I can't believe that so many fans here are fakers' believer.

That cheating, teammate ratting snitch can suck on one..................

 

I agree with a lot of what the original poster, not so eloquently, said.

But I do think the Lakers probably get to the WCF, or close to it. The are a very talented team. I think their leadership (part. Kobe) and toughness (part. defense) remain major questions--but their offense is so good they can overcome a lot. I think Houston (tough for sure, questions are leadership and health), SA (probably beat the Lakers w/ healthy Manu) and NO (the youngest of the talented WC teams) are major threats. Phx is a wild card if they do learn to play defense under Porter. Utah doesn't have the personelle to play defense, too un-athletic in too many positions (part he interior D), they are probably the most overrated team in th e West.

And yes Wade carried Shaq and his teammates to a championship, whereas Shaq carried Kobe and his teammates to championships. The stats (% of team production and efficiency) and playoff MVPs those years don't lie. Wade during that playoff run was the highest level of play by a non-big individual since Jordan--it is true, but whether he can ever duplicate that who knows.

Finally, Kobe has great individual basketball skills, probably the best in the world, but some people need to just accept his d*ickhead and primadonna inner selves keep's him from being the legendary player in team basketball and playoff basketball he might otherwise be.

 

I disagree with the general premise of the post because he's completely dismissing the Lakers just cause he hates them. I'm not a fan.. but I'm smart enough to realize they're a good team who was in the Finals and is getting Bynum back.

 

well, they did make the nba finals last year and they have the league mvp.


so what do you expect us to think? they are the worst team in the league and won't make the playoffs?

the thread is dumb. I prefer not to talk crap about the other teams til we actually do something in the playoffs. Being the defending WC champs puts you at #1 in the West.

 

Here are some data related to the discussion...

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/per_active_p.html
Active Playoff Leaders and Records for Player Efficiency Rating
Rank Player PER
1. Shaquille O'Neal 26.47
2. Tim Duncan 26.04
3. Tracy McGrady 24.66
4. Dirk Nowitzki 24.02
5. LeBron James 23.80
6. Dwyane Wade 23.21
7. Kevin Garnett 23.19
8. Baron Davis 22.19
9. Vince Carter 21.40
10. Kobe Bryant 21.29
11. Allen Iverson 21.23
12. Manu Ginobili 20.35
13. Ray Allen 20.14
14. Paul Pierce 20.07
15. Anfernee Hardaway 19.76
16. Steve Nash 19.54
17. Alonzo Mourning 19.18
18. Chauncey Billups 19.01
19. Chris Webber 18.87
20. Jason Kidd 18.25

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/per_active.html
Active Career Leaders and Records for Player Efficiency Rating
Rank Player PER
1. Shaquille O'Neal 27.14
2. LeBron James 25.17
3. Tim Duncan 25.10
4. Kevin Garnett 23.93
5. Dirk Nowitzki 23.92
6. Kobe Bryant 23.57
7. Tracy McGrady 23.38
8. Elton Brand 22.69
9. Pau Gasol 21.70
10. Vince Carter 21.65
11. Allen Iverson 21.42
12. Paul Pierce 21.37
13. Alonzo Mourning 21.24
14. Chris Webber 20.94
15. Grant Hill 20.88
16. Shawn Marion 20.80
17. Gilbert Arenas 20.74
18. Michael Redd 20.11
19. Steve Nash 20.07
20. Ray Allen 19.94
*note I assume Wade and Yao don't have enough qualifying games because they are not top 50.

 

this thread sucks.... lock it up lol

 

Best post in this thread so far.

 

2001 Playoffs (16 games)
SHAQ (28 yrs old)- 30.4ppg, 15.4rpg, 3.2apg, 2.4bpg, 55FG%, 53FT%, 42.3mpg.
KOBE(22 yrs old)- 29.4ppg, 7.3rpg, 6.1apg, 1.5spg, 47FG%, 82FT%, 43.4mpg.

2002 Playoffs (19 games)
SHAQ(29 yrs old)- 28.5ppg, 12.6rpg, 2.8apg, 2.5bpg, 53FG%, 65FT%, 40.8mpg.
KOBE(23yrs old)- 26.6ppg, 5.8rpg, 4.6apg, 1.4spg, 43FG%, 75FT% 43.8mpg.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2001.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2002.html

00-01 Regular Season
SHAQ(28 yrs old)- 28.7ppg, 12.7rpg, 3.7apg, 2.8bpg, 57.2FG%, 51.3FT%, 39.5mpg in 74games
KOBE(22yrs old)- 28.5ppg, 5.9rpg, 5.0apg, 1.7spg, 46.4FG%, 85.3FT%, 38.3mpg in 68games

01-02 Regular Season
SHAQ(29 yrs old)- 27.2ppg, 10.7rpg, 3.0apg, 2.0bpg, 58FG%, 55.5FT%, 36.1mpg in 67games
KOBE(23yrs old)- 25.2ppg, 5.5rpg, 5.5apg, 1.5spg, 47FG%, 83FT% 38.3mpg in 80games

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MIA/2006.html

Now the kicker....
2006 Playoffs (19 games)
SHAQ(33)- 18.4ppg, 9.8rpg, 1.7apg, 0.4spg,1.2bpg, 61FG%,37FT%, 32mpg.
WADE(24)- 28.4ppg, 5.9rpg, 5.7apg, 2.3spg,1.0bpg, 50FG%,81FT% 42mpg.

The stats are even more one sided in the NBA finals. Wade totally and completely carried his team relative to any NBA winner in the last 10 years.

Here are some other tidbits. Number of times Shaq's playoff PER > 26, 9 times (Orlando and Lakers), number of times Wade, 1 time, number of times Kobe, 0 times (in 11 tries).

 

It must be snowing in Houston because I agree with you. I think the OP is idiotic, especially coming from a Rockets fan whose team hasn't done anything this century.

If I was a Lakers fan and saw this OP, I'd post a link on the Lakers forum to show how Rockets fans are sorry losers. Fortunately, the OP doesn't represent very many of us.

When the Rockets get out of the 1st round, then we can talk smack. Or maybe if we beat them 3/4 during the regular season, the yapping can begin.

 

Well, we did beat them in 2/3 games last year. Let the yapping begin!

 

But you do know that just by being on the court with Shaq the game was a lot easier for Wade.

 

A lot of good it did us. They go to the Finals and we lose in the 1st round again. So maybe the yapping shouldn't start until the Rockets win a 1st round series.

 

Agreed

 

Good observations. I do think Kobe "looks more like" Mike (in individual skills, maybe playing 1 on 1), but Wade (in 2006) "played more like" Mike. Mike didn't settle into primarily a jump shooter (in fact didn't take many 3s, preferred going to the rim, high% mid range shots, and always seeking contact on top) and well understood the attributes, skills and values of his teammates. In all these latter respects Wade's game and leadership in the 5 on 5 team game is more like Jordan's.

Lebron in lots of ways is a cross between Magic and Jordan. Like if Magic had phenom athleticism or if Jordan was bigger and stronger. Lebron lacks both's killer instinct, competitiveness and refinement (understanding his best strengths on the court) as of yet. Not that Lebron is a slouch, he probably is the best basketball player in the world, but he isn't quite a Magic/Jordan's levels IMO because he isn't at their level in those respects.

 

There are only a few people on this board I would even consider real Rocket fans strong enough to debate a legit Laker fan in basketball.

 

Okay then, as the resident Laker fan in this thread, I'll straight up trade you Luke "Action face" Walton () for Ron Artest if you want "high basketball IQ".