I think the reason the trip was so...um, "successful" is because that's the cordial and polite thing to say..especially while in China. And we all know how important politeness is in the Chinese culture.

But I suspect that behind the scenes, the Rox know their trip didn't go as planned. To admit it, however, would destroy most hopes of getting Ming.

<B>suc-cess-ful (adj.) 1. coming about, taking place, or turning out to be as was hoped for. (Webster's)</B>

Last time I checked, we "hoped for" hard, cold assurances that Ming would be available for the entire season.

Did we get what we hoped for?

The Rox kill me.

 

I thought they were gonna be there for 10days, not 4...

 

Why? If you don't trust them no matter what, why would something be better than nothing?

China has no reason not to let Ming play, especially since it's been reported everywhere about how well the trip went and Ming has stated that he wants to play in the NBA. He'll be a Rocket, whether the organization takes your advice or not.

 

What a lot of you guys forget, and it's a BIG factor, is that this guy is NOT A COLLEGE player declaring for the draft.

This IS A PROFESSIONAL BASKET BALL PLAYER WHO ALREADY HAS A BALL CLUB.

That's right...he ALREADY has a team. He ALREADY has a contract.

That means, he is THEIR property.

So...FAIR ENOUGH that we have to negotiate and meet some of THEIR TERMS. He is THEIR player.

This is STANDARD in all world sports. Football...you want Zidane, you have to negotiate / trade to the club he has a contract with.

I repeat, it is STANDARD. They can make the terms and conditions.

It's pretty simple, if they don't like it...they simply can keep their player.

Honestly, I know a lot of you guys don't follow much sport outside of the USA...but this is pretty bloody normal.

I repeat...he is the Shanghai Sharks property. They are entitled to make demands.

Imagine for a moment that Francis decided he wanted to play in the Italian league...do you think the Rocks would say "hey, go for it..." and just let him do it? Not a chance...

This is STANDARD in world sports.

Please, let's open our eyes...

 

Paranoia strikes deep ...into your heart it will creep

I was like you at first, distrusting those commies. But the reason Communism is going the way of the dinosaur is that is fails to recognize that men are always motivated by self-interest first. And in this case I think it is in China's self interest to bring Yao on to the world stage.

1. China has always had an inferiority complex. What do you think that big wall is about. Even though they feel they have the superior culture , they have been dominated by the Mongols, the English, the Japanese and the US. Now the new China is arising on the world stage and Yao Ming will be It's first public face. That is why it is of utmost importance that the Chinese place Yao where he cannot fail; a team that can and will train him, a team with a respected image (2 championships will do) and a team that can win a championship in the future (yes we can)

2.For the new China to arise in the marketplace it must be seen as a place of good will, a place where the rules of trade and law are followed. For the Chinese to come this far with the appearance of agreement and back down would be counter productive. Will there be last minute demands? Of course. Will the be deal breakers? Probably not.

3.For China to lift itself out of it's fuedalistic poverty it must trade worldwide. People are distrustful of what they aren't familiar with. If Yao Ming comes to the US and becomes the personable, successful face of China to the US and then the world it could mean billions of dollars worth of trade for them. Just like movie stars providing the image for The Gap.

I think China's self interest is a lot bigger than basketball and they still get him to play for them in international games. And how much better will he be for them after a year or two in the NBA.
It's just the petty self interest that requires lawyers.

GP

 

Ever think that China shares the same thought.

I mean, did the Rockets sign any agreements, such as 'Ming is our #1 pick. End of discussion. Let's talk money.'

Much like the their Chinese counterparts, there have only been pledges and promises.

And we all know how little effort is involved in making a promise.

 

<A HREF="http://espn.go.com/nba/columns/katz_andy/1371628.html">Yao lands in Chicago, workout set</A>


The NBA passed a rule that will forbid teams

<i>..........Yao, who will turn 22 in September, is free of his Sharks' contract now that the 2001-02 season ended. His much anticipated return to the U.S. is expected to be April 30..........</i>


<A HREF="http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200204/20/eng20020420_94420.shtml">Shanghai Sharks Put Yao Ming on NBA Draft</A>

<i>
..........Last year, Yao denied the chance because he wanted to win the title for his hometown in Shanghai. His contract with the Sharks has expired as the 2001-2002 season has been called to an end........
</i>


Mango

 

I think the purpose of the trip was more to MEET and TALK with the people involved. Get to know them. I think with that said the trip was a success.

I am sure the Rockets plan to get things in writing. They still have 2 weeks before the draft.

I mean, before the trip it seemed like the Chinese were a little "stand-offish" because they did not know the Rockets intensions. Now that they have talked face to face they are comfortable with us and are ready to get down to the nitty-gritty in the contract negotiations.

I agree with the premise of getting something in writing. I think they will.

Chris

 

Happy Birthday Almu.

Money and buyout is not allowed by our rules. Ming has agreed to pay the Sharks out of pocket. It is none of our business to put in a contract. It is not allowed. Ming will have $50m in endorsements in no time. He can handle the buyout. And China will have $100Ms of dollars in advertising flooding their TVs set that broadcast Rockets games in agreement with Stern. That will be in writing to not take Ming out of the league or the advertising dollars cease.

consider for a second that the NBA has a pretty much non-negotiable contract to sign, and that FIBA is the one who officially releases Ming for the draft.

If they are confident that the Sharks are recommending that FIBA release Ming, then it is a success. After that, you have Ming sign his Uniform Player Contract.

There is nothing to for the Chinese to sign????

nothing. They are not going to sign something that says they can't recall Ming for the National Team. Ming won't sign it. But look at Wang. He is not playing with his National Team right now, and they are perfectly fine with that.

What do they sign? It's FIBA! They merely release him.

imo, it is a success because they agree with our standard contract and will release Ming to sign it.

still all the worries? my lord.

 

Almu- breathe deeply. Come on, do you think that they brought Goldberg, their lead attourney and negotiator, for a sightseeing tour? You think that Goldberg, who had the monstrous task of negotiating the new arena deal among other things, isn't aware of every single thing (and far more) that you're worried about in your first post in this thread? Do you think that the owner and the coach and the lead attourney went all the way to China to shake hands and have dinner? CD is a businessman, dude. They've been laying groundwork. I don't understand, it seems as if you have this feeling that there's a short fuse here, that if they didn't get signiatures on everything in the four days they were there then they'll just say, 'Hey, they seem like nice guys, we'll take their word for it because it went well?'

We've already seen news from one source which stated that the Rockets are looking for assurance in writing. There's another quote in the Chron that says they'll go back there if necessary. I don't see how they absolutely have to be in China in order to finish negotiations and sign assurances. I think they're going to finish their homework. I don't think they're going to draft Ming with the first pick and then hope that everything will be okay. You think you want assurances? You can bet that with offers like Jamison and the #3 on the table, they are going to be sure it's all locked down tight. (By the way, if GS is willing to trade their star and their #3 for Ming, does this give you some idea of his value?)

I'll agree with you on one thing- this IS the turning point. We're acquiring a talented, skilled 7'5" passing, shooting, shot blocking big man to a backcourt of Francis/Mobes.

 

I don't trust your mother either!

 

Nolen,

I see things working like this.
<ol><li>Sharks and the CBA send their recommendation to FIBA<li>FIBA officially releases Ming
...that's a lot of signatures right there in 1 and 2 but can't happen by us<li>I guess here I could easily be wrong about China and Rockets signing something. Maybe Goldberg gets the National Team to put in writing their schedule and we agree and sign it. note here, that Ming wants to play for the National Team. To me, this amounts to us training him, and he showing up for the same amount of practices and games as a US Olympian would. See how Wang is not playing with his National Team right now, and everyone is fine with that.<li>We draft Ming<li>Ming signs our standard contract, which requires him to attend all our games and summer programs not explicitly mentioned in 3.

<li>China signs lucrative deal with Stern for TV coverage on the condition Ming is available for every game<li>Nike, Honda, Sony, Motorola, McDonalds, and Coke sign lucrative deals with Shanghai TV on the condition Ming is available for every game.</ol>6, and 7, are the contracts that make 3 a minor hurdle, because no one is going to break contracts 6 and 7.

 

If Yao's contract is over, why are we negotiating with the Sharks???

 

I don't know why people are so quick to bang on China. The Rockets negotiating with the Sharks to get Ming isn't any different then the Rockets negotiating with Vancouver to get Francis. It just happens that the team isn't in the NBA, it's in the CBA (in China). I'm not sold on Jay Williams, and drafting Jay Williams probably means losing Mobley and Francis. Because if you trade Mobley to draft a PG (And I seriously doubt you get a big man for Mobes), and then Francis decides to walk (whether it's because you trade Mobley, or because you drafted another PG), then you're stuck rebuilding around Jay Williams, and MAYBE Griffin if HE doesn't decide to walk in a few years.

 

Do you really expect that the first time the Rockets meet with the interested parties to come away with signed agreements?

Do you think there won't be more discussions culminating in written agreements over the next few days assuming hard agreements can be reached?

 

..........Last year, Yao denied the chance because he wanted to win the title for his hometown in Shanghai. His contract with the Sharks has expired as the 2001-2002 season has been called to an end........

Depending on the way the CBA works, this might not be relevent. Just because the contract is expired doesn't mean the Sharks don't own his rights. Similar to the MLB, where a team owns the rights to a player even if he refuses to sign a contract with them. Or in the NBA, after the draft and before you sign a player, you own the rights to him even though he's not under contract.

But I would of loved hearing a report stating:

Rockets Get Assurance from China....MING WILL BE IN THE NBA THIS YEAR.

And then start talking money and buyout.


This makes no sense. China can't guarantee he'll be in the NBA if they don't agree on the money and buyout terms. This is a negotiation. That's what the two parties are doing. No one has committed to anything, but they are making progress talking to all the parties involved. I don't see the problem here.

 

Ming will have to keep his commitments to the Chinese National Team.That's fine if it does not interfere with the entire regular NBA season and the entire playoffs.Major events like the World Championship,Olympic Games,and Asian Games are held during the offseason,but matches like the tests against New Zealand were held just recently during the playoffs,I hope those other international obligations won't lead to Ming being withdrawn from the Rockets.
I think that these things will be worked out between the Rockets and China but it will still take some time.