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[ClutchFans] As Howard sacrifices minutes for wins, Bryant cripples Lakers’ future

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by The Cat, Nov 26, 2013.

  1. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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    Ha ha! I'm GLAD Kobe shafted the Lakers! Hope every player on the Lakers roster gets ultra top dollar. Yay America: goodbye Lakers.
     
  2. Raven

    Raven Member

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    It's called a salary cap. It's, uh, kind of important when trying to put together Championship rosters. Kobe can go for the biggest pile of cash, and more power to him, but don't believe it when he says he wants to win, because he would have taken less if that were the case.
     
  3. ryebread

    ryebread Member

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    Unfair to compare the PER of a low post player and that of wing player who has relied mostly on mid-range jumpers for the past few seasons.

    And surely you don't mean last year's finals team. Are you kidding? The Spurs have been TP's team for a few seasons now.

    And why don't you pull up Garnett's PER for the past three seasons?
     
  4. robbie380

    robbie380 ლ(▀̿Ĺ̯▀̿ ̿ლ)
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    They didn't need him to retire a Laker for that much money. Kobe will always be a Laker great no matter where he plays out the last few years of his career.
     
  5. AstroMechPLZ

    AstroMechPLZ Member

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    Not to mention PER doesn't take into account defense, an area which Duncan has done considerably better than Kobe these past few years.
     
  6. The Cat

    The Cat Contributing Member

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    Yes, and Kobe is going to be there for at least the next three seasons now. Bare minimum, that's 60% of the contract Dwight had on the table from LA. That's a pretty damn long time to put winning as secondary to paying homage to Kobe's greatness. Dwight wasn't willing to wait, nor should any NBA star in the prime of their career, and he was crucified by many in the LA media for not trusting the Lakers and their brand. In the end, this contract extension proved Dwight was right: for the next few years, putting the best contender on the floor is not the priority in LA.

    Is there value for the Lakers in Kobe retiring with them? Of course. But there's a way to do it without paying him over 40% of your salary cap for the next three years. Look at the Spurs with Duncan, what the Mavs are doing with Dirk, etc. Kobe and the Lakers are choosing to go a different route. Dwight saw it coming, fled for an organization with a different mindset, and was crushed by many for doing so. In the end, he was exactly right.
     
    1 person likes this.
  7. Whoopy

    Whoopy Member

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    What does salary cap have to do with it? If I'm an employee, I'm not going to worry about it. I'm going to maximize my earning potential especially when I have enough rings already.
     
  8. AstroMechPLZ

    AstroMechPLZ Member

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    Last season's top 3 PER players:

    Lebron, Durant, Paul. Are these more "low post players" or "wing players"?
     
  9. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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    That's right. Imagine if Dwight signed with the Lakers this past summer and then Kobe went and signed this contract. It would have been Kobe pulling a Colorado on Dwight. Dwight was right to get out of there. He knew the score. I think he's pretty mature for not making it more plain about what he must think of Kobe.
     
  10. The Cat

    The Cat Contributing Member

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    Garnett's PER for the prior three seasons at the time of his extension was 19.4, 20.6 and 20.4. That's not particularly far off, and it doesn't take into account his defense, which has long been Garnett's main value. KG could certainly have made a case for a short-term max contract, if he chose to use that leverage.

    As for last year's Spurs, Parker averaged 21 points and 7 assists with a PER of 23 (in 33 minutes/game). Duncan averaged 18 points, 10 rebounds and nearly 3 blocks with a PER of 24.5 (in 30 minutes/game). Those are pretty damn close in terms of value.
     
  11. torocan

    torocan Member

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    From what I've read, the offer was the Buss family's idea.

    http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/...jim-buss-kobe-bryant-extension-right-thing-do

    If you're a cynic you believe it's PR spin. If you're not a cynic then you take them at their word.

    None of us will know the true story any time soon.
     
  12. ryebread

    ryebread Member

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    No, those are the 3 best players in the NBA. So this doesn't really go against my assertion that Duncan's position results in him taking higher percentage shots than Kobe, leading to higher efficiency. And, all three of those players play in high-octane offenses that lead to a ton of easy fast break points. SAS isn't high-octane, but it is super efficient.
     
  13. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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  14. Amel

    Amel Contributing Member

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    All I'm going to add is:

    2 more years of Kobe at full price isn't even close for what he has given back to the Lakers..
     
  15. ryebread

    ryebread Member

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    I would say that's a pretty big difference in PER for at least the first and third seasons.

    Did you actually watch any spurs games last season? Or just the finals? Obviously Duncan shined in the finals because MIA's weakness is their interior D and their strength is their perimeter defense. But if you watched the spurs during the regular season, TP made that offense go.
     
  16. sirbaihu

    sirbaihu Member

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    Thank goodness it isn't even close to winning one more ring either :)
     
  17. torocan

    torocan Member

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    Honestly, I think it's too early to say.

    They have room for 1 max player next year ($22M). There's no way they were going to get 2. There's no way players like Melo and Lebron would take the kind of salary cuts it would take to get onto the Lakers at the same time. And yah, you could get a few pieces for another $5m or $6m, but not enough to be a legitimate title contender.

    The year after, they'll have some more cap space. And in 2016 is when Durant and some others come on the market (After Kobe's deal expires). So it's quite conceivable they could score a max agent next year, and another max player in the following 2 years.

    Does it reduce their chances of contending next year? Possibly, but not much in my view. The year after Gasol's contract will be done freeing up another $19M potentially. Then there's Nash's contract.

    So maybe they're paying Kobe up front with the understanding he'll take a significant reduction later, or that he'll be retiring. Nobody knows exactly what went on in that room.

    If the Buss family didn't push for a lower salary, then it's probably a safe assumption that they have a plan of *some* kind. Whether that plan is good or awful is something that only time will tell.
     
  18. kuku

    kuku Contributing Member

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    Not one of OP's better articles. The Cat has more misses than hits when it comes to Dwight and Kobe.

    Why do people assume Lakers are in a rebuilding mode? Perhaps too focused on winning championships as the basis for all NBA teams that some forget this is still a business?

    Do people really think Lakers are signing this $48M deal without any risk assessment? The bottom line is Kobe sells. Anytime you are projected to profit from your investment, it's a GREAT business decision!

    You can say all you want about how stupid the Lakers are in signing Kobe. But if you were in Mitch or Jim's shoes, you will probably do the same thing.
     
  19. The Cat

    The Cat Contributing Member

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    So you're arguing that the Lakers prioritized a good "business decision" over "winning championships". Thank you, that's exactly my point and exactly why Dwight left (and made the right decision in doing so, despite many in the media saying otherwise).
     
  20. The Cat

    The Cat Contributing Member

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    I quoted you stats from the regular season, not the Finals. Yes, I watched the Spurs very frequently during the regular season, and Parker and Duncan were of similar value in my assessment. The numbers also reflect that.
     

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