ClutchFans and Daryl Morey: A Call for Introspection and Reason

Should have made this a public poll.

 

Probably not. Anyone who wants to portray themselves as rational is going to choose B and C (myself included). But if this forum was low enough to start labeling people I'm sure we could come to a consensus on a few A's and D's.

 

That would actually be fun. Make a list of the 50 or so most active posters and force them into a grouping.

 

It's not a roll call.
It's a request to people to stop being such giant douches.

 

Morey needs to learn the ways of the Hoops Gods. Championships are won by Brotherhoods of Brothers, not Morey's Mercenaries.

 

It would have been entertaining though.

 

Let's do it. And then ban all the A's and D's. That should solve the OP's problem.

 

I've mentioned it before, but am always amazed at the "all or nothing" attitude of many on the board.

There is a lack of recognition of shades of gray and everything boils down to absolutes.

I find it odd and guess it must feel like living on an emotional rollercoaster.

By the way, I would have preferred to have Adelman back, but I support Morey.

 

I actually don't believe myself to be in any of the four categories you mentioned above. I believe there is a 5th you could add:

5: Intelligent Rocket Fan - While in this category, you don't support Morey or dislike Morey in any way. As an intelligent Rocket Fan, you agree or disagree with Morey based on when he does something that is for the overall betterment of the team. While you may spew words of venom at Morey one week based on one of his decisions and sound like a Morey Hater, you may be singing his praise the next week and sound more like a Moreyite.

I look at the team in this way: As constructed, the Rockets are going to go nowhere next season. With Adelman back or without Adelman. Our current roster is between 8 to 11th best in the Western Conference virtually guaranteeing another 14th pick next season. After watching Adelman the past two seasons, I came to the realization, he was in it to win every game, no matter whether it was what was best for the organization or not. An admirable trait for sure, but was it what was best for the organization in the future. Did a winning record secure us anything but a good feeling? Having a good feeling is nice, having a better draft position without giving up additional "assets" to improve said position is better. Letting some players like Thabeet and Twill get a 10 game look see would have been better. Figuring out our unknowns over the last ten to 15 games was better for the Rockets future. Morey forced Adelman to play other players by trading away players he refused to sit and amazingly, with extended minutes on the court, the replacements on the floor got better and the overall product and results got better. Does anyone think the Spurs were stupid to rest David Robinson's hang nail for 32 games while securing a chance at Tim Duncan? Does anyone think us tanking Ralph Sampson's freshman NBA season wasn't worth the coin flip that got us Olajuwon? I don't think anyone would question those decision's today were what was best for the organization.

Our roster is not good enough. We can stumble along and win 43 games a year for the next 5 years. As we improve, we may even creep up to 49 or even 50 wins. Does this win us titles or does this make us a contenders first round folly? Are we in it to be the team trying to avoid a sweep by the number one team? Is that really what all this arguing about keeping Adelman is really about? I know I want to see titles and I don't see players currently capable of leading us there. I see a lot of guys who would fit into a title squad. The NBA title has not been won by a team without a superstar in the last 35 years which is as long as I can remember back. It could even be longer than that and most of those teams have 2 stars. Stars don't usually just fall in your lap. You acquire them by having a high enough draft position (top 5 normally) or by having enough assets to trade for one of them when they become available. I think we need to be in a position to draft a player to build around or have assets to try and acquire that piece when it becomes available.

I consider myself to be an intelligent Rocket fan. I want to see us in a position to make a run at the title for a 5 to 12 year period with a chance to win multiple titles. I am not blinded by the fools gold which is back to back winning seasons thinking this team is going to magically metamorphosize into a title contender as it grows together. Our GM, in this case being Morey, happens to see the same thing. A roster with no stars and no chance at ever making a title run as is and a coach that does not fit into where the team needs to be now in order to get to where it wants to be in the future.

Because I agree with Morey's vision and plan to acquire a superstar talent to build around to make us a contender, I will continue to sound like a Moreyite. As long as his moves and plans are to move us intelligently forward, I will follow along. I would be worried if the GM of our team was saying "we just came off a winning season and we can win a title as is! All we need is just need a few minor pieces to contend." I can't imagine any intelligent Rocket fan buying that one and I am glad he has the honesty to tell us the truth!!

 

I'm in Group C. He came to clear up the mess that CD and Rudy T created. He managed to get that done,which was no easy task. His drafting has been good,and got us Luis for V-Span.

He moved players that weren't fitting well eg Ariza. His reasoning for moving Battier,because they wouldn't be able to re-sign him was doubtful. However the idea of getting a big in exchange for him was right,except that he went for the wrong player in Thabeet.



Les is not Cuban in the sense that he can't pay the LT regularly,which makes things difficult for Morey,but there is no clear direction as yet for the future in my opinion. DM is more than just stats/intangibles, but there are limitations to them. This is something he has to realize. It was unfortunate that he and Adelman couldn't narrow down their differences.

He can get there in the long run, but he and the future coach will have to convince Les that they can make this team into a contender. Losing Yao/Tracy has hurt us a great deal,but DM is not perfect.

 

<---- unapologetic Moreyite

 

I think this is exactly what the OP says should not do: labeling posters by what they agree on or disagree on. You don't have to be a hater or even a skeptic to say that Morey was wrong to use the word "assets" on players a little too much.

 

On every issue, there are conscious extremists and there are subconscious extremists. The Conscious extremists are those who do terrorist acts. The subconscious extremists while openly denouncing the terrorist acts support what they believe nonetheless, and secretly admire their heroics.

 

I'm somewhere in between B and C, more leaning toward B. I just don't agree with his method of getting us a superstar. He is trying to do something that just doesn't happen very often. I mean Boston did it, Miami and NY did it but had built in advantages and then who else? Boston even had a star already there and got extremely lucky on the timing. Besides that, he has done very well making moves and drafting while keeping the cap in a nice spot.

 

You'd be put in Group A and banned.

 

Skeptic here. Obviously Morey and his team are skilled in the art of picking in the mid to late part of the first round and coming away with value. The trades to acquire Lowry, Lee, Scola ( I think was a Lowry trade) and Artest show that he can also pull the trigger on sizeable deal and come away with the better player. But, I wonder MUCHO about his ability to relate with the players and I agree he is too talkative and probably too analytical. I have serious concerns of what the combo of Morey+Alexander is projecting to players around the league. They need to soften that with a players coach, like the one they just got rid of. The biggest mistake Morey has made was hitching this last year to Yao. I loved this team, and I would have been fine with going forward with Adelman and what we had. I believe we were a decent center and a SF star type away from being able to grow into a contender as long as we kept Adelman and his system. Now I don't know. But if we would have made this decision last year and gone forward with youth we would be much further ahead, weak draft of not. But it was a fun season, so it is talking out of both sides of my mouth.

 

I'll be the first sacrificial lamb. For the greater good!

 

Assets man, we talking about assets. Not a game, not a game, not a game, we talking about assets man.

 

We have a thread about how to approach posting about Morey. I'm not knocking the thread, but for some reason I find that funny.

 

You are the worst of Moreyites because you can't even see you are Moreyite!

Your whole post is stinks manipulation and you do as the face of reasonable man. But you use halftruths to justify your position.

Let's take a look at your negative Morey moves.


2007: Taking Aaron Brooks at #26 (hated the pick; wanted either Tiago Splitter, Glen Davis or Josh McRoberts) This was all about Adelman. He wanted Brooks and he got brooks. At the time we had an undersized PG. Adelman was right. Brooks turned out to be a great pick at that spot. It was Adelmans first year and Morey conceded. Morey's picks that year orin euro somewhere.


2007: Taking Carl Landry at #31 (I actually laughed at SEA when pick was initially announced)Morey didn't even know Landry existed. This was his first draft and one of CD's scouts had been watching the guy for CD and when Morey took over he convinced Morey to get him. Morey gets credit for it because it was under his reign but make no mistake about the scouting was all done on CD's watch.

2008: Taking Joey Dorsey at #33 (skeptical of the pick; wanted either DeAndre Jordan, Bill Walker or Omer Asik) This was a 100% Morey Pick. His second year and he said Joey Dorsey was the center of the future. The way the league is going in terms of centers. That's he first real pick. That same draft he picked Donte Greene and said he was their guy all along. Which means he passed up Batum. The guy I wanted badly. The best guy available at SF at the time which I thought was a first priority. Batum is clearly better than Greene. San Antonio new that and did the blazers two of the smarter drafting teams in the league. But morey wanted Greene and the center of the future. What else did we get that year, Leunen.


2009: Trading Rafer Alston (I loved Lowry but was skeptical of losing Rafer during a playoff run) It's public knowledge all over the board I hated Alston would have dumped him without getting anything back. I thought he was good on the floor at times but he made too many boneheaded plays and acted like a tough guy too much. He was poison in the lockerroom which was posted by Barry and Battier later. I like Lowry no brainer trade. But this trade showed how much better we were without Alston.

2010: Offering Luis Scola $36M+ guaranteed over 4+ years (skeptical that Scola would have returned to Spain if offer was a few million bucks less)
I would have done this deal. He was an asset as Morey said and I agree.

2010: Offering Brad Miller $10M guaranteed over 2+ seasons (thought Adelman factor should have allowed for bigger discount from Brad)
This was an Adelman deal. Miller is overpaid. I like him but anything more than 3 mil is probably too much. Still he comes off the book this year. Morey helped his coach here and that is okay. In hinndsight I wouldn't make this deal because with Yao out, miller was not the answer. But not Morey's fault.

2011: Trading Shane Battier (beyond love for Shane, was skeptical that a 2013 pick and Thabeet's potential were worth eating Thabeet's salary and handing #8 seed to MEM) I am a Shane fan but before the season started I thought if we could upgrade the 3 we had a shot at doing something big this year. Battier with all his heart is not a top level 3. Even his defense is not as good as claimed. I thought Bud was playing better and this would give him a shot. I also wanted to see T-Wll and what he was about. So sad to see Battier go. I honestly don't know anything about Thabeet so I won't comment accept to say the stats and the few clips do not look good. Was it a good trade? No but it wasn't a bad trade either. Memphis saw Thabeet as trast and we as the trash dumpster. We get a 2013 lottery protected pick Ha. Won't even discuss that. Okay so that's what you listed. But what you leave out is so much worst.

You leave out passing on Dejuan Blair and Budinger. He spents 6 million of Les' dollars and bought Jermaine Taylor and Llull. He passed on Budinger and Blair and Marcus Thornton and Sam Young and Dante Cunningham for and spent 6 mil for two guys that will probably never again play for the Rockets. If it weren't Adelman walking up to Les directly and saying this guy can play for us and help open the floor. But that was not about Morey at all. With all morey's assets and staff and stats he came away with Jermaine Taylor. Oh by the way Jermaine Taylor, Joey Dorsey, T-Will and Donte Greene all are similar in one Area. They are some of the stupidest basketball players with more ego than heart in the league. You know he else has more Ego than heart it's Carmelo Anthony. No wonder Morey had such a big time hard on for the guy. Ready to give up the house for him. He goes after players that may look good on stats. Now of course Lowrydoes have heart.And is not in that category. But Lowry was a lucky deal. He came in as a backup to Brooks.

There is much more I can write negatively about Morey but I'll stop there. Mostly because I am tired but also because what is the point. You are not going to loo at any of these without removing your Morey glasses. So I stop there and leave with this. I can say all of these negative things and still think Morey is a good GM. I have two problems with him. One I am still not convinced he is a good player evaluator. As you can see most of the time he has had a chance to pick up the better player available he has missed the boat. Yeah he got it right with PPat but there was only one player on the board that I would have picked over PPat and that was Sanders. Now of course I would PPat now but I the time the thing that made PPat special is his shooting touch. ANd there was no film what soever that made me think he would have that shooting touch. If you take that away than I go Larry Sanders every day. He is a better defender about the same rebounder. A much better shotblocker and he giver more length on a team that most definitely need length. So he gets PPAT as a great pick.

What I do like about Morey is his ability to crunch numbers and keep salaries low. He does that excellent. His trades were good mostly. I also think he is improving as a GM.

My last beef with Management is can we get some home spun blood here. I'm sick of all these easterners coming down south and taking over our teams.