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How, or if, you give thanks speaks volumes

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rtsy, Nov 25, 2010.

  1. rtsy

    rtsy Member

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    November 22, 2010
    NEWS FEATURE http://www.religionnews.com/index.php?/rnstext/how_or_if_you_give_thanks_speaks_volumes/
    How, or if, you give thanks speaks volumes
    By Daniel Burke

    (RNS) Whether it’s a mere “Rub a dub dub, thanks for the grub,” or a more solemn supplication, millions of Americans will bow their heads this Thursday in gratitude for the bounty of food before them.

    Even a murmured “Thanks be to God,” before carving the Thanksgiving turkey speaks volumes about the person praying, especially if it’s a daily habit, according to scholars.

    In fact, not only is saying grace one of the best indicators of how religious a person is, but it also has strong connections to partisan politics, according to scholars Robert Putnam and David Campbell.

    Grace, of course, is the prayer said before meals, either in thanks to a deity who generously provides the food, to the workers who prepared it, or even to the animals about to be gobbled up.

    Like many other rituals, Christians probably picked up saying grace from Judaism, according to scholars; nearly every culture has some form of mealtime prayer.

    These days, 44 percent of Americans report saying grace or a similar blessing almost every day before eating; 46 percent almost never say it, leaving just a statistical sliver in between, Putnam and Campbell report in their recently published book, “American Grace: How Religion Unites and Divides Us.”

    “We are hard-pressed to think of many other behaviors that are so common among one half the population and rare among the other half—maybe carrying a purse,” Putnam and Campbell write.

    Yet unlike wearing a purse, grace is often a private act: a quiet prayer around a kitchen table, a quick thanks in a crowded restaurant, or a bowed head before a bowl of soup.

    “Saying grace is a very personalized form of religious expression,” Campbell said in an interview. “It’s something you do in your home, with your family.”

    The privacy of saying grace—it’s not often shouted from rooftops—makes it a better measure of religious commitment than asking people if they go to church, Campbell said. Giving thanks for food isn’t generally said or done to impress the neighbors.

    But the private prayer has strong connections to public positions, especially political ones, according to Putnam and Campbell. “Indeed, few things about a person correspond as tightly to partisanship as grace saying,” the scholars write in “American Grace.”

    The more often you say grace, the more likely you are to identify with the Republican Party, Putnam and Campbell report. By turns, of course, the less you say grace, the more likely you are to identify with Democrats, the scholars said.

    But there is one big exception to the prayer-politics connection. Eighty-five percent of African Americans report saying grace daily, a far higher rate than even Mormons, evangelicals, and mainline Protestants, the runners-up in grace-saying. The rate for evangelicals, for instance, is 58 percent. Yet, blacks remain stalwarts in the Democratic Party.


    Lawrence A. Mamiya, a professor of religion and Africana studies at Vassar College and co-author of “The Black Church in the African American Experience,” said offering thanks before meals is consistent with a community bound by a history of faith and hope.

    “The whole point is to acknowledge something greater than themselves,” Mamiya said. “Even during slavery it was the belief in God that saved blacks from being utterly dehumanized.”

    And if Sunday services remain the beating heart of the black church, the plentiful meals afterwards are its lifeblood. But before the meal, of course, comes prayer, said Mamiya, a tribute to the amazing grace that leads to home.

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  2. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    Interesting Article.

    Rocket River
     
  3. Mr. Brightside

    Mr. Brightside Contributing Member

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    If you thank God when have food, does one naturally curse God when you don't have food?
     
  4. arno_ed

    arno_ed Contributing Member

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    Wow that was a shock, completely unexpected; my whole world is turned upside down.

    Thank you captain obvious (talking about the authors not the OP)
     
  5. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    It could be that some percentage of Republicans lie when asked about praying because it is expected that they would pray.

    (Not saying that's the case, but when you ask people questions about what they may perceive as moral, more than a few might lie to not appear immoral to the questioner or themselves.)
     
  6. mc mark

    mc mark Contributing Member

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    Didn't give thanks to a god, but lost count on the numerous times glasses were raised in thanks to family, friends, health and wellbeing.

    If that’s makes me a pagan (or democrat) so be it.
     
  7. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost be kind. be brave.
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    This article is so astoundingly useless.

    The information it presents is fairly well known, and the conclusion it tries to draw from it is pretty much meaningless.
     
  8. rtsy

    rtsy Member

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    Good point. It is well established that black people are liars.
     
  9. Steve_Francis_rules

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    Wtf is wrong with you?
     
  10. rtsy

    rtsy Member

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    I was poking fun at the idea that the Republicans polled were just lying and should be dismissed. If that is the case, then the same must be done for the black people polled - unless it is just some sort of bias against the Republicans.
     
  11. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member

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    Man you totally suck, your logic fail is epic here. Why don't you start by doing numbers to 10 and then ABC's, and then we'll see if we should continue.

    Good luck.
     
  12. Dairy Ashford

    Dairy Ashford Member

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    This book will change your life.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. rtsy

    rtsy Member

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    My logic is quite sound. If you are going to accuse one group of lying then you should accuse the other. And you should also accuse the white Liberals for lying about not being thankful. It would be quite embarrassing for them if someone found out they actually were.
     
  14. white lightning

    white lightning Contributing Member

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    What makes you believe the liberals aren't thankful? Is saying grace a requirement to be thankful?
     
  15. mc mark

    mc mark Contributing Member

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    apparently it is for some
     
  16. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    Only one of those two groups has a long and sordid history of hypocrisy. Family values anyone?
     
  17. rtsy

    rtsy Member

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    Why don't you read the book and you can discuss your theories with the author (or a perhaps therapist)?

    http://www.amazon.com/American-Grac...ef=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1290880990&sr=8-1-spell

    American Grace: How Religion Divides and Unites Us

    From Publishers Weekly

    This massive book eschews the narrow, monographic approach to sociological study in favor of an older, more useful model: the sweeping chronicle of national change over time. Harvard professor Putnam (Bowling Alone) and his University of Notre Dame coauthor Campbell (Why We Vote) argue two apparently contradictory theses persuasively: first, that a "new religious fault line" exists in America, a deep political polarization that has transcended denominationalism as the greatest chasm in religious life; and second, that the culture (especially its younger generation) is becoming so much more accepting of diversity that thesis #1 will not tear America apart. The bulk of the book explores in detail cultural developments--the boom of evangelicals in the 1970s and 1980s, largely concluded in the early 1990s; the rise of feminism in the pews; the liberalization of attitudes about premarital sex and homosexuality, especially among the youngest generations; and what may prove to be the most seismic shift of all: the dramatic increase of "nones," or people claiming no institutional religious affiliation. Putnam and Campbell (with their researcher, Garrett) have done the public a great service in not only producing their own mammoth survey of American religion but also drawing from many prior statistical studies, enabling readers to track mostly gradual change over time.


    From Booklist

    *Starred Review* In recent controversy over the national motto, In God we trust, Putnam and Campbell see a symptom of profound change in the national character. Using data drawn from two large surveys, the authors plumb these changes. The data show that the tempestuous sixties shook faith in religion and that the seventies and eighties incubated a strong resurgence of devotion. But the two most recent decades add another twist, as young Americans have abandoned the pews in record numbers. Still, despite recent erosion of religious commitment, Americans remain a distinctively devout people. And devotion affects life far from the sanctuary: Putnam and Campbell parse numbers that identify religious Americans as more generous, more civically engaged, and more neighborly than their secularly minded peers. But the analysis most likely to stir debate illuminates how religion has increasingly separated Republicans from Democrats, conservatives from progressives. Readers may blame the Christian Right for this new cultural fissure, but survey statistics mark liberal congregations as the most politicized. But whether looking at politics or piety, the authors complement their statistical analysis with colorful vignettes, humanizing their numbers with episodes from the lives of individual Protestants and Catholics, Jews and Mormons. An essential resource for anyone trying to understand twenty-first-century America. --Bryce Christensen
     
  18. Landlord Landry

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    I didn't know African American was a religion.
     
  19. Steve_Francis_rules

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    Not only is it a religion, it's a religion full of proven liars according to rtsy. :rolleyes:
     
  20. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Contributing Member
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    Or why you give thanks speaks volumes
     

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