I think you guys left out Ali as one of the most dominant in his sport. And what about Martina in tennis? And yeah, Rice was great, not just in running routes and catching the ball, but also in shedding tackles especially when he smelled the end zone. But it is hard for me to say that a wide receiver is the most dominant player in football. It's like saying a non-pitcher is the most dominant DEFENSIVE player in baseball. He is the most dominant at his position, no doubt, ever.
Ali is unquestionably the greatest boxer I have ever seen...and, more, the greatest actual 'hero' of any athlete I ever heard of, but as to most dominant, there are many old-timers who swear by Robinson, some who say Louis' record speaks for itself, etc. If we are going on ability, Ali is the best boxer by a mile, IMO, but his later career was too full of beatings and semi-beatings at the hands of lesser men to be called the most dominant. Martina is the most dominant tennis player ever, way more dominant than Sampras, who has competition from the likes of Bjorg and Laver among male tennis players, and Becker in his prime had as much ability, if coupled with a strange sense of only playing up to it when down 2 sets and 3 games... In terms of wide reciever, I would usually agree...but it should be noted that, aside from qb's, and often even including them, if you had asked GM's around the league for a 7 or 8 year period during his prime, who is the one offensive player you'd most like to have/least like to face, Jerry Rice would have won hands down. He made the biggest difference, and especially when it mattered most; for all of his regular season records, he is even more dominant on the post-season records, won one Super Bowl MVP, and should have won another ( they gave it to Montana for The Drive...an argument can be made either way, but Rice had gone off for something like 2 TD's and near nearly 200 yards in what was basically a defensive game)...What he did to the record books ought to be illegal, and he made it look easy.
LOL, Good one. By the way, I am being sarcastic about Rice. He is pretty good. But Jordan dominated the game offensively, he was literally unstoppable. And he filled the seats. I never got excited about watching Rice play. I don't watch Rice highlights and think they are amazing.
Sadly, I saw way too much of Rice in his prime. As a long suffering Atlanta Falcons fan I grew up watching...and utterly despising Jerry Rice. Twice a year, every ****ing year I watched this man....no this machine chew up our secondary like it was a pork chop. He was absolutely unguardable. We tried everything to stop him, hell even just contain him but it was no use. He was truly a god on the field. I hate him to this day, but respect his game even more.
Mr. C... A few more points, re: dominance, wider recievers, etc. When Jerry Rice broke into the league, the record for career recpetions was around 800, by Art Monk, who finally retired a few years later with 940...Jerry Rice currently has 1, 456. In 2nd place all time is Chris Carter with 1, 115...a difference of over 300, or over 25% of the 2nd place total. Okay, but he's just a wide reciever, right? Well Emmitt Smith recently broke Payton's all time rushing yards record with 17, 162 yards...Jerry Rice has 21, 597 yards recieving... When Rice broke in the all time touchdown record, for any player, was Jim Brown's 126...Jerry Rice currently has 203...Think about that. Smith is 2nd all time now, with 162...more than 40 fewer than Rice...In fact, when Rice broke in the top 10 all timers were all running backs...He leads the NFL all time, in the single most important individual statistic, touchdowns, by roughly 25% of the 2nd place total...Think about it... What would Jordan have to do to the NBA record books to score 25% more than the all time 2nd place scorer, assuming he were the all time leader? That is dominance.
Not to take away from Jerry Rice(It is obvious that he is the greatest receiver ever, and one of the better athletes of our era), but how many rings does he have to show for it all? I know he had the one between the Cowboys 1st and 2nd, 3rd, was he on any of the Montana teams? Forgive me for not knowing...I just don't really like pro football.
lets see him come back next year to play for phil one last time and show kobe how to REALLY be Mike!!!!
The one where they don't like pro football. Anyway...I guess he won 3...right? Catching passes from two of the best QB's of all time, he won as many rings as MJ did through his first tour of the league. Again, I don't mean to take away from Rice, and I also realize that they play different sports...I just think it is stupid to brush MJ off as a completely inferior athlete to Rice, Wilt, etc... I see that we have now entered pure athleticism into the debate...Bo or Deion ever dunk from the free throw line?
I think Rice was on the 49er team that beat the Dolphins in Super Bowl XIX but that might have been before his time. He definitely won 3 rings with them. Getting back to Jordan: He was the greatest basketball player, in my opinion, to play but I got really sick of his ego. After he pushed Bryon Russell to the ground to hit that game winning shot to give him and the Bulls their 6th ring, the man should have gone out right then and there and NOT even think about coming back and play. Yet, he takes this storybook ending and tries to get the Wizards into the playoffs. The reason was because his ego. I thought it was so funny to read all these media types proclaiming the Wizards not only to make the playoffs but to reach the finals! LOL! I am glad that the Wizards never made it to the playoffs with him playing. I guess that should knock old MJ's ego down a couple of notches.
Bo Jackson was clearly the greatest athlete of our era. Most dominant athlete of our era? First, take out the minor sports...Hockey and Golf...who cares who dominates these sports? If you're going to include every sport, then the most dominant guy is that wrestler who had that winning streak throughout his entire college career. Only the 3 big sports should be considered for having the Most Dominant Player. If Bo kept going, he probably would have been the most dominant player as well, going to the All-Star game in 2 major sports is a huge deal. Since he got hurt though, he does not fall into the dominant argument. Out of the 3 big sports, (MLB, NFL, NBA), only one player has owned a league for at least a decade, and that guy is Michael Jordan. Jordan not only was the best player in the league, he also won the rings. In the other sports, the best player doesn't always win the rings. Jerry Rice was the best WR in the league, but his position limits him from being called the most dominant. In the NFL, I'd say the only "dominant" players are QB's and RB's. Barry Sanders was the most dominant RB in the league, and Brett Favre was the most dominant QB in the league. Both players were/are awesome, but they each have their own flaws. Michael Jordan was a flawless player that dominated his league for 6+ years. He was the most dominant of our era, but definitely not the greatest athlete. Bo Jackson was awesome at 2 sports, MJ was just a 1 sport pony...
1) Don't get how hockey equates to golf. One requires significant athletic ability, like baseball or basketball, one requires skill. 2) I don't get the position limitation argument re:Rice...I agree that normally it precludes a wide reciever from having the impact of a qb or rb...but it didn't preclude Rice from gaining more yards or scoring more touchdowns, (two important parts of football, no?) than any other player regardless of position. How does his position limit his status when it didn't limit his production? If he merely put up better numbers than other wide recievers, but inferior to those of the more 'dominant' running backs, I'd agree...but he blows away everybody, including running backs. It would be like saying that Alex Rodriguez cannot be considered for best hitter in baseball because he doesn't play a position normally assosciated with offensive dominance. 3) Considering that Joe Montana is widely considered to be the best qb ever, how can you not consider him the best of his era?
The way that I have always defined pure athleticism is a combination of many purely athletic feats : Basically how high you can jump, how fast you can run, and how strong you are. Jordan was probably as well-rounded in these three areas as anyone. Now, I wouldn't consider anyone who plays more than one sport a great athlete just because they play more than one sport...maybe a versatile athlete, but not necessarily a great athlete. Also, I don't know about a 4.4, but he was probably close early in his career.
MacBeth 1) I only mention Hockey and Golf because Gretzky and Woods have been mentioned in this thread. I agree that hockey is definitely a much more athletic sport. 2) The reason I limit a WR is because they don't get the touches that a QB or RB normally gets. I compare a WR to a SP in baseball. On a good day, Rice would maybe touch the ball 6-9 times in a game. Compare that to the 20 times a good RB usually gets and that takes away from a WR being a "dominant NFL player" in my opinion. I also want to say that Jerry Rice is in my top 3 of favorite NFL players. His work ethic is the best out of any athlete in the major sports. He's a dominant WR, but I think his position carries more similarities to that of a starting pitcher in the MLB. 3) Joe Montana is also another favorite of mine. I only lower his rating amongst the greatest ever because he had great tools around him (Rice, Taylor, Craig, etc), much better tools than Brett Favre. Joe Montana was the perfect fit for the 49er system. I don't think you could plug him into any offense and have success, I do think Brett Favre would play well for any offense in the league. ----------------------- vj Bo Jackson was faster and stronger than Jordan. I'm pretty sure he could hold his own jumping wise as well...have you ever seen the highlight of him running/jumping up an outfield wall?
No, I haven't. But...how much faster than Jordan could Bo be(I won't even argue stronger...I think it's a given)? I mean, the more I think about it, the more I think that MJ probably did have a 4.4 40 early in his career. Anyway...There's really no point in arguing Bo/Babe/Thorpe/Rice/Ali/Pele vs. MJ. Arguing between sports is even more meritless than arguing between positions.
Answer: A lot. Not even close. Bo was a blur. He ran, I believe, a 4.22 40, or thereabouts. And, no, I doubt Jordan would have run 4.4...Probably more in the 4.6 range..Still very, very fast for 6-6, but nowhere near Bo. Another all around athlete that deserves mention, as much as I hate him, is Dave Winfield. Could have turned pro in 3 sports.
This I doubt. There are 6'4 285 pound high schoolers who run a 4.6-4.7. This is no middle-of-the-road high school athlete. We're talking about a world class athlete.
