oh, and Serbia? but here you are cheer-leading again. I'll be more inclusive. Reject all forms of Abrahamic repression. it's really that simple.
Yes yes yes, "out of context", not the true meaning, misunderstood, they read it wrong, it's all a metaphor, etc etc. Been there, done that, not interested, thanks
I am not here to defend the Catholic or Protestant church. But you trying to act like you know anything about the Rwandan genocide while saying that it was "fueled by Judeo-Christian ideology" (wth is that supposed to be, anyway?) is ridiculous. Christians and Jews are not killing people over cartoons right now. Christians and Jews are not stoning homosexuals and adulterers, and this is not the law in non-Muslim countries. Christians and Jews are not restricting the rights of women anywhere close to the extent it is the case in many Muslim countries. As you cannot refute that, you come up with made-up crap about a conflict you know zilch about.
Have to disagree there, I very much respect dmc89's views on the issue. The way he interprets it, I have absolutely no problem with the religion. The problem is that too many interpret it very differently, and the interpretation of those many is on the rise (as Mathloom explained, and it makes sense, largely fueled by Saudis financing madrassas and Islamic literature around the world).
Yeah, well, this is what the scholars say. Religion played a huge part. In fact, I could detail how the Catholic Church through its' promotion of ethnic division in its teachings created the framework for genocide, but really all you have to do is hear General Dallaire speak about the topic, read his book Shake Hands with the Devil, do a research paper on it, then rant on and on about how nobody knows anything except for you and Wikipedia. Or you can just say it. You contain multitudes and you contradict yourself. really, i don't give a s*** if you are a cheerleader (obviously you are), but it would go a long way towards explaining your fixation on Islam.
I've been religion-phobic for years now -- are there any that don't have some weird/ creepy **** going on?
That's what I mean, people can show up here and give us a million different ways to look at it, but it changes nothing about the end-result we're seeing. I'm not interested in other people's ability to find other meanings in it, religious cherry-picking and white-washing has been going on for a millenia. The problem lies in the fact that so many do not. Ambiguous at its core, it leads to unnecessary and pointless violence, and a problem we need to fix.
Agreed, although I have no idea how it could be fixed, other than some charismatic leader coming up in the Muslim world that unites people behind him/her and a more moderate interpretation.
I have 2 ideas of how it will be fixed. 1) The Abrahamic/Western faiths die out naturally like so many other failed religions (this is the most likely, as father time has conquered all beliefs of men). 2) We're visited by something from outerspace or an actual God that tells us to knock it the f*** off. (slightly less likely)
For someone who prides himself on thinking (and criticizes religionists for there lack thereof), you show a remarkable aversion to wanting to think about arguments. I guess if your minds made it, its made up.
I've never gone out of my way to personally insult you ATW, though I notice that once you lose the plot you either claim you are drunk, or resort to underhanded ad hominem attacks. To which all I can say is, relax smile have a good day oh and i guess it'd be nice if you responded to the damn points, but I don't really expect that from you at this point.
Maybe you should consider that I've been "thinking" about this for a decade or so on and off the BBS. Like I said, my disinterest in someone else's interpretation of the Quran is rooted in the fact that it does not pertain to the OP, nor does it change anything about the problem we're dealing with.
I think that ambiguity is intentionally there to test whether human beings are capable of living together without resorting to violence. Rather than fret about which side is the winner (atheist or some type of thiest), be the best person you can by learning all there is to know, by being at one: with yourself, other human beings, the world around you, and your belief system; and hopefully you'll be at peace before you enter an eternal void or meet a supernatural being.
It's difficult to assess what your 'thinking' has entailed, but if its anything like the article you posted, its far from a meaningful engagement. Islam is over 1400 years old, with a substantial amount of religious scholarship. There are literally thousands of scholars who've written volumes on Islam and there are many books that speak to the topic of Islam and War. As for your disinterest in someone else's interpretation, you seemed fairly dismissive of terms like 'decontextualized' or 'misunderstood'. The implication is that others are either deliberately being duplicitous or naive/ignorant as to the true meaning of their religion. As for the problem we're dealing with, let me ask simply: do you think the problem of Islamic terrorism is even somewhat exaggerated? (I've written it here before, but since 9/11 140,000 murders have occurred and Islamist terrorists have only accounted for three dozen at most. Globally, 150,000 die daily, and only 50 are a result of Islamist terrorism on average, 40 of which occur in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Iraq, and there are obvious mitigating factors to explain violence there)
That was actually a very heartfelt, thoughtful blog post. The OP, however, was lazy garbage by a guy with a reputation for such efforts (and a poster with a reputation for the same). Yes, and? Heard this a thousand times before. Does not change how I feel on the matter. A religion which can be reasonably (or hell, even slightly less than that) interpreted to call for violence is a broken moral code and has no place in civilized society. Exaggerated? Sometimes yes. Sometimes it is understated. My feeling has been, and always will be, that even 1 death in the name of a religion is too many. It is needless and unnecessary. And bringing it back to the OP, it is beyond clear that Abrahamic faiths are retrograde, outdated, and toxic. They have no place in a civilized, humanistic world. The fears of the Europeans are not unfounded, and I doubt that ATW has a racist bone in his body. His concerns are legitimate and it's getting really, really old hearing it passed off as racism and xenophobia.
