So by declaring which WR/RB/TE was INELIGIBLE, did that allow him to send any OL out on a route? I missed the game, so I didn't see how Baltimore reacted on the field.
They had an extra receiver out there and only 4 OL. So you still have to guard just as many opposing receivers. There's just an extra guy out there basically doing nothing but causing causing confusion, and one fewer OL to protect Brady. So if you have your normal defense out there, instead of seeing 5 potential receivers, you see 6 and then have to figure out which one to ignore. I can completely see why this would mess up a defense that's never seen that before, especially if the other team runs up to the line and snaps the ball before the defense can even determine where the ineligible guy is on the field. I suspect if they review the rule, they will make this illegal or require the defense to have a certain amount of time to make changes or whatnot. That said, once identified, the advantage goes to the defense because the QB has less protection. So you can't run it too much because it will get the QB killed.
This is the thing exactly. The rule will likely be changed in some manner. They may do something where the defense has to be allowed a certain amount of time to react. Comparing this to play action and stuff is just ridiculous. The rules of the game regarding eligible receivers are designed so you know who is eligible to catch a downfield pass and then it's up to you to prevent it. Exploiting it like this isn't cheating, but it's a loophole that will be closed. There is no way to protect against it. It's like a "nano-blitz" in Madden where you are abusing the game code.
Are defenses allowed more time to adjust when a tackle is declared eligible? If not, why would there need to be more time when a WR is declared ineligible? I agree it worked because its never been done before... but its not really a "loop-hole" that would need closing, especially since this actually puts the defense at an advantage if they recognize it. Did they close any loopholes when the Wildcat was instituted, and teams didn't know who to guard? Defenses will adjust... chances are, we never see it run effectively again.
They reacted by continuing to cover that player as a receiver, which led to one-on-one matchups for Gronk and other receivers.
Basically you can have a QB and 10 receivers out there Then Declare 5 ineligible . . . . .a different 5 . .. . every other play Interesting going forward Seems you can basically Draft 10 Gronks/Watts Big Dude who can catch . . . and kind of block based on size Then line them up left to right and run that strategy . .. correct? The guy at the center is eligible but the guards are not and the slot receivers are ineligible Next play will be the revers and the next will be a different combo . . .. . Is this correct? Rocket River
Is is the receiver that is in the 5th line spot [tackle]. . . .or the one in the slot . .or the one that is on the other side of the line? Rocket River
Theoretically, you could do that... but then you'd have to expect that the guys you are actually leaving in to block... can actually block. The Pats still had 4 real o-lineman there... and for at least one of the plays, their backup TE was a lineman. Additionally, if you're on defense, the interior defensive lineman's assignments don't change... they still go after the QB every single play. Chances are, these pseudo-lineman you have will not be able to make any sort of consistent pocket/containment (if they can, then you basically have a good O-lineman on your hands). This all has its roots in the inception/development of the TE to begin with... it was a novel introduction, and you can see why coaches like Belicheck love TE's because of the versatility and types of plays you can run with them (and on the flip-side, why gimmick offenses like the run and shoot eventually died off).
Not quite - there are rules about where eligible and ineligible players have to be lined up. That's where all those "illegal formation" rules come into play. You can do some quirky stuff - as I posted earlier with Oregon, the snapper was eligible and caught a 2pt conversion. But there are at least some rules so it's not just a free for all where you can pick any 5 guys to be eligible vs not. <iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/G0ni2oWU3JQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
its not a loophole defense could take care of this, there is one less player in the O-line. when the defense knows what to do in this case, they just send blitz with 6 guys, and there is no way the QB is not going to be pressured, because it would be 6 defense players against 4 in the offensive, and even you can double a player, because you dont have to worry about WR, because he cant catch it, he can go all the way to the endzone, but it doesnt matter, because it would be a penalty, if they throw them to him. so its 6 vs 4 in the line of scrimmage, imaging of JJ Watt is one of the 6, and they use a double team against Watt, then its 5 guys against 2, so there is no way they cant stop the pass rusher for going freely to get the QB. and they got 5 WRs vs 5 players on the secondary, so its not like a WR gets open. also, if the defense doesnt know who to cover, you can call timeout and plan the play, and then the next time that happens, the defense already knows what to do, and its not a advantage to the offense, so why changed the rule.
This was posted in the other Patriots cheating thread, but according to Dungy, the Patriots may in fact have been cheating. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...s-to-restrict-new-englands-substitution-game/ Excerpt: “The NFL is going to have to do something about the Patriots’ ineligible-eligible substitution game,” former NFL head coach and current NBC Sports analyst Tony Dungy told PFT by email on Friday. “It is nothing but an intent to deceive and they are doing it very well. They’re reporting so fast and going so quickly the defense can’t respond. In fact, the officials can’t keep up.” Dungy believes the officials missed a pair of penalties with this maneuver during the postseason. “In the Baltimore game, [Shane] Vereen reported as ineligible several times,” Dungy explained. “If he stays in the game he must report again and continue to be ineligible. He must come out of the game for one play or there has to be a time out for him to play as an eligible receiver. On the touchdown drive Vereen played one play as ineligible and then played the next play in an eligible position. There should have been a penalty.” The officials also missed a penalty in the game against the Colts, according to Dungy. “[Nate] Solder reported as eligible correctly but [receiver Brandon] LaFell lined up on the line of scrimmage as if Solder was a tackle,” Dungy said. “There should have been a penalty for illegal formation. But it happened too fast for the officials.” The problem is that the Patriots often are taking a legal maneuver and combining it with a hurry-up offense to confuse both the defense and the officials. At field level, the audio from the referee’s microphone isn’t as clear as it is for folks in the seats or who are watching the game at home. Along with the overall confusion that arises when a team tries to snap the ball quickly, it becomes too much for a defense to fairly process — which is one of the reasons New England does it.
This to me is the biggest problem. The officials have to have a chance to figure out who the receivers are, or you get into all sorts of situations with illegal men downfield and illegal formations that makes it basically impossible for a defense to defend. Also, as far as I knew, the only time a player has to report as being an eligible receiver is when he's wearing an ineligible number (50-79, 90-99). I had no idea, as Dungy was explaining, that someone with an eligible number had to report as ineligible. I thought it just depended on where he was lined up in the formation. i.e. you have to have 7 guys on the line of scrimmage, the 5 interior guys (no matter where they are lined up on the field) are ineligible and the 2 outside guys are eligible (no matter their number).
what about the Eagles-chip kelly hurry-up offense, if they only are taking around 20 secs to get up, run to the line of scrimmage, then line up correctly and start the play, then the refs cant keep up either if a receiver or O-line is in right formation, why nobody says nothing about it? why they dont think that is an advantage to the offense too?
Didn't sound like that to me. Sounds like the refs problem. If Harden's eurostep is traveling, that isn't cheating, that's bad officiating.
The refs don't have a problem keeping up with hurry-up offenses if normal people are eligible. The formation rules are pretty standard for where you can and can't be lined up. What is your definition of cheating? If you define it as knowingly doing things you're not supposed to do, then it would still quality. If a guy has to report as eligible and he doesn't, it's still cheating even if he isn't caught. It sounds like, in your definition, no one can ever cheat because if its not caught, it's just the refs' fault.
Seriously. Doing something g that violates the rules and adding deception to hide it is cheating even if the referees miss it
To me cheating means you've done something that you're liable for that referees cant oversee. If you have secret practice tapes of the opponent that's cheating and you should be penalized. If you pay Joe Smith under the table, that's cheating, you should be penalized. If you flop in the NBA or grab someone's nuts in a pile that's just part of the game. A player or coach is going to do what it takes to win on the field. Those are penalties in my book.
So if you're taking a test and copy off your neighbor's answers, but the teacher doesn't notice, you didn't cheat?
I'm talking sports. This isn't HISD.org, breh. When a player fouls someone it's a penalty or missed penalty, not cheating, regardless of if the refs sees it or not. Stop playing pee-pee games with yourself.
