This "only the cops should be armed" sentiment has rung out loud and clear right here on CF time and again anytime we talk about gun control , CHL holders or citizens carrying weapons .... They don't want normal people armed "Let the police do it" , "You aren't qualified" .... the list of BS goes on and on. They all forget that .... the police can't be everywhere all the time. Just look at current day CHAZ in Seattle where the cops can't respond to crime. Now they don't want the cops having weapons either apparently ... The only people who will be armed are the criminals.
I watched that video with my son .... he was like "someone do something" , "Stop him" , "why isn't anyone doing anything?" I was thinking something similar .... what would I have done ?! Sadly the answer is just what everyone else in the vicinity did - Nothing. The consequences of interfering with that cop "doing his job" would have been far too great .... and anyone who did interfere likely ends up face down in the dirt right along with him with felony charges to boot.
I heard Pelosi - she's not on board with this defund / disband mess. AOC on the other hand "make no mistake , that's exactly what we mean....". But I haven't heard anything from her since (not really paying attention) Where is she on this now ?
We don't have to tear it down .... There is a simple fix. Right now , police police themselves. What we need is civilian oversight of police. It's simple to execute too - just do it like Jury Duty. Anyone and everyone who isn't a felon or law enforcement is eligible to participate. That solves the problem of police getting away with dirty **** and that one change will make them change. Something no one is willing to mention : We the people also have to do some changing .... these people don't come into contact with law enforcement for singing too loud in the church choir , they are in general doing dirt. That doesn't excuse the actions of police in any way but it is part of the problem. And the volume of violent crime & the risk to LEO's is why they are so "militant" in many cases. They are dealing with the worst people .... at their worst in a great number of instances. So they tend to treat every situation as a high risk one ... and how can you blame them when all it takes is one mistake to cost them their lives ? Not only do the police have to change , we do too ....
You don't think they make contributions to their pension fund just like most of the rest of us over those 20-25-30 years ?! Hell they average about $55k a year in salary. That's "median income". I wouldn't touch that job for $155k. Really their job is one of the most difficult jobs there is and the vast majority of them are who we want them to be - morally and ethically. Its the few bad apples that make the rest of them look bad. Those bastards need to be weeded out and or held accountable when they do cross the line. We're painting with a broad brush right now and its really not productive. It's contributing to the chaos all over the country. How about defend the good ones and hold the bad one's accountable ....
I love that you are proposing solutions. I have a couple of questions about it. What authority do the civilians overseeing the police have should they find wrongdoing? What say in the budget, training, training and responsibilities of police does the civilian oversight group have? Part of the problem is that police are asked to do way too much. They are asked to take care of family counseling, child protection services, crime prevention, crime investigation, apprehension, traffic, issuing permits, records, some incarceration, community relations, etc. The list is enormous. It is a problem. Unless we restructure their duties which would mean starting over, how does that get addressed? Our society has been as safe without the militarization of the police. That isn't needed. I blame them in part for that. The mistake was often made before it costs them their lives. Improving their training in a number of areas, working in de-escalation techniques, awareness of the communities they are policing, etc. could all help to make their lives safer without requiring military equipment and militant actions. By the time it gets to that point it's too late.
You leave one thing out in this "militarization" talk - Their safety. Their safety should be just as paramount as ours. As for what oversight a civilian committee would have - they'd be responsible for holding them accountable for their actions be that firing or other penalties and sending them to the DA to be held accountable in court. Our biggest complaint has been the lack of accountability this solves that issue by taking the authority to oversee that accountability from police unions and sympathetic arbitrators to the people who write the check.
The consequences of ending up if people tried to stop Chauvin is more than just face down in the dirt but possibly shot especially if someone tries to use a firearm to stop an LEO. Again Minneapolis isn't a gun free zone and as Philando Castile should remind everyone there are plenty of Minnesotans carrying firearms. If someone where to draw a firearm and aim it at any of the LEO they are fully justified to draw their own weapons and use them.
I think they will be safer if they improve their knowledge of the community, de-escalating situations, and have training in how to do that than they would be looking like an invading military force going into the community. The community will trust them more, which will help keep them safe, have the community be more helpful in finding and apprehending criminals, etc. It will take time but they will be safer that way and not need the military gear to keep them safe. If it is structured in a way so that civilians can hire, oversee, mandate training, have a say in the budgeting of the department, firing and processing charges as you mentioned then I think that's a great place to start. I do want other agencies to take over some of the duties from our officers so they aren't asked to do so much. I still think that will involve some restructuring. Combine that with the civilian community involvement, that would be good. It will look different in different places based on the communities and the police history in that area. So I don't think it is a one size fits all kind of solution.
Like I said .... the consequences of interfering would be too great - ending up face down in the dirt with Floyd would be the best case scenario .... dead the worst case.
Not taking a side. It's just... not at all humorous. Lowest common denominator joke. You have 15 year olds on Instagram producing superior material.
Didn't AOC tell Amazon to go away from New York and then all the jobs went to Virginia, Texas and India? Thanks AOC!!
She did .... but IF i recall correctly , they moved those jobs across the river to Jersey. Many here argued in favor of her position.
She got slammed by her Democratic rival https://nypost.com/2020/06/19/aoc-forced-to-defend-record-amid-jabs-from-rival-caruso-cabrera/ Caruso-Cabrera also scoffed at AOC raising $850,000 while first bringing up the congresswoman’s opposition to the Amazon’s aborted plan to open a campus alongside the Queens waterfront projected to generate 25,000 jobs and $27 billion in revenue. “The $850,000 is the least you can do after throwing out $27 billion in tax revenue. Imagine if we had that tax revenue now,” she said. “I never would have thrown away 25,000 jobs.”
A lot of opinions from different cops. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/06/george-floyd-police-protests-defund-conversations.html This point hits hard against the current fervor In real life, the “**** the police” stuff gets to you. It’s really entertaining when people say that and then five minutes later they ask for help. I’ve seen that a few times. They’ll be like “**** the police!” and within the next day I’ll get a call. I’ll be like, oh, **** me, right? We’re not appreciated until we’re needed.
