Does Daryl Morey even care about being in Houston anymore?

It gets old trying to reiterate how Rick Adelman built a winning team around 2 guys with max contracts who were wearing suits on the sidelines. He was dealt a garbage hand and somehow put winning teams out there

 

But Rick wasn't buying into the program, he wasn't on the same page as Les-More, so he's gone. That's the difference.

 

That's your opinion.

 

Wow. Whodathunkit?

http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showpost.php?p=5973278&postcount=189

 

I think you are representative of a lot of people around here, but not re-hiring Adelman is not the betrayal you are making it out to be. There is a point where everybody needs to be on board with a rebuilding plan and Adelman and the management were clearly not on the same page. It does not mean that one side is wrong, but I can see the rationale for changing this coach at this time even though I wanted to keep Adelman, myself.

 

He has done very well in the draft (in fact exceptional), he has made a vast majority of excellent trades. His only failing is that over the last 2 years he has not been able to trade for a superstar... of course, no one points out that due to the Rockets success, the team has lost out each time to teams that have more assets.

Huh? I don't know what "colossul" means. He also traded for Artest, then flipped Artest for Ariza, and then for Lee. He made a great deal in the T-Mac trade... he dealt for Scola. He dealt Brooks for a good player and a draft pick. He traded for Lowry as well.... not sure what you realistically expect.

I agree, hiring Adelman set the franchise back... so did getting Scola for free, and the Artest deal, and drafting Chase, Brooks, Patterson, Landry.. and getting Lowry for garbage.

The Mavericks GM named most of the their assistant coaches.... when Red ran the Celtics, he picked the assistants and the head coach.... Jerry West, he named the Lakers top assistants... hmm, so did Riley in Miami.... I see a trend here.... interesting.

The Rockets are worse because they used to have 2 of the top 10 players in the NBA, to 1 of the the top 30 due to injuries. You take any other team in the NBA, and remove that much talent because of injury and see how good they are two years later.

Have you ever entertained the fact that you could be an idiot?

 

Broadway? Then he's in the right league! We got a lot of prima donnas here in the NBA. :grin:

 

I disagree with your point here you are making respectfully of course. The team was on pace to win around or under 35 wins this season until the front office made the mid-season trades that forced Rick Adelman against his will to play the players that really created a winning formula and sky rocketed them into on of the hottest teams in the NBA in the last 5 weeks of the season.

I just cant get over how quickly Adelman became a fan favorite after his contract was up. Six weeks before everyone on here would have heavily welcomed the idea of a new coaching staff next season.

Actually the winning formula was more about the players that were playing then the ones that weren't. Those players that were traded just werent a good fit this past season and into the future but the front office saw this first before the coaches obviously.

Of course Adelman should get credit for getting alot out of the little he had on his roster, but maybe he has more than we as fans think. We just dont really know because Adelman was going to continue to play the Shane Battiers and Brad Millers who he trusted and it would get this team nowhere in the longrun.

He did great for the time he was here, but just like Battier and Miller, he isnt really a great fit for the future of the Rockets. Morey and the rest of the front office obviously have a good feel for putting players around who mesh well so I trust that their methods will continue to keep this organization winning until they are finally able to snag the big fish. Which I believe Mchale and his connections accross the NBA will help out dramatically with.

Fyi, the "garbage" that Morey put around Adelman to coach..... Im not sure who you are referring to here, but I happen to think that the Rockets have the best role players in the league with no superstar. But they are role players. Give it some time. One season isnt very long.

 

The Knicks had better assets...theres that word. Ok no one on this planet would of argued that the Knicks had better assets than anyone in the L to begin the season. Yet somehow they managed to get Carmello with their assets once it came down to it. I guess thanks for making my argument for me. Quite honestly the trade for TMac was a horrible deal. Id rather of let TMac fall off the books, then had to have Jared Jefferies refuse to take the buyout, and deal with Jordan Hill. Hows he working out for us? Let me guess, give him a few more years. LOL.

Artest was a questionable move. Weather you want to believe it or not, he wasn't going to put us over the top. Ariza was a terrible terrible decision, which turned into an even less productive bench player that essentially was a money saving move in Lee. I can't fathom how you believe this series of moves were great moves. At best you can say gaining Artest for draft fodder was ok. I can name a few other great moves for you. Thabeet, Miller, Anderson, Francis, Hill, Jefferies, James, want me to continue?

Scola fell into his lap, ok give him credit if you want, but putting all that money in Scola's hand for that many years at the age of 30 was a terrible decision. Scola is an awesome guy and I genuinely like him on our team, but you don't pay that much money for that many years, to a 30 year old who is such a complete defensive liability. Lowry was overpaid, too. Lowry is a solid player but did not deserve his contract. Need I mention Brad Miller. Add those three up and tell me what you come up with for yearly dollar amount? Ok take your homer glasses off. Chase was forced into playing. He probably doesnt start on any other team. Whats the old saying, putting up numbers on a bad team doesnt mean shizit. Unless you'd argue last in your division and no playoffs a good team. Tell me what happened to Brooks, is he a good player....no he isn't. He put up good numbers on a bad team where he was forced to put up numbers. Landry too. These are all nominal players in the league. NOMINAL. Nothing outstanding at all. Get used to the idea that Morey didn't find a single all star player, not even close, nor will any of the players you listed become one.

Well dumbass, unlike you and appearantly Morey I knew NOT to count on Yao and his fragile feet. Unlike you, and Morey, I knew the TMac drama was only going to hurt his trade value, which it most certainly didn't help. Unlike you and Morey I knew tying so much money into Scola, Lowry, Miller, wouldn't help our team in the future. Unlike you and Morey I knew that Miller was way past done, and certainly not worth 3 years at 5 million a year. Unlike you and Morey I knew Hasheem Freaking Thabeet wasn't worth Shane Battier's toes. I knew that Chase was only a product of how much he was being given, he isn't a star in the making, nor Is Hill, nor is Patterson. Nothing BRILLIANT about those moves. Nor was paying over 2 million a piece for 2nd rounders and promptly shipping Jermaine Taylor off. TWill...maybe your holding out hope that TWill is our future....for you to claim anyone to be an idiot is a serious stretch.

Fact of the matter is, the Rockets have almost no real salary cap space in the future, no superstars to carry their team, a bumbling coach which not one single team in the league would of offered a postion to, have finished out of the playoffs under his watch more than made it, fired two hall of fame coaches, and turned our once proud franchise into a joke. Yep, you keep being a Morey fan. Im a Rockets fan.

 

I think you're too harsh on Morey, but bring up a number of great points. The DM rockstar status has to stop. It's like he gets a free pass because of the hand he was dealt. It wasn't as good as we hoped but that doesn't mean DM is god-like for drafting Carl Landry or trading for Scola. Both great moves, but he has just as many questionable moves.

I think it's difficult to really argue against how tmac and Yao were treated. Yao is quasi untouchable. He tried to trade tmac before being railroaded. But the artest moves get too much love - We did get out of the first round, but I'd certainly rather have a Nicolas Batum type right now than Courtney Lee, and I like Lee.

And the Battier trade was beyond ludicrous - hence my tipjar bet thread I lost betting he wouldn't trade for Thabeet. He did, and now were stuck with that deadweight contract. Miller - too long of course, but Adelman shares some blame there.

I don't like scola's or lorry's contract, though do think they were market.

He's gt some good and some bad. Right now, the Battier trade, the entirely diminished trade that was the T-Mac trade (did look good at the time, but DM doesn't get the benefit of hindsight), and the strange coaching hire saga have me on the DM as average GM at best. I think he definitely puts in the time and effort, and wouldn't get rid of him.... yet... But the next few seasons may break him.

 

I never really understood the Batum love. Especially given the situation the Rockets were in at that time.

At the end of the 2007-2008 season, the Rockets status was this following a
55-27 record. 17th ranked offense and 2nd ranked defense.

Players

Center: Yao Ming(22/10/2 before injury) and Deke
Power Forward: Hayes, Scola(going into 2nd year), Landry(going into 2nd year)
Small Forward: Battier(still one of the best perimeter defenders)
Shooting Guard: T-Mac(22/5/6 and 27/8/7 in the playoffs)
Point Guard: Rafer, Brooks(going into 2nd year)

Had the T-Mac/Yao combo stayed healthy for one more year, our 2008-2009 playoff team would've had this

Yao/Hayes/Deke
Scolandry
Artest/Battier/Wafer
T-Mac/Battier/Wafer
Brooks/Lowry

Blaming Morey for getting Artest is like saying that trying to win championships don't matter when you can get a future nice role player.

 

I say to Morey, dont let the door hit you, where the good lord split you

 

Lowry has an awesome contract. MLE money for our most valuable player... Scola has a reasonable contract for another 3 years. It's not a steal but its solid.

Battier did not bring in some great loot but I don't think there was any great loot to be had for Battier. Trading him was clearly the right move and the Rockets played a lot better without him. This is not a knock against Shane but at this point in his career and the state of the Rockets it was better for both parties to be separated. They made the trade minutes before the deadline expired so I'm sure they were holding out for whatever was out there. We got a first rounder, it won't be stellar but it has some value. Thabeet sucks, everyone knows it but at least the Rockets got a good look at him to see if there was anything salvageable and he is an expiring contract now.


Fact is.. you can't always make good moves. That seems terrible and lame but its the truth. Battier needed to be moved and the best the rest of the NBA offered was a mid first round pick and a tall bust. I'd still make the trade. Anytime Morey gets a hold of a draft pick its a very good thing. They acted like they had faith in Thabeet when the trade was made because... what the hell else are you going to do? Acknowledge the trade was a concession making the best of a less than ideal situation? I'm sure they knew he was bad then too.


No one should reasonably argue that Morey is flawless and has not made a bad move in his career but you have to understand the nature of the beast.. There are ALWAYS going to be mistakes. Every GM in the NBA has made bad moves. If he makes less bad moves than he is doing great.

Morey's biggest problem has not been his roster moves but some of his comments... We can only hope hes learned to no longer refer to players as assets.


As you can tell I am a big Morey supporter... but I honestly believe the guy is nothing short of a genius with an above average basketball mind. I believe he is aware of his own limitations and has faith in the people around him. I find it hilarious when people love to criticize Morey for signing Brad Miller btw... It is likely moves like this why Morey and Rick never saw eye to eye. I can almost guarantee that was Rick's move and Morey backed it because of faith in his coach. But when Morey trades AB... no dice from support for Rick.

I honestly think Morey had a lot more faith in Rick than Rick had in him.

 

So let me get this right, since the Knicks had sucked and had better draft picks than the Rockets, AND Anthony said he would want to play in NY.... it is some how Morey's fault that the Rockets didn't end up with him?

Quite frankly, if you think the T-Mac deal was a "horrible" deal, I don't know what to tell you other than you obviously don't know your head from your a$$.

Artest was a questionable move?... No, not really, not only did they advance in the playoffs, then turned the whole situation into Lee.

Miller is who Adelman wanted. Francis is whom the owner wanted. Jefferies made no difference one way or another to the Rockets, he was one of the last players off the bench. Hill was a throw in, and Anderson cost the Rockets a 2nd round pick... if that is the best you can come up with, then doesn't seem like you have much to complain about.

Scola fell into his lap?... how convenient, what about the other 30 teams, did they let him fall out of their laps? Same with Lowry?..... As far as finding an all star player, not easy to find when you are drafting 14th or below... also, Brooks and Landry did not put up their numbers on a "bad" team.

Well dumbass, what is a gm to do when the owner wants to rely on Yao Ming??? Is he supposed to fire the owner?

The Rockets have no salary cap in the future.... first we dont even know what will happen under the CBA, but second... this is simply a lie, maybe you should go and look up the next 3-4 years before you open your pie hole.

You are not a Rockets fan, you are an idiot.

 

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A couple of thoughts... First, it's interesting that you give the Knicks credit getting Carmelo Anthony, but you don't give the Rox credit for getting Scola? Scola fell into our lap? Yes, I guess we should credit Donnie Walsh for making New York into the city it is, while serving as GM of the Knicks. Anthony went there for the city more than for anything savvy done by the Knicks.

Second, you think we should have let T-Mac's contract expire? Sorry, but this

doesn't qualify as an argument.

How do you figure this?

I am not going to call you a name, but you may want to revisit your arguments when sober.

 

Is there a bigger fallacy out here than this? The rockets were playing under 0.500 pre-trade, until DM forced RA's hand by dealing his fav. pet Brooks. Suddenly we go on a tear, win several games over 0.500 and now its RA's credit? He was putting the team down, not lifting it up last season. If DM didn't do the trades we'd be looking at a top 5 pick right now.

 

I am so-so on Morey right now. I have lost a little faith, but his body of work is solid. He just needs to complete it with a Sistine Chapel.

Good Morey has done (I am sure I will forget something)
-The Tmac Trade
-The Martin trade
-Drafting Brooks/Landry/Budinger/Patterson/
-Trading Aaron Brooks and Shane Battier
-Getting Kyle Lowry
-Overseas work including Luis Scola (Spurs Rape), Sergiou Llull (purely IMO on all this stuff but I think he will play in the league) and possibly Marty Leunen.
-Draft pick trickery. The right to swap with NY did not work out this year, but we will end up getting their first next year. I would say this pick will be in the 19-24 range. We are a Melo or Amare injury, away from in being a better pick in the teens. Good for such a deep draft.
*The Terrence Williams trade, Maybe good. Liked it because it was shrewd of Morey at the time as it gave NJ a bigger chance at Melo. Trying to screw NY obviously there but ultimately was a futile effort. Twill maybe a player, or may be out of the league by the all-star break.
*Morey is a creative guy and the push to get Bosh was something that the fans can appreciate as it was mostly an honest effort. He tried even if he knew the odds were slim. His various activities and twitters and interviews make him a likeable guy. Definitely a new school person.

The Bad
-Brad Miller
-Failing to get a center of a height more than 6'6 that is not Brad Miller, over the last 2 years. This, is the most damning and confounding of failures. You could get some guy, some body, that would have helped and maybe got us in the playoffs one of the last two years.
-Failing to get value for Shane Battier. I can't believe we couldn't have
*The Terrence Williams trade. Obviously I listed in both categories. This could go very badly. I would love to get in to the post-season next year, but I would hate to lose a draft pick that was in the late teen range. Especially in such a high draft.
*I don't consider the Ariza thing a bad deal. We were going to lose Artest after Yao went down. Ariza netted us a great player in Lee. Morey had the ability and cash to grab an asset and he did. So not a bad deal, but worth explaining.
*Morey and his personality is listed in both categories. There is some evidence that would point to the players being hurt by the manner and volume in which trade speculation was happening. Also, he is probably not in some of the circles around the league that are more Ole Boy types that have been around the league a longer time. It also seems that there may have been times where him being shrewd and guarding his B assets has hurt us (IE last year I believe it was quoted we could pick up the draft pick for Cousins, but it would cost too much. What do we have now, that would have been too much for Cousins? He may indeed over value some of these guys.

Morey has done way more good than bad. He lands a big fish and he is back on top. Right now though, he has staked two years on ghosts and a coach that was able to keep us treading water. He had a great pick in PPat who will most likely be a starter for a long time. I really believe that Morey will try to make something happen on draft night. And I probably will be pissed if we don't.

 

Our 2012 pick to Nets is lottery protected.