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Did I do the right thing?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by codell, Jan 13, 2011.

  1. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    Long long long story here, so be patient.

    I remember when I was son’s age (7), my own father forcing sports on me, which of course, I was not receptive to at that time. My father was so hard on me about it, I shut sport completely out of my mind and didn’t show any interest in it until I was about 11 or so, when I starting following the Rockets and playing basketball on my own in our driveway. I starting playing on a team in the 7th grade and played through my senior year.

    Because of my father, I have been careful not to do the same to my own son, who up until this summer, showed no interest in any type of sports.

    When my son turned 7 in August, he asked for his own basketball for his birthday because he wanted to start playing on a goal I had installed in our driveway during the spring. I was very excited about his interest, since of course, basketball is my favorite sport. I started working with him almost everyday on shooting, passing and dribbling (the basics). He took to it all very quickly and before I even realized it, he fell in love with basketball. Since then, he regularly spends 1-2 hours every afternoon/evening (if weather allows), in our driveway practicing. Religiously.

    In October, he started to watch the Rocket’s pre-season games with me and like playing, he fell in love with watching. He would watch every minute of every game with me. We started to talk to him about playing in a youth league starting in November. He was very receptive to the idea of course. I looked into a league in Fairfield (near Cypress) that I had heard good things about. I was close to signing him up there when I got an email from the high school coach at this school (he goes to a private Christian school here in Magnolia) who was starting a youth program through the school. The email had little details on the program, other than the fact that any students from 1st to 5th grade could sign up. My hunch said to go with the program in his own school (since he would have the chance to play with more of his friend) so we signed him up.

    His first practice was in November, which I attended of course. I immediately had concerns. My first concern was there was a total of about 30 kids there. 30 kids and 1 coach. My second concern was the fact that the coach’s demeanor with them was not what I expected, given the age of the kids that were there. The coach was not a yeller, but extremely unfriendly and certainly, not encouraging. My next set of concerns came within the first 30 minutes of practice. Remember that all I had worked on with my son up until them was some very basic shooting, passing and dribbling drills, which, given his age and experience level, was appropriate. During practice, the coach started doing drills involving the kids dribbling between their legs, doing layups with their offhand (off the correct foot) and doing no-look passes. It was a disaster, and even the older kids were struggling, to say the least (keep in mind that he was doing these drills in one big group). If that was not bad enough, at the end of the 1st practice, he started trying to teach them a 2-3 zone defense. We left that 1st practice, and I made a point to ask my son if he had fun, which he said he did. Because he said he had fun, I dismissed my feeling on the practice, since him having fun was the most important thing for me.

    The next several practices were more of the same. Coach would mix in a lesson on backdoor cuts and trapping in the backcourt. All disasters of course. To make matters worse, a disturbing pattern started to develop. When he ran drills, if someone didn’t do it right, they were made to do pushups and run laps Needless to say, all 30 kids, at one point or another, did pushups or laps. What bothered me was that all the kids, not just mind, were being punished because they couldn’t grasp, either mentally, or physically, some of the more complicated drills. I can understand punishment when someone wasn’t listening or was dribbling the ball when the coach told them not to, but I didn’t think it was right to dish out punishment because a younger kid couldn’t understand what he was telling them to do, or just physically couldn’t do it (to me, that is on the coach). This continued for several practices, but I kept asking my son if he was having fun, and he said yes. We kept working and practicing on our own at home, where I tried my best to teach him and help him understand the things the coach couldn’t. I was quite surprised at this level of comprehension, as I was able to get him to understand some of the more complicated things, but not all of them.

    I became increasingly worried last week. The parents (and the kids) kept asking the coach when the first game would be and the coach kept saying he would let us know. I went to practice with my son last Thursday and the coach announced that their first game would be the following Saturday. I was a bit surprised, as although the coach had run through a plethora of drills, none of the kids had had a scrimmage of any type. Furthermore, the coach had never spent any time going over the rules of the game, other than explaining traveling. After the coach’s announcement, I went to him and told him I saw that he had a lot of kids (a few had dropped out, but there were still about 25-27 at any given practice) and volunteered to help him (note at some practices (not all) he would have 1 of his high school kids assist him). Coach took me up on my offer and I asked him if he would allow me to work with the younger kids (the reason being was, over the course of the previous 6-8 practices, he would spend most of his time working with the 4th and 5th graders, and spent almost no one-on-one time with the little ones (1st/2nd graders). I had a blast working with the little ones, and I think they enjoyed it too (especially my son of course). We did get to scrimmage, but only spent 10 minutes doing so. After practice/scrimmage was over, I realized that their 1st game was going to be a disaster (which is ok, hey its their 1st game). The coach stated the 1st game was going to be the 1st graders (there were 6 of them) against the 2nd/3rd graders (there were 7). I was almost mad about this. You wouldn’t think there would be a huge difference between 1st , 2nd and 3rd graders, but there is. Not size-wise, but skill/aggressiveness wise.

    Saturday hits and the game is about to start. 2 10 minute halves. The ref has to explain the “jump ball” because coach has failed to do so. The ref also has to explain the rules as the game goes on, because again, coach spent no time on the rules other than traveling. The game was a disaster. 28-0, 2nd/3rd graders beat the 1st graders. The game consisted of the 2nd/3rd graders scoring, the 1st graders inbounding the ball, getting quadruple teamed by the older team and of course, losing the ball and the older team scoring a layup. I think the older team got off about 10 shots a minute, while my son’s team got off about 2-3 shots the whole game. By the end of the game, the little guys (1st graders) were not having fun. In the last minute, my son got the ball (I think for the 1st time) and promptly had all 5 defenders run over him, stealing the ball and busting his nose in the process (who knew there is that much blood in a human nose!). My son was ok, but was upset that he got smacked in the face by 2 or 3 kids. Of course, I told my son that sometimes injuries happen, but deep down inside, I felt this one shouldn’t have.

    Monday’s practice was cancelled, which was not surprising. During the course of the season, coach has consistently cancelled practices, rescheduled them for a difference time, different location, etc. I told my son about the cancellation, and he made a remark that concerned me. He said he was glad, even though he insisted he has had fun in practices and even in the game.

    Tonight’s practice was the straw that broke the camel’s back. Instead of the usual 25-27 kids, there were close to 30. I didn’t not volunteer to help like last week, as I think I had made it clear to coach last practice that if he needed help I was happy to assist and that all he had to do was ask (i.e I didn't feel the need to "volunteer" every time I was there). He didn’t ask me to help tonight, which I was fine with. I was not fine when he put my 4’3’’, 62 lb, 1st grade son in a drill with a 5’2’’, 100 lb, 4th grade girl. The drill consisted of him attempting to pass around or over this girl to one of his teammates. This girl is one of the more aggressive kids there, and she has obviously been playing for at least 2 years, so he had quite a bit of trouble getting his pass off without her stealing it. Instead of coach helping my son, he made him go do pushups. It took every bit of restraint on my part (and my wife’s) to not grab the coach and lecture him about embarrassing and punishing my son for putting him in a drill that was a complete mismatch. I let practice continue. After that was over (25 mins into a 2 hour practice), as usual, he picked the older kids out and worked with them and sent the 1st graders off to work with one of his high school players. Don’t get me wrong; the kid is nice and had some skills, but he had no clue how to teach. The coach didn’t interact with any of the little ones the rest of practice, and more importantly, they didn’t scrimmage for even 1 minute. After practice, he announced that Saturday’s game was going to be at another location, about 30 mins away, which pissed me off as he had told us before the season that all the games would be at his school. Furthermore, he announced that he was mixing the teams up and was going to put the little ones on teams with the older kids. I had had it at this point, but didn’t say anything as I wanted to sleep on it to see if I should pull my son out and try another league next year or to stick with it and see if it gets better.

    After practice, on the way home, my son, without any prompting, started to cry and said he had a horrible time at practice and wasn’t having fun. He also admitted that he didn’t have fun at the game because all the older kids were just pushing him over and taking the ball whenever he touched it. My son knew we paid $150 for him to be in this league and offered to give us all of his allowance that he had been saving (up to about $85) if he didn’t have to go anymore (this made my wife cry). He pointed out that he was upset that he was having to play with kids that were 2-3 years older than him and that coach was not spending any time with him or the other little ones. I told my son that the most important thing for his mom and I, as far as sports go, was for him to learn and have fun and that if he was not having fun, I didn’t want him to feel he had to go, despite the money we paid. He confirmed he was not having fun and didn’t not want to go anymore, so we said fine. We asked him why he told us he was having fun when he wasn’t and he said he was afraid if he said no, that I wouldn’t play basketball with him at home anymore (broke my heart hearing him say that).

    I don’t want to teach him or encourage him to quit, but I also feel this league was not designed to 1) Help him, at all, improve at basketball or 2) be fun. I told him that this was not his fault and that his mom and I were to blame since we did not take time to research this league to see if it would be right for him. He asked me if I would still play with him at home and if he could still watch the Rockets, and of course, I said absolutely. He just went to bed happy.

    Nevertheless, I sit here feeling like **** over letting him quit. However, I would be devastated if he were to have stayed in the league, and ended up hating basketball.

    Did I do the right thing?
     
    #1 codell, Jan 13, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2011
    2 people like this.
  2. Kam

    Kam Contributing Member

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    Is there not another league?
     
  3. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    Nope. Most start in the fall (October/November).
     
  4. Rockets Red Glare

    Rockets Red Glare Contributing Member

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    Exactly my kids play sports and the leagues are NOTHING like this. Go to the YMCA or i9 league.
     
    1 person likes this.
  5. macalu

    macalu Contributing Member

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    you're not trying to live vicariously through your boy. i think you did the right thing. i don't see it as quitting since it was directionless and unorganized. nothing ever got started in the first place. he's now also learned that he can come to you in the future about any concerns without fear of you punishing him.
     
  6. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost be kind. be brave.
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    Dude, f*** that coach. Your kid is going to wind up hating basketball, and probably most sports in general, unless you put him in a better environment. Of course you did the right thing.
     
  7. diamondview

    diamondview Member

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    Your son is young and only beginning to learn the dynamics of the game. If anything you shouldn't be worried about the fact that he's a quitter but more about if he is having fun. There is no point doing something that you don't enjoy in some way.

    His love of basketball flourished when you started spending time playing and watching the game with him. If he's not enjoying playing for the team (which appears to be very obvious), then there really is no point for him to continue being in that team. Find another where he is matched up against children of his own age and size with a more dedicated and enthusiastic coach. At the end of the day, basketball is a game and if he's not having a great time and you keep forcing him to attend, he'll hate you for it. Who knows, with another coach and bit more time, we may have another Rockets superstar in the making :)
     
  8. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    Oh, one other thing. We paid our fees at the end of October. The fees included their jerseys. When the 1st game came down last weekend, only 2/3rd of the kids had their jerseys (of course, all the older ones had theirs). My son was lucky to get his (he picked #11 because he loves Yao Ming even though he has never seen him play). I think that is ****ed up. Coach was paid 13 weeks ago and didn't have everyone's jerseys. And a few of those that did, they were not the right size. One of the older girls, who is "husky", and who you can tell his very self conscious about her size, ended up with a jersey that was skin tight. She asked coach if he would get her another one, and he said no. Her parents ended up buying her a generic jersey from Academy and taped her # on.
     
  9. amaru

    amaru Member

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    You did the right thing. He wasn't going to get any better in that league.

    He was either going to end up hating the game or getting hurt again.

    Not good either way.

    Try and find a league that caters to his age group (5-7 I would assume w/o knowing his exact age)
     
  10. diamondview

    diamondview Member

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    Coach is not very good, organisation is poor and your son is not having a good time.

    Don't think the price you paid for registering and the jersey would come close to losing the chance to share your love of basketball with your son.

    You definitely made the right decision.
     
  11. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    WTF...That pisses me off....after reading that story......as a father and coach of both of my son's sports, that is disgraceful.

    Remember, just because a man has the title "COACH" does not mean he is any good at it....

    Dude, you did 100% the right thing in getting him out of there......but, I feel, that you need to get him enrolled in another program, ASAP....explain to him that there are basketball programs where you get to play against kids his own age, and that it is a lot more fun.

    We are currently doing I9 here in Austin for my 8 year old, it is one day a week, 30 minute practice then a 1 hour game right after practice.

    It is great, everyone gets equal playing time, everyone gets to play, there are no steals allowed at this level, and we are learning the pick and roll.....and it is working like a charm.

    I can not emphasize this enough, the term...."Get back on the horse" is important, before your son get traumatized.....

    Also, I am not sure I would have held my cool with that coach, I would let the admininstrators know what is going on so that he doesn't screw it up for more kids.....

    Seriously, I am STEAMING right now after reading that.

    Last year, my then 7 year old son played at I9....again, I coached him, we had a blast, all the kids on all the teams were treated with respect, and they all were much better at the end of the season.

    Seriously....I can not recomment I9 enough.

    www.I9Sports.com

    is the website, and I think they have locations everywhere.

    If you want to email me through the board, I would be happy to listen, I have coached for more than 7 years for both my boys, the oldest is now 12 and is doing the Jr. high sports thing and now the youngest is having a blast.

    And he plays everything, some parents are trying to talk us into having him do Travel ball for baseball, or soccer etc....but right now, he is 8, and having fun, if he gets serious about one later, fine....but not right now.

    Codell.....I applaud you for doing the right thing....you are his dad, you know what is right and wrong.....and that coach is WRONG WRONG WRONG !!

    DD
     
  12. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    It's funny. He kept asking me tonight he would still be able to play for the Rockets one day if he quit this league. :)

    I'll be blunt honest. My son has not one athletic bone in his body. However, for only playing for 4-5 months, he has some skill. He can dribble well. His passing (overhead, chest, bounce and baseball) is amazing. He can regularly hit bank shots from either side (5 ft' in of course). And of course, he hustles (but he's hardly quick or fast). He practices on his own without any pushing from either of us. He loves to play! Santa brought him a basketball with hand prints on it that helps him remember where his hands should be on the ball when he shoots. It is amazing how much that has helped him. Unfortunately, he likes to jack it up from 20' instead of shooting close in. Despite his lack of athletic prowess, I am proud to say, unbiased, that he his quite a shooter from 7' in. Doctor says he should be 6'3'' maybe. If we can get a few more inches on him, he may be the next Scott Padgett.

    Oh, and he is the only kid out of the 30 that regularly does his layups off the right foot.
     
  13. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    Here is the last messed up thing:

    Up front, the coach told us that they would play on 8'6'' goals. So of course, our goal at home is that height.

    Every practice, every single one, they practice on 10'. Half the kids (especially the little ones), can't even hit the rim during practice.

    ****ed up I tell you.
     
  14. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    I9 at your son's age is on 8' goals.....the bank shot and dribbling is a MASSIVE advantage and they keep stats...which you can look up with your son online.

    My kids loved that.

    We decided last year that ANY completed pass was an assist, as passing at 7 is not really going to happen.

    We rebounded, defended and did a fast break for the first good shot.

    GOOD FUN !

    DD
     
  15. diamondview

    diamondview Member

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    It sounds like your son does have a lot of potential! However, at his age who knows how good/not good he may be. Think as long as he's having fun and learning about the game, anything else is a bonus.

    And Scott Padgett did give us that buzzer beater against the Knicks in '05. Couldn't post the picture but here is a link with the image from that final play.

    http://www.life.com/image/52045199
     
  16. droxford

    droxford Member

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    (1) you should have pulled him out earlier. Realize that kids don't always tell you the truth, but not out of vindictiveness. Sometimes they have other reasons. Once, we asked my toddler four times if he needed to pee, and he said, "no." Then he pee'ed in his pants. He did this because he didn't want to stop playing with a toy. When you see that it wasn't going to be fun for your son, make your son feel like it's okay to say that it isn't fun and he can tell the truth to you.

    (2) even if he was truthfully saying it was fun, you (as an adult) are more capable of assessing the situation and how it will be in the future. You should realize that, even if he's having fun now, he probably won't have fun later after the novelty of the new team has worn off.

    (3) regardless of that, you did right thing pulling him out. Give him some time and play some hoop with him again. Bring the fun back to the game for him. Then explain to him that that was a bad program with a bad coach and see if he'll be interested in getting into a better program.

    My girl is 10 (5th grade) and is playing her second year of basketball at her small catholic school. I'm assistant coach on her team. The coach and I both realize that this is NOT serious basketball and that, while it's good to teach them how to play, the focus is just for the kids to have fun.
     
  17. Chinahype

    Chinahype Member

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    Just wondering, are you Asian?
     
  18. rockbox

    rockbox Around before clutchcity.com

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    That's interesting. My 6 year old daughter just started basketball in a 1st/2nd grade league. They really don't call traveling or double dribbles unless its blatant. The kids are also not allowed to cover anyone other than the kid they are assigned to on the other team. They wear colored sweat band to make it easier to keep track. If they allowed double teaming, you would get a crowd of 4 girls surrounding the dribbler and the ball would never get across half court.
     
  19. Blurr#7

    Blurr#7 Contributing Member

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    You did the right thing. Some people just can't coach and lack the teaching skills to do so. Work with your kid yourself at home, let him get more comfortable and learn at his own pace. Make the drills fun or a competition agaisnt you, it works wonders for young kids. When he's ready and has more confidence he'll let you know. And to be honest the time you spend with him is really the most important thing here.

    And you know what? It may be years before he decides he want to play organized ball again. I worked with my then 14 year old brother(6 feet tall but literaly had never picked up a basketball before!) 2 summers ago when he called me out of the blue to tell me he was gonna try out for the school team. 3 days out of the week for the whole summer we worked on everything. And he went out and made the team. He's only been playing for 2 years and we still run drills occasionally but man he's really progressed and trully enjoys the game.

    Now I'm dealing with my 5 year old at home and from my passion for the game everyone is expecting me to shove a basketball in his hands. Funny thing is he loves to watch the game and shoot around outside with me but he's fallen into Baseball. I never played it at all growing up but I think I'll let him dictate if and when he joins a team.
     
  20. droxford

    droxford Member

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    Having 1st, 2nd, and 3rd graders trying to shoot on 10-foot goals is asinine.
     

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