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[ESPN "Outside The Lines"] Texans' minicamp drills questioned

Discussion in 'Houston Texans' started by ron413, Feb 5, 2009.

  1. ron413

    ron413 Contributing Member

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    Any significant penalties for the Texans franchise on the horizon or is there nothing to see here?
    _________________________________________________________________

    http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/otl/news/story?id=3885900

    Illegal Contact?

    "Outside the Lines" takes an in-depth look at accusations that the Houston Texans coaching staff required players to participate in contact blocking drills last May in violation of NFL rules. See T.J. Quinn's report Sunday at 9 a.m. ET.

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    Illegal Contract Drills Caused Injury
    Texans OL Dan Stevenson alleges impermissable contract drills caused injury


    HOUSTON -- When the Houston Texans' coaching staff announced to linemen that they would be running one-on-one blocking drills during minicamp last May, the rumbling started immediately, players say.

    The NFL's rules about minicamp are spelled out in the collective bargaining agreement with the NFL Players Association: no contact, no pads.

    "There's a reason why these drills are prohibited in the offseason," said offensive guard Dan Stevenson. "Football is dangerous enough as it is."

    But several sources told ESPN that even after the team's player representatives complained to head coach Gary Kubiak, the drills continued; and by the end of minicamp, three players had suffered season-ending injuries.

    According to four players and a member of the team's front office who spoke on the condition of anonymity, Kubiak and his coaching staff conducted the drills despite the fact that players were not wearing pads. Their only protection, they said, was helmets.

    "It was a live blocking drill. There were people getting pancaked. Everyone's going as hard as he can," Stevenson said.

    Stevenson suffered a labrum tear in his shoulder that he feels might end his career.

    "I was the third offensive lineman who was done for the season, just from that drill," offensive tackle Jordan Black said. "If nobody's going to stand up, it's just going to continue."

    Black had surgery to repair a torn labrum, was released by the team in June and has since signed with the Jacksonville Jaguars. Stevenson also suffered a labrum tear in his right shoulder, and center Chukky Okobi suffered a triceps injury.

    "I felt like, for my career, my occupation, my dreams, for all this to be taken away from me, to be jeopardized not for just one season but for my entire football career for something that wasn't supposed to be done -- I was upset," Stevenson said.

    Okobi couldn't be reached for comment. Black and Stevenson said that while they accept football's injury risks, they are distressed that their seasons ended in a drill they say should not have happened. Okobi has not signed with a new club.

    Stevenson and Black have labor grievances pending against the team, and Stevenson plans to sue the Texans.

    Asked about the players' charges, team counsel Suzie Thomas wrote in an e-mail, "I am unable to comment, other than to say that information set forth & is inaccurate." Kubiak did not return calls to his office at Reliant Stadium.

    NFL and NFLPA officials said there is no specific punishment defined for a team that holds prohibited drills during a minicamp, and an NFL spokesman said the league was unaware of the complaint against the Texans until a call from ESPN.

    Stevenson's current grievance is a "non-injury" complaint that relates to the minicamp drill. A previous injury grievance was denied by the NFL Management Council. In that rejection, the NFLMC cited numerous procedural problems with Stevenson's complaint.

    One portion of the rejection letter, Stevenson said, read, "the Texans deny & that 'players were required to participate in drills which are explicitly prohibited.' "

    Once the team denied that the drill had taken place, Stevenson took a video camera into the Texans' meeting room and filmed the team's video of the workout. The video, which was provided to ESPN, shows what appears to be full-speed, full-contact drills.

    Black and former Texans lineman Fred Weary also signed notarized affidavits supporting Stevenson's description of what took place during minicamp, from the complaints of the player representatives to Stevenson's shoulder injury.
    The players said it is not uncommon for coaches on many teams to schedule such drills during minicamp, but it is unusual for coaches to proceed with the drills when players object.

    Tom DePaso, associate general counsel for the NFLPA, said the union often hears complaints about offseason drills that violate the CBA.

    "It's this classic thing in the offseason. Coaches really want to get started on the new season; and on the other hand, we need our guys to learn and they need to rest," DePaso said.

    DePaso wouldn't specifically address the grievances against the Texans or the three players who received season-ending injuries.

    "If that were the case," he said, "that would be extraordinary."


    T. J. Quinn is an investigative reporter for ESPN. He can be reached at tjquinn31@yahoo.com.
     
    #1 ron413, Feb 5, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2009
  2. jev5555

    jev5555 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    The drills were not mandatory. A player could have opted out of it. It's only until after they get injured do they complain.

    I agree with their complaint partially. Minicamps should be about strength, conditioning and learning. Not for running your blocking schemes.

    In defense of the Texans. They were under the gun last season to install a new blocking sheme...so full contact drills were probably necessary.
     
  3. desihooper

    desihooper Contributing Member
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    Kubiak was concerned with the new minicamp restrictions (fewer players/bodies allowed) to be sure. They wanted and needed to get reps on Gibbs' scheme and methods, but I hope they didn't do anything to circumvent the rules and/or bring injury to some of these "JAG"s.

    Gosh, the one thing this team doesn't need is bad press or PR going into probably the most important off-season in the team's history in terms of taking the next step!
     
  4. farrisdabis

    farrisdabis Member

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    Funny that I've never heard of this guy. He's just rattling up some controversy in order to gain sympathy for when he sues. ESPN is only running it to cause some controversy as well. This should probably die down.
     
  5. Cannonball

    Cannonball Contributing Member

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    I know who Jordan Black is and remember hoping that he'd unseat Ephraim Salaam when we signed him. I don't recall ever hearing the names of the other two.
     
  6. mrdave543

    mrdave543 Contributing Member

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    Do you really think any player that "opts-out" of a drill has a chance to make the team? Let alone guys who are probably borderline to make the team anyways. You can't just opt-out of a drill and expect the coach to sign you.

    The drills are prohibited for a reason, to avoid unnecessary injuries during practice.

    I find it funny that the texans fans complain about the texans curse of always being injured, and thats the reason they arent in playoffs etc... don't seem to care that 3 offensive lineman were done for the season, just from that drill.

    ESPN is crap for the record and this could be a non-issue/happen with all teams, but it probably has some merit.
     
  7. DieHard Rocket

    DieHard Rocket Contributing Member

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    If I'm not mistaken, mini-camp is optional for players. And they can probably choose not to partake in certain drills.

    Of course, if you're a scrub like Stevenson you have to do anything necessary to try to make the team. If he sits out those drills, he's a goner for sure.

    And the true reality is there is so much pressure in the NFL that unless you are Andre Johnson or Mario Williams, you better take part in these offseason drills if you want to play.

    I don't think his case will hold up though, based on the fact the camp isn't mandatory and that it's the NFL, period. You know the risks involved in playing football.
     
  8. moestavern19

    moestavern19 Member

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    This could come into play when the Players opt out of the current CBA after next season.
     
  9. gucci888

    gucci888 Contributing Member

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    While I agree with you, the fact is that the Texans are not even allowed to conduct these drills...mandatory or not. I don't think a whole lot will happen but the fact that Kubiak was aware of the drills and didn't stop it maybe enough for the NFL to step in and try to make an example.

    Read this post from a UT forum back in July 2008...pretty interesting.

     
  10. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost be kind. be brave.
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    This no doubt is a product of the pressure on Kubiak to win, and win now.

    Still, I expect better from the organization than to basically chew players up and spit them out like that...
     
  11. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    yeah, on the face, this is pretty disappointing.
     
  12. yobod

    yobod Member

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    Wow, if that post is true (which I have no reason to doubt it's validity since everything else in the post was true), then the Texans really look bad. I thought this was an organization of character and high moral standards, but this behavior is really unsettling to me. I understand that there is a lot of pressure to win all the way from the janitors up to Bob McNair, but to nickel and dime their way out of surgery for a guy who played for them seems really low to me. It's against the grain from everything I've ever heard about our team and front office.
     
  13. DieHard Rocket

    DieHard Rocket Contributing Member

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    Who knows what the whole story really is, but it does look bad.

    It's not totally against the grain though ... while they do spend money on the team, from a business and operational standpoint they are very tight & conservative. Or cheap, if you want to say it that way. It's probably part of the reason they are one of the most valuable franchises in sports.

    As far as Jordan Black (whom the UT forum post is referring to if you couldn't tell) ... maybe the Texans didn't pay for the surgery because they had already paid his ass enough even though he sucked. :p Kidding of course. But he might be the most overpaid we've ever had based on his production. At least Weaver and Green have contributed. Black was terrible.
     
  14. Tha TC

    Tha TC Member

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    i think kubiak is gonna get canned behind this
     
  15. Smokey

    Smokey Contributing Member

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    I never liked the Kubiag hire.
     
  16. mrdave543

    mrdave543 Contributing Member

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    That post made back in 08 is pretty crazy, shows how "classy" the texans organization really pretend to be. I am sure a lot of teams do the same thing though.
     
  17. slowmustang

    slowmustang Member

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    I would put thousands of dollars that every single team in the NFL is doing this. You're telling me that the lineman don't even TOUCH each other once during OTA's? If I'm an offensive lineman, and the defensive guy is going harder than he "should" be, I'm pushing back. Think the coaches will tell the guys to stop and play nice?

    The guy probably knew he wouldn't make an NFL roster, injury or not. Plus, by sneaking cameras and all that, there's no NFL team is gonna touch him.

    I hope the current team is ready for the most grueling training camp ever.
     
  18. ron413

    ron413 Contributing Member

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    Fred Weary touches on that in his interview with the Fox26 Sports update.

    http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/sports/020509_Texans_Drills_Offseason

    Current, Former Texans Accuse Team of Illegal Drills During Workouts


    HOUSTON - Houston Texans guard Dan Stevenson and former Texans offensive tackle Jordan Black told ESPN that the Houston Texans used one-one-one blocking drills during mini-camp last May in violation of the NFL's Collective Bargaining Agreement.

    Stevenson was on the Texans injured reserve list all season. Black was released and has since signed with Jacksonville. Both have labor grievances pending against the Texans.

    ESPN reported Stevenson and Black's allegations were confirmed by former Texans guard Fred Weary in a signed affidavit.

    Weary was waived by the team last year and has an injury grievance pending against the club.

    Weary told FOX 26 Sports he never intended for the affidavit he signed to be used as part of the ESPN story.

    "I feel like Dan Stevenson did me a disservice," Weary said. "At the time I signed it, I didn't think he would go to this extreme. I thought it would be used internally through the team.

    "Dan approached me and asked me if I would go on the record about the illegal one-on-one drills and I said yes. I signed it for Stevenson, not ESPN."

    Weary said it's his understanding three players were hurt during those drills, Stevenson, Black and and former Texans center Chucky Okobi.

    "This is upsetting," Weary said. "I don't want it to seem like I have ill feelings toward the Texans. It would be like biting the hand that feeds you."

    Weary said ESPN requested an on-camera interview with him and he turned them down. He said Stevenson was trying to get him to go forward with the interview and sent him a text message requesting that he do so.

    Weary read the text from Stevenson, dated Jan 20. to FOX 26.

    "I already did the interview," Stevenson said in a text according to Weary. "Are you going to do yours?

    "The team needs to get what it deserved."

    Weary said when ESPN called for the interview he alerted the Texans as a courtesy and to ask for guidance. He said the Texans were already aware of ESPN's efforts.

    "I didn't do the interview with ESPN because I didn't think it would be beneficial," Weary said. "It would just look like I was bad-mouthing the team."

    Regarding the alleged rules violations by the Texans, Weary acknowledged they happened, but he also said the Texans tried to take precautions against anyone getting hurt.

    "It did happen," Weary said. "Guys did get hurt. The coaches stopped them after that.

    "In the Texans' defense they did tell us what was going on. They did give us parameters, like going half-speed during the drills. But when guys are trying to make the team, those parameters go out the window."

    Weary recalled one such instance involving Texans defensive tackle Tim Bulman.

    "Coaches will say we're not trying to hurt anyone and they would ask the offensive guys to let the defensive guys finish the drill," Weary said. But you've got guys like Tim Bulman, who was a practice squad guy at the time.

    "He bull-rushes a guy and the offensive lineman has to be a football player and understand this is not half-speed. He becomes competitive and sometimes people get hurt."

    While Black and Stevenson said the alleged rules violations occurred during the Texans mini-camp in May, Weary said he remembered the illegal drills taking place during the Texans' organized team activities last year, which are separate from the mini-camp.


    The Collective Bargaining Agreement between the NFL and the NFL Players' Association calls for a team violating workout rules to be punished by losing one week of organized team activities and for the head coach to be fined.

    If it is determined that there were multiple violations, the team can lose a 4th-round draft pick.

    Texans general manager Rick Smith and Texans head coach Gary Kubiak have not been available for comment.
     
    #18 ron413, Feb 5, 2009
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2009
  19. Uprising

    Uprising Contributing Member

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    Major class by Weary.
     
  20. mrdave543

    mrdave543 Contributing Member

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    I was referring to the post made in July 08 about not paying for surgery....i also clearly said other teams probably do it as well.



    Posted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 3:35 pm Post subject: The Texans can suck it.

    Ok, some of you may know that a buddy of mine was an OL for the Texans last season. He's been in the league like 5 years now, 4 of those with the Chiefs, last year with the Texans.

    The Texans are screwing him over big time.

    They re-signed him after his 1 year contract, which triggered a bonus for him on the first contract, then a few short weeks later they cut him.

    He has a shoulder injury from an unusual drill the Texans made him do. He and 2 other OL all have the same injury and they all got cut by the Texans.

    So this week my buddy is in the hospital about to have shoulder surgery.

    He has had 4 surgeons, including the Texans own team surgeon, say he is injured, 2 MRIs, a CT scan and an XRay say he is injured.

    FIVE MINUTES before surgery, the hospital business office comes into his room telling him the surgery is cancelled because the Texans won't pay for it, because they say he isn't injured.

    So despite all the doctors say his shoulder is injured, the Texans management decides he isn't and won't pay.

    He's going to be filing a workman's comp suit against them. "
     

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