Former Muslim says that ISIS represents true Islam

Yes, Phat, the Muslims should get together and rewrite the text which they believe is the literal word of God.

 

Basically do what Christianity did.

 

That goes to the point that ISIS is being opposed by the Muslims, even other extremists. So far both the victims and the ones in the front line against ISIS are Muslims so it is incorrect to say that Muslims aren't doing much about ISIS. It is mostly Muslims who are doing something about ISIS.

True I agree religion is a great motivator to get people to die that said the landscape of the Middle East is far more complex than just saying they are all wild eyed fanatics. For one those wild eyed fanatics have killed each other far more than they have killed non-Muslims. Al Sadr and Al Baghdadi probably both want an Islamic Empire but that doesn't mean they want the same Islamic Empire.

None of that is to say that these are good guys. You're right what we would consider good guys are few and far between in the Middle East but this shows that the conflict is far more than the idea that this is a battle between the secular West and Islam. If anything this is a battle within Islam that we have been sucked into.

Yes very likely true and one of the reasons why I brought up in the other thread that this is an outgrowth from our invasion and occupation of Iraq. The ham handed de-Baathication of Iraq left many who could've rebuilt the Iraqi army back into a competent force with nothing to do but join the extremists. The inability of an Iraqi government to address the Sunnis' concerns caused them to have little willingness to fight for Iraq or in many cases joint with extremists Sunnis against the Iraq government. This is why I've said that until the Iraqis can actually form a government that most of them will be willing to fight for the place is going to be a black hole that keeps on sucking blood and treasure.

Of course but this goes further. Particularly here in the US and other Western countries our biggest asset in rooting out extremists is to have the Muslim community here turn in extremists. How encouraging though is it to Muslims when they continually hear Non-Muslims saying their religion is the problem and that it is evil and responsible for all of the problems in the world?

You don't have to like Islam to understand that most Muslims aren't evil or that we need the cooperation of Muslims to fight the ones who actually are evil.

Yes exactly.

 

Most protests are organized to have an actual goal they advocate - maybe it's getting out of Iraq, or maybe it's banning abortions, or maybe it's calling for a higher minimum wage. What the heck is a protest against IS supposed to represent? "I don't like IS?" Great. Get in line. Now what? That is a much more difficult topic.

 

The idea that the average Muslim needs to show that they "stand against IS" is just as meaningless as someone who clicks on some political Facebook page and thinks they've changed something. "I stand against breast cancer." "I stand in favor of preserving our wildlife." Meaningless platitudes with minimal political value.

 

So how is protesting against a cartoon furthering "an actual goal they advocate" any more than protesting against IS?

 

Because they can advocate that Denmark or France, or the West in general, can ban the cartoon.

 

They can advocate, but not anymore than they and/or anyone in the West can advocate that IS stop killing. And that would actually be a worthwhile cause, rather than outrage over a cartoon.

Your argument doesn't make any sense.

 

Your government won't participate in air strikes. WTF?

 

You should start a protest against the lack of protest by Muslims in Germany. Sounds like a worthwhile cause.

 

You are trying hard, but you are just a letter and a number. Your posts don't find the attention you would like to get for them.

 

Thanks Dr. Phil. Now tell me you love me.

 

The posts by the usual suspects are noted:

g1184: Desperate, unfunny attempts to derail the thread, not addressing the argument that is presented in the OP at all.

Exiled: Let's blame it on Israel (even if IS acts in the name of Islam - must be Israel's fault)

 

Sure, they can. The people who don't like the cartoons can advocate that the Western governments ban the cartoons. That is easy.

But what do you protest about IS? The act of protesting IS in and of itself is utterly meaningless - it's taking that act and turning it into something which can end IS which is what counts. The problem however is that no one, much less ordinary Muslims, knows what that "something" is. As long as that's true, there's not much point in holding a protest aside from showing "Hey, I care" - hence why I compared it to those people who click to stop world hunger on Facebook.

 

First of all, they are not "advocating", they are expressing outrage. Secondly, their chance of Western governments banning cartoons is about as high as IS stopping to slaughter people because of a protest. Zero.

But ultimately, many Muslims want what IS does: Sharia instituted - including severe limitations to freedom of expression. That is why they are not protesting IS, but protesting the cartoons.

What do many Muslims and IS have in common? They are outraged about the cartoons. What else do they have in common? They want Sharia.

 

I'm flattered you've been keeping track. you do love me.

I don't, however, think you're very sincere about the insincerity of Muslims that say they oppose IS because they won't take to the streets. I know you've brought it up multiple times, and it seems like something you care about.

but ... if you did care, then why haven't you taken to the streets?

 

Breaking: Despite a non-existent one-man protest, German officials recognize efforts of Muslim community against IS.

 

sigh ...

Arab allies pledge to fight Islamic State group
link: http://news.yahoo.com/kerry-press-mideast-allies-anti-fight-110241806.html

 

Notable: Turkey not part of the alliance.