Some people have really short memories. 6 months ago Harden went 2 for 11 in an elimination game and lost to the Spurs without Kawhi by 40 while Durant averaged 35, 8 and 5 on 70 TS% in NBA finals and you are laughing at the fact that Durant might be better?
LeBron, Curry, Durant are clear franchise players. They've each shown they are capable of leading their teams to the best regular season record and a Finals appearance as their team's best player. That's clear-cut "franchise player" territory, to me. I believe James Harden is a franchise player as well, even though he's not as proven as the other guys. I think Chris Paul used to be a franchise player a few years ago, but probably not anymore. I would apply the "franchise player" tag to Kahwi Leonard as well, although I understand arguments that he isn't as proven because he's dependent somehow on Pop's coaching/system. I think Giannis is on the trajectory of being a franchise player, but too early for him. There are some other guys with potential to be a franchise player down the line as well. So, I'd list 5 players for now -- LeBron, Curry, Durant, Harden, and Kahwi.
Yeah, recency bias is a funny thing. As a lead guy, Durant is statistically on par with anyone else. And then add his elite defensive play (legitimate DPOY candidate this year), and to me he's a clear top 2 player. I actually think he may be a more complete player then LeBron James. LeBron's passing is all-time special, but the variety of ways in which Durant can score (3-point line, mid-range, post, transition) is unmatched.
Easy to get 35/8/5 against the Cavs porous defense when you are basically given the Harrison Barnes role since teams are doubling Steph not Durant on the perimeter. Are we gonna forget about Durant's choke job against the Warriors or his poor performance against the Griz. He has had numerous playoff failures. Doing great as second fiddle on the greatest team of all time that won 73 without him is nothing noteworthy.
Passing. Durant is not even a better scorer than Lebron. Lebron scores on higher efficiency and volume. Durant isn't better than a locked in Lebron on defense either. Difference is Lebron has a much heavier load to carry than Durant so he can't focus intensely on defense.
Most answers so far make it seem like superstar = franchise player. Νοt in my opinion. there are 30 franchises while there are only a couple contenders every year. Imo franchise player is a player at a young enough age and with enough talent who a team would build around and can lead their team to some success. Franchise players right now ; Lebron, Kyrie, Gobert, Embiid, Simmons, Porzingis, Antetokounmpo, Wall, Jokic, KAT, Butler, Lillard, Westbrook, George, Durant, Curry, Griffin, Booker, Cousins, AD, Harden, Paul, Gasol, Kawhi. Maybe Gasol shouldn't be included anymore due to his old age. I didn't include Lowry Derozan and Hayward because I don't think they deserve it. Now there is a case for Drummond if he keeps improving like he has this year. But because I don't really believe in his work ethic yet he's not included in my list. Young players like Turner, Russell, Ingram, Brown, Tatum etc haven't shown enough.
John Wall is the worst player that I would call a franchise player. Everyone better than him is also a franchise player.
Durant is in 78th percentile among forwards in assist%, according to cleaningtheglass.com. Try again. Difference in efficiency this year between the two is noise. LeBron is awesome, but Durant is a more well-rounded scorer: Here's a comparison of scoring by play type from last year: https://public.tableau.com/views/PlayTypeApp/Dashboard1?:embed=y&:loadOrderID=0&:display_count=yes Durant is above average in offensive value added for scoring of every tracked play type. LeBron is really good, but below average scoring off screens and hand offs. Also, I don't attach much importance to volume given the teammates LeBron is playing with and the teammates Durant is playing with. Without Curry the last 4 games, Durant has upped his scoring to nearly 34 a night. Will LeBron continue to score over 28 ppg when Isiah Thomas joins the team? Unlikely.
I remember that perfectly however: 1. That was a year ago. Players are not robots they will always be better or worse than before with every year. 2. That was just 1 game how many ganes did they play last year? Ever hear of the term "sample size"? Who was the MVP frontrunner last year, Harden or KD? KD even got injured last year wtf, maybe if you rested Harden for half a season and gave him Klay, Curry and Green for teammates he would average more than 35, 8 and 5. The fact that you would actually use one single game out of the hundreds he has played to discredit Harden tells me all I need to know about your level of bball knowledge
Durant is in his prime, Lebron is starting to show his age its not really fair to compare them maybe if Lebron was still in Miami then it would be a fair comparison between the two. Sure KD has been playing great however he is also on a stacked team that is full of high IQ bball players who are great 3 pt shooters and willing passers. Lebron is in a mess of his own making he chased out a competent coach and put in his own man who is probably half baked so now almost all of their plays are freestyles and isos in contrast to KD who is playing on a proven system. Since KD has better teammates and better plays its really no wonder he will post better stats. Also while KD is 78th percentile for his position he is not more well rounded than Lebron because he can't pass as well as Lebron. Lebron is good enough to play pg can KD do that? I would also argue that Lebron is better defensively because he can guard guys 1-5, in his hey day he locked up Rose and then went right at Dirk in the Finals. I think KD is the better scorer though esp in the clutch, I think both of them are improved versions of Kobe and Magic.
1- Lebron. Put him on almost any team and you could contend. 2,3,4,etc Harden, curry , durcan't, leonard Build around them and you could contend.
4. Durant, Harden, CP3, Lebron. Maybe Curry. A franchise player is basically: they play for your team = 50 win season. Kawhi has Pop and is basically Klay Thompson. I love Kawhi, but man his is SOOOOO overrated because he plays for the Spurs. Harden, Durant, CP3 and Lebron can drag dead corpses to 50 win seasons. On the cusp will be Ben Simmons, and Fox/Lonzo if they ever figure out how to shoot.
Depends on your definition of course. I think there's a difference between a superstar and a franchise player. For me, a franchise player would be players with MVP talent that you can build around who can or have taken on that responsibility. Harden Lebron Westbrook Durant Curry Embiid Giannis Anthony Davis As for superstars, there's just three to me. Superstar being franchise player with significant playoff success. Lebron Curry Durant
One player to win as many games as possible with similar surrounding talent. 1. James Harden 2. Lebron James 3. Kevin Durant 4. Kawhi Leonard 5. Chris Paul 6. Steph Curry
Lebron is the only player (ever) that you could put on the worst team in the league and they are contenders. Other than that you have a bunch of players you could build around Durant, Harden, Embiid (soon), Giannis, CP3, Leonard, Curry
This reminds of the ol kobestan tbh, lebron has never been a great all round shooter, but he is much better at getting a higher percentage shot, ie, durant will shoot way above league average from midrange at about 50%, lebron will get a layup instead and shoot it at league average of about 70% or whatever it is. That's why he's a more efficient scorer, and there's basically nothing you can do about it, hence that giant blob near the rim, which is why he's been considered the best player in the nba for years. His fixed shooting motion has meant he's now a very good 3 point shooter, so while sure Durant is better at shooting regardless of what spot he's at, Lebron is much better at getting to the spot he wants to shoot from, it doesn't matter if they're not great at a couple (or even more) types of shots, if the defense can't force them to take them, it's why players who can dictate their own offense get called "dominant" (lebron, shaq etc). Also being 78th percentile in assists amongst small forwards is pretty clearly behind the guy whose 100th percentile, and not particularly good in a position that is saturated by 3 and d guys that can't playmake to save their lives, he's better than most, he's arguably the second best player in the nba, but no, he's not past lebron, and he's probably further behind this year than he was last year given that lebron's shooting is the most improved variable by either this season.
I never said he was better than LeBron. I said I think he might be a more complete player. Granted, sort of a subjective statement, which is why I said "I think he may be ..." rather than "he is absolutely a more ...". There are some areas of LeBron's game where I can say "He is kind of average or mediocre at that." I feel there aren't as many of those areas for Durant. Now, greatness is all about maximizing your strengths, which LeBron knows how to do -- especially in the high leverage moments down the stretch of a game. So I have no problem whatsoever with people proclaiming him the league's best player.
howbout Lebron can carry a team by himself. KD? not.. not a better definition of a complete player who can do everything right? lead, playmake, score, defend, rebound
