I don't usually like to use the my statistics is better than your statistics but why FG% over TS%. TS% is definitely the statistic that is superior in terms of measuring shooting ability and scoring efficiency. A few people elaborated earlier in the thread on page 3 and 4 in regards to the TS% so no point in me elaborating. Curious as to your response.
I don't disagree with what you say here. But I think the glass ceiling the article had in mind was that Lin would never be given a chance to lead the team in NY because there were other players, namely Melo and Amare (maybe even Chandler), who were ahead of him in the pecking order. I could be wrong in my reading. But if that's what he said, I kind of agree. I think once D'Antoni was fired, Lin was pretty much relegated to a role player. I am not arguing that Lin is not a role player. But he was signed to the Rockets to lead the team. That's how he was "freed" from NY's glass ceiling. Whether Lin can live up to that expectation remains to be seen.
forget FG%. Let's look at eFG%, which measures a players scoring efficiency from the field. I'm not interested in TS% because i am talking about Lin's outside shooting, not his ability to penetrate and score inside, which we all know is one of his strengths. CH is right; FG% is flawed because it treats 2pt shots and 3pt shots the same. eFG% doesn't. So ...eFG%: Lin - career .462 Rondo -career .489 Parker - career .508 Lin this season so far - .427 I am stating something obvious ...which is that he needs to improve his outside shooting. It would help our team if he could take advantage of the wide open looks he's getting. Teams are playing off him and daring him to shoot because he can't. It would be nice if he could capitalize on those opportunities; especially because we only have one other real scoring option in our starting lineup. Here's something else that is obvious ...Lin will improve his outside shooting. He's young and coming off of injury. I expect his eFG% will rise. Hope this is a helpful contribution to the debate.
Ok, I get what you're saying but given FG% AND EFG% treat 18 foot jump shots IDENTICALLY to shots at the Rim, you can't actually divorce his drives to the rim from the numbers since the fouls he draws are an important part of his effectiveness in terms of layups. The only way we can actually examine whether his jump shots or finishing is the cause of the problem is through actually breaking down the shot location data (no, I'm not going to do it!). Unfortunately, Hoopsdata has not been updated in some time (darn you Sandy!), so that information isn't readily available. The data that we DO have available in terms of his jumpshooting is his 3 point shooting (.333 vs .323 last year) and his Foul throw shooting (91% vs 79% last year). Both indicate that at least at those ranges his jumpshooting is similar or improved in both areas (though the sample size is small). As for the remainder of his shooting, without breaking down the individual shot attempts, the MOST you can currently say is that his finishing at the rim and/or his jumpshooting from various ranges between 3 and 19 feet MAY or May NOT be better/worse than last year. This is why eFG% and FG% are not useful at all in this context.
no one is trivializing anything. i said Lin needs to improve his outside shooting and folks are acting like that's not true. I don't really understand why that's such a controversial statement. It's backed up by facts. If someone wants to say that Lin scores in other ways, fine. Of course he gets to the line because he penetrates a lot; because he can't shoot from the outside. But right now he's not capitalizing on what defenses are giving him, which is wide open looks from the perimeter. I'd like to see him improve his shooting and take advantage of those opportunities.
Nobody is trivializing the importance of getting to the FT line. But what does getting to the FT line have to do with Aruba saying "Lin needs to improve his outside shooting"?
If you just want to isolate jumpshots, then it's fairly easy through 82games.com. I highly recommend the site for future references. As for Lin vs. Rondo, Lin's eFG% was 46.9% on jumpshots. Rondo was 35.5%. Parker was 41.3%. Of course, the main reason for Lin's advantage is simply that he can shoot a 3 worth a damn. Yes, Lin would be better served to develop a better 3 pointer. So would any player in the NBA. But it is also true that many guards have been able to drive successfully even without a deadly 3. Rondo and Parker are certainly two of them. But when you got the range, like James Harden or Kobe Bryant, it does make one's game even deadlier.
The problem is that FG% and eFG% do NOT isolate out plays at the rim or short distance shots. IE, those aren't meaningful "facts" in term of his outside shooting. The only Reliable data we have on range shooting is FT and 3 point shooting without teasing out the individual distance data.
You may end up being right, but Roxxy's point is only strengthened by your post. Jeremy Lin needs to be a better shooter to be considered better in your mind. Yet Lillard has proven himself better than Lin in your mind despite only playing 4 games and shooting worse in those 4 games than Lin has for his career. (Lin .43 Lillard .406)
LOL, Lillard is a good kid, but we drafted White. Lillard fell back to earth last night though. I'm definitely more impressed with Aldridge than Lillard from the Rox/Blazers game. Also, serious discussion comparing Rondo and Parker with Lin just show how good a player Lin has become. Here is an undrafted player in the same discussion as potential all stars. I would take that as a complement to Lin.
Using the "eye test", Lin has a better outside jumper than Rondo does. THAT IS A FACT JACK. Using Rondo's 48 FG% over Lin's 42 FG% to imply that Rondo is a better overall scorer than Lin is facetious.
Lin needs to improve his outside shooting. Gonna avoid the Rondo and Parker comparisons because those were actually made by folks who think Lin can do no wrong, and were saying that you don't have to be a good outside shooter to be a good PG. I took the bait. I like Lin and am glad he's a rocket. Doesn't change the fact that he needs to improve his outside shooting though. And i think he will ...eventually.
Harden is the best thing that happens to Lin at this time, relieving his pressure, taking over the burden of carrying the whole team on his back, and the two have terrific chemistry and connection with each other on court! Give them time to bind and the two backcourt knives are going to do amazing things this season! So don't be discouraged by a few losses and growing pains at the start of the season. Lin's shooting groove will come back once he gets more confident with more and more wins as the season progresses. They are only going to be better. Enjoy the Harden-Lin show that has just started.
ARIAN FOSTER. The league should read more about him. Moneyball and Underdogs. How can they still hate on Houston Rockets, or Texans. Houston teams are evolving from the norms. I'm glad to be a part of this.
I think its pretty obvious just by looking, that his jump shooting has been worse this year. But just to entertain you, http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/linje01/shooting/2013/ Last year he was hitting 42% from 3-9 ft. This year? A grand total of 0%. (out of 6 shots taken). 10 to 15 ft last year? 51%. 10-15 ft this year? 0% (although out of only 1 shot so probably too insignificant at this point). 16-24 last year? 45%. This year? 37%. Definitely "underachieving" right now to put it nicely, but last year stats have shown it should improve, hopefully.
Agreed. The problem with using unadjusted eFG% to assess shooting skill is that someone whose game naturally revolves around dunks/layups will usually have a higher eFG% than someone who plays more of a midrange game. A player can shoot better at every range and still end up with a lower eFG% by taking more lower-percentage shots.
I agree that the eye-test says he's shooting worse, but that's a *really* small sample size. 0-6 is nothing.
