Kareem was unstoppable even before Magic. Give the man his due. Both had unstoppable shots, but Kareem had nearly a decade of absolute dominance at his position. As good as Hakeem was, it's hard to beat that track record of consistent dominance. I don't think it's an insult to say Kareem is the best center of all time. He is probably the 2nd best player of all time as well.
Wilt dominated both sides of basketball. Russell dominated one side of basketball. At least that's my reasoning.
So is Shaq. Way overrated. Came in at the end of the great centers era. Should not be ahead of Dream, even Shaq has admitted this in his more lucid moments.
I agree that Dream is better than Russell was but you can't really leave any center out of the equation if you are talking about the Greatest of All Time... not the greatest of the last 40 years but of all time. I don't agree with the order but I don't really have an issue with it either. In my book Wilt will always be number 1 period. No center including Shaq has ever been as dominant as Wilt or lead the league in all three of Rebounding, Scoring and Assists at some point in there careers. If the league had kept up with blocked shots then no doubt you could have added that to one of the stats Wilt lead the league in as well during his career. In my book Wilt is not just the number 1 center of all time, he is the number one NBA basketball player of all time, sorry MJ. Rules were changed in order to give the rest of the league a chance to beat Wilt, has the league ever changed rules for any other players? Babe Ruth is baseball Wayne Gretzky is hockey Jim Brown is football Wilt Chamberlain is basketball Pele is Soccer That is the Mount Rushmore of professional organized team sports IMO. Yes I know there are only 4 heads on Mount Rushmore but I'm trying to be respectful of soccer. For me, Dream is the number two greatest center of all time.
When you understand that there were only 3 guys in the NBA taller than Russell at the time, it makes Russell's rebounding seem not as impressive.
And that sounded bad... Russell was a great rebounder and defensive player. Just to make that clear. I'm just trying to remind people of the time period he was playing in.
It's really impossible to compare all these guys. The only order you can clearly pick is Hakeem --> Robinson --> Ewing because they played in the same era and most of their contemporaries place them in that order when asked. You could make a positive or negative argument for almost any of these guys. You could say Wilt/Russell played so long ago that their competition was poor and their teams were overpowered. But, you could also say that Kareem and Shaq were lumbering big Centers that would definitely not be as effective in today's game with sophisticated team defenses. And, they would have difficulty guarding some of the bigs of today.
If B**ch boy Robinson is on that list Kenny Smith and Sam Cassell deserve to be on the list of greatest PG's ever over Chris Paul.
Bill Walton MP: 13,250 WS: 39.3 WS/48min: .142 ---------------------------------------- Arvydas Sabonis MP: 11,375 WS: 47.3 WS/48min: .200 Yao Ming MP: 15,818 WS: 65.9 WS/48min: .200 Alonzo Mourning MP: 25,975 WS: 89.7 WS/48min: .166 Ben Wallace MP: 32,085 WS: 93.5 WS/48min: .140 Bob Lanier MP: 32,103 WS: 117.1 WS/48min: .175 Dikembe Mutombo MP: 36,791 WS: 117.0 WS/48min: .153 Robert Parish MP: 45,704 WS: 147 WS/48min: .154 ---------------------------------------- Not that all of those guys deserve mention on the list, but it really illustrates how so many NBA 'experts' idiotically (and selectively, considering Kareem is their #1) ignore the importance of longevity and durability when evaluating a players 'greatness'. Just because he COULD have been an all time great, that doesn't mean 2-3 excellent seasons and a career otherwise marred by injuries MAKES you one of the 10 greatest centers ever. Bill has mentioned himself regarding his career legacy that he's simply "the most injured athlete in the history of sport". Pet peeve of mine that Walton always ends up on these "greatest centers" lists. He was one of the most unselfish, technically skilled, and mentally gifted ever. Not one of the greatest.
Not arguing that - same goes for Wilt's dominance. Just saying that it's impossible to make an adequate comparison, and that it's hard to discount Bill's 11 rings, even with all the other dozen caveats. It's pretty much impossible to get 2 people to agree on #2-5 in that list.
I dont I dont really judge to much on wilt,kareem. B-cus they didnt play against dominant centers quite that often,,,,,
This list is probably about who had best NBA careers, not who was the best center. Because Sabonis should be in top 10 if it was for best centers of all time, not best careers.
From Shaq: Just for note, Shaq was in his prime during the 95 Finals. Sure, he had more success with the Lakers, but he was already in his prime in 95 as well. Enough to beat Jordan's Bulls during the playoffs that year. And, for the record, Hakeem averaged 32.8 points, 11.5 rebounds, 5.5 assists, 2 blocks and 2 steals during the 4 game sweep of Orlando.
Have you recently started watching basketball? You could argue Shaq further than any of the other nominees
I never understand this. Take Wilt for example. The reason people complain about him is they say "well he never played against anyone." So, ok. I disagree with that already. But just for example, let's look at the times when he most definitely did play against someone. He played against Bill Russell 142 times. This includes their early games before they were in their primes and their later games after they were out of their primes. You know, Bill Russell? The guy that ESPN has ranked as the #3 best Center of all time? The guy that people still talk about as one of the best defensive players of all time? Against that guy, in 142 games, Wilt averaged 28.7 points and 28.7 rebounds. His most points in a game against Russell was 62 and his most rebounds in a game was 55.
Shaq was a horrible PnR defender. He was not dominant defensively though he was good. In today's pick and roll and 3 point heavy nba Shaqs game would take a step back more than Hakeem's. But Shaq was clearly more dominant - though less versatile - offensively.
