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Frum: Five Tasks

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by rimrocker, Jun 4, 2013.

  1. rimrocker

    rimrocker Contributing Member

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    David Frum keeps challengingthe GOP orthodoxy. Here he is trying to reform the Republican Party/Conservatism:

    Unfortunately, the Republican Party is not close to going anywhere near these suggestions.

    Looking at #1, if you see the problem before the solution (TAX CUTS!). it compels you to look for answers. Once you do that, you are suddenly confronted with what can and should be done, including government action. Much preferable to pretend the invisible hand and TAX CUTS! solve all problems.

    #2: I'm more concerned that so many people will identify themselves with the interests of oligarchy without being paid, without even being conscious that this is what they are doing. Too late David. Already happened. The question is how to delink the party and party supportters from this mindset? It's not happening anytime soon.

    #3: The environment is supported by liberals and liberal hippies at that. One of the basic pillars of modern conservatism is doing things that piss liberals off. Therefore, screw the environment, I'm proudly driving my monster SUV and driving a little too close to bicyclists. In the meantime, the fossil fuel industry is laughing on the way to the bank (See #2) and stupid Al Gore is fat and lives in big house.

    #4: Really? That may be sound advice, but the reality is nowhere close. The House Leadership goes out of the way to have regular and routine Obamacare revocation votes. Plus, there was too much calculated ramping up in opposition to put it back in a bottle now. The Republican base will be against Obamacare and any politician who tries to make peace with it for a generation or more.

    #5: Too late again. And too late for Hillary. Maybe, just maybe, you could not absolutely demonize the Dem candidate in 2020 or 2024, but I doubt it. Same for denigrating the functions and institutions of government. Any softening on these topics is akin to unconditional surrender. Not happening soon.

    One thing I'd like to see is for Democrats to start taking more truly Liberal stances on issues. The dynamic over the last 30-35 years has been for Dems to follow Repubs to the right so that now we have a situation where Dems do not want to go any further right and Repubs keep going to the crazy part of the spectrum to be different from those Godforsaken emo Liberals. If Dems move a little to the left, it may clear up some reasonably sensible ground for reformists Repubs to claim.

    Regardless, we cannot continue to function with a political party as pathologically opposed to governing as the current Republican Party is and something (what, I don't know) has to change.
     
  2. mc mark

    mc mark Contributing Member

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    Excellent post rim

    Of course it will be ignored by the crazies.

    Did you see this report from yesterday as well?

    The Words That Young People Associate With Republicans Are 'Racist,' 'Rigid,' 'Closed-Minded' And 'Old-Fashioned'


    College Republicans warned their party about its dire lack of appeal to young voters Monday, in another excruciatingly detailed report, warning that the GOP must change or die.

    The new 95-page report, which was compiled by the College National Republican Committee, describes the party's challenge with Millennial voters — both when it comes to reaching them and messaging in a way that connects with them. The report is based on in-depth research from two separate surveys and subsequent focus groups conducted by The Winston Group.

    Some of the more brutal details:

    In January, the CNRC asked identified "winnable" young people who had voted for Obama, the words that came to mind when hearing the words "Republican Party." Four of the most common responses: "closed-minded, racist, rigid, old-fashioned." Democrats, by contrast, were "tolerant," "diverse," and "open-minded."

    Young voters don't consider elected officials to be the Republican Party's leaders. A focus group in Ohio selected Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, and Bill O'Reilly as the most iconic figures they identify with the GOP. By contrast, they identified Barack Obama, the Clintons, and Nancy Pelosi, along with other prominent current and former elected officials.

    The report accused Republicans of not having any "substance behind" a vague message of economic growth. "Economic growth and opportunity policies cannot just be about tax cuts and spending cuts," the report says. It needs to be backed up with specific policy prescriptions on health care, immigration, and education.

    On immigration, the report concludes that young Latino voters think the GOP "couldn't care less" about them.

    Republicans need to drop their "big government" argument against policies, according to the report. "When Republicans proudly say they are going to take on President Obama’s 'big-government policies,' many young people shrug their shoulders, unsure what we mean by 'big government' and exactly how that crusade will make their lives better," the report says.


    the full report
     
  3. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    I think the list is pretty good, but 'shibboleth' should never be used twice in the same piece, no matter how cool a word it may be.
     
  4. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    I agree, but can I use shadenfreude at least once for the joy the OP brings me?
     
  5. Commodore

    Commodore Contributing Member

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    Frum only gets attention/money if he bashes his own side. There is a small niche market for useful idiots, professional concern trolls. Both sides have them.

    You win by offering a choice, not an echo.

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2013/06/05/the_libertarian_populist_agenda_118694.html

     
  6. NMS is the Best

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    #6. How about admitting the Iraq war was a mistake and trying not to appear like you are foaming at the mouth to get US into another war? Oh wait - David Frum will not ever do that because he is a bonafide Neo-Con who loves war. He loves people like Rick Santorum who practically said he would bomb Iran as President...
     
  7. aeolus13

    aeolus13 Contributing Member

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    Instead of calling him names, why don't you point out which of his points you think are wrong?

    1. Do you think tax credits should be the only conservative policy tool?
    2. Do you think rising income inequality is not a problem?
    3. Do you think AGW is fake?
    4. Do you think universal coverage isn't a worthy goal?
    5. Do you think we don't need our political institutions to work?
     
  8. Commodore

    Commodore Contributing Member

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    no, and they aren't (and the mindset of "tooling" with the country is not conservative)

    lack of income mobility is a problem

    yes

    not from the state no

    only where they can and should
     
  9. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    I'm going to step in for El Commodore, he's indisposed at the moment.

    1. No taxes, ever.
    2. That's life, work harder.
    3. When environmentalism is profitable, that will take care of it.
    4. Universal coverage exists for everyone that can afford it.
    5. Capitalism solves all problems.
     

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