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[ESPN Insider] Should Rockets trade Lin, Asik?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Broford, Jul 10, 2013.

  1. Hrock

    Hrock Rookie

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    the funny thing is Lin has been almost relegated to be an SG who handles the flow of the offense occasionally when Harden isn't running it.
     
  2. kcd

    kcd Member

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    Because of his defense. He's able to limit star players, like Harden for example. Also he's been in the league for a while.
     
  3. glacier921

    glacier921 Rookie

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    Iggy's bpg is .7 and spg is 1.7
    Lin's bpg is .6 and spy is 1.6

    By small fractions.
     
  4. Chef_Monteur

    Chef_Monteur Member

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    Clippers have the more depth than any team in the league right now. Lots of scoring, lots of solid defenders, solid utility players, and now Doc Rivers as coach. Not hard to see why they're picked higher than us.
     
  5. seahawk

    seahawk Member

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    Not totally object to the 6th man idea. Did we try to stagger harden/lin minutes?
    6th man is just a label.
     
  6. Chef_Monteur

    Chef_Monteur Member

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    You're cherry picking stats and presenting them with no context. Iggy can guard 3 different positions, where as Lin only one.

    You need to look at opponent PER, defensive win share, plus the defensive assignments and who they're being asked to guard each game. Iggy is always paired against the opposing teams best wing player, every game. He shut down Harden last season which is why we had problems being competitive vs the Nugs.

    Not saying that Lin is a bad defensive player, but Iggy is usually in the top 10 in DWS every season.
     
  7. Aleron

    Aleron Contributing Member

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    it's the way he impacts his opponents fg% etc, not the steals and blocks.
     
  8. clos4life

    clos4life Member

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    I'm perfectly happy keeping our roster as is going into the season. There is time to make changes as the tradeline approaches.
     
  9. Jpripper88

    Jpripper88 Member

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    Those stats largely mean nothing. Even the advanced statistics are still lacking in gauging defensive impact. It is the difference between watching the game and just look at the basic box score.
     
  10. Old Man Rock

    Old Man Rock Contributing Member

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    I am not either. I think Canaan will surpass Beverly and make Lin expendable for the right asset. But I wouldn't right Lin off either I think he will come back to the team a better 3 pt shooter and perhaps much better considering Howard is going to make everyone more open.

    I also think Lin is a very cerebral player and will quickly figure the best way to feed Howard, with Howard his value could skyrocket. He is a better distributor than Beverly or Harden and if the Rockets are smart they will keep the ball in his hands more and less in Harden's.

    The best way to setup Howard is through a willing passer. Harden is a willing passer on his terms. Look for my shot or path to the basket or great pass to the roller or then pass. With a Howard Offense (inside out) the Rockets will push the ball up court for the quick basket, yes that part of the Rockets strategy will remain the same, but then they will work it inside. That's what they have told Howard.

    They have painted that picture for him. And in that picture is not like Kobe bringing the ball up deciding what is the best way for him to score and then if there is no easy score passing it to Nash or Howard. Harden is not as bad as Kobe he did look that bad at times in the playoffs. Yao and TMac were mostly a waste here because JVG let TMac call the shots. TMac always thought it was on him and only gave YAo his opportunities when it suited him. In the end he wanted the victory to reflect on him.

    We have a chance to do something special and I think the Rockets will convince Harden that playing inside out will be the best way to achieve that. If that's the case then Lin's role will increase. (Don't get me wrong sometimes Harden will bring the ball down and no inside out just let him takeover, just not as much). In addition most realist see Lin already has this uncanny ability to get the basket. That's been apparent since New York but with Harden taking the ball out of his hands (rightfully so to a degree) that skill of Lin's was somewhat squashed. If Lin uses that more his value goes up quite possibly to the point he is worth more to us than what we can get back for him.

    Again I like Beverly but he is not the playmaker Lin is. And Lin will improve ever year for many years to come. Why would you want to trade him now on the low. Wait till his stock rises and if you think you can improve the team then trade him. That's the way you trade Lin and that's what Morey's plan is. He knows he will not get back better for Lin right now but if they make it deep into the playoffs this summer and Lin is a big part of that than his value has just skyrocketed and that's when you trade him. He traded Lowry on the high. He did lose Dragic on the high. But clearly that wasn't his intention. Fortunately for us Stern nixed his trade of Dragic.

    Both Dragic and Lowry have not played to the level they played here. Some credit goes directly to Mory who tells players what is the best way for them to play. So I am convinced Lin will improve this year over how he finished, (disregarding the playoffs were he had a bad game and then got injured LOH's) shooting near 40% from the arc, attacking the basket and distributing. he improved almost every month last year and I think coming in this year he will be much better. But even if he comes in the same that is good enough. He will get more open looks because of Howard.

    As for Asik, he has a value right more than anyone else not named Harden or Howard. And because he is not a starter you think that will diminish his trade value so you trade him now. Wrong, not the Morey way. He is an asset that can be used to get that third star. We only need another solid player or a high lottery draft pick (or a desperate team trying to get something instead of nothing) to turn him into something better. If TRob had a breakout year and showed he was a 9rbs 12 pts his rookie year than LMA is ours for Asik and TRob and not a bunch of 2nd rounders. Of course if Trob was that good we might not have wanted to tradde him. But the point is what if DMo has that kind of year where he beomes a solid shooter at near 40% from behind the arc. And plays solid in the playoffs where everyone is watching. Then perhaps a trade gets us LMA or Bosh for Asik and DMo.

    Of course there are a lot holes in my plan like why would you trade DMo if he becomes that good and what if no one becomes that good then we are stuck with Asik. But the point is Asik is more valuable to us then what we might get for him and he is our chip in the game to boot. Without Asik we were a poor defensive team and if we trade him then it will be without Howard we are a poor defensive team. So unless we get significantly more value in another area that improves the team than trading Asik for just someone like Ryan Anderson is a bad move. It makes the team weaker on the defensive end. It puts more pressure on Howard and it takes or most valuable chip and trades it for a second tier player that Morey would likely have found another way.

    So don't trade the Asik or Lin chip until the right opportunity comes along and that right opportunity comes along. This is the way Morey works. Asik ain't going no where right now because the prize Morey wants is not getable with Asik alone. We need another chip with almost as much value to get that third star.

    Which is why Morey isn't going after someone like Jamison. He is the perfect fit for this team. he brings veteran leadership and while he is not that athletic guy from a few years back he is still a decent rebounder and 3pt shooter to amke him a very good option along side Howard and he took the min last year but we can offer him the room exception for 5.4 mil. Yet I haven't heard any reports of any interest from us. Jamison is not a chip. Jamison stops development of DMo and TJones. DMo and TJones or potential chips. Morey will wait for it. Wait for the best time when an opportunity is right and then he will make his move.
     
    #50 Old Man Rock, Jul 10, 2013
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2013
  11. Spiegel

    Spiegel Member

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    lool Iggy is not all about points., Do you know how many points he limits with his defense or how good he is with the ball interms of hockey assists and how many shots he defelects or steals?
     
  12. kastuul

    kastuul Member

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    As a SG, Lin's stats is better than K.Thompson and J. Johnson.

    eff:
    LAL: Kobe 24.6 +Nash 15.3
    HOU: Harden 23.9 +Lin 14.1
    GSW: Curry 22.4 +Thompson 13.4
    NETS: D-Will 19.6+J. Johnson 13.0
    Bucks: Jennings 15.8 +Ellis 17


    Backcourt ranking 12/13:
    http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball/fantasy/nba/teamstats/13/2/diffeff
    1. LAC
    2. MIA
    3. OKC
    4. SAS
    5. HOU
    6. GSW
    7. MEM

    Frontcourt ranking 12/13:
    1. OKC
    2. Utah
    3. IND
    4. MIA
    5. SAS

    21.HOU
     
  13. Spiegel

    Spiegel Member

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    I like the gist of this article. Lin I thought showed some real improvement as the season went and when he was given added role, he put up good production more often then not. let him come off the bench and try to be as attacking as he can with the second unit.Asik can do what he did last season with the second unit. plus he wont have to play those huge minutes so his production might even improve as the result..
     
  14. pass_to_Hakeem

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    Wow that would be a great idea with Lin coming off the bench to run that 2nd unit .. It's just his damn salary. He's making way too much to justify him not starting. Wish somehow they could restructure his contract (wishful thinking)...
     
  15. Spiegel

    Spiegel Member

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    His salary is not going anywhere eitherway so why not try to get the best out of him by letting him come off the bench with a free reign?
     
  16. Yang_Wenli

    Yang_Wenli Member

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    I don't mind the idea of Lin being the 6th man and leading the second unit, but first I want to see how well he can play with Harden and Howard.

    Anyway Lin is at his best when he attacks the basket with reckless abandon, and putting him in the role without Harden where he handles the ball for 5 - 8 minutes or so may be the necessary scoring punch the team needs. That way he can just keep attacking without worrying about being subbed out.
     
  17. munco

    munco Member

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    Whether we keep Lin and Asik or trade them, we are sitting pretty like the article states.

    In regards to Lin as the 6th man I think it'd be a great role for him, but I don't have the confidence in McHale to give him enough minutes. If Lin gets about 30 min. a game I think it's a great move for the team.
     
  18. flamingdts

    flamingdts Member

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    By that logic Harden must be a great defender
     
  19. Hrock

    Hrock Rookie

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    Seriously guys, jsut think about if Mchale and staff figure out a way to really stagger Lin/bev/Harden....and in some casses canaan. This team is very dangerous if they stagger the minutes right.
     
  20. craguin

    craguin Member

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    It was the 5th game in the OKC series that Harden shot 7 3-point FGs in a row (7-9 overall).

    http://www.nba.com/games/20130501/HOUOKC/gameinfo.html#nbaGIboxscore
     

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