California Colleges Mull Return of Affirmative Action

Or maybe it is because executives and CEO's tend to need a lot of experience and qualifications. That means, those people tend to be much older. Maybe in their 60's.

That means those people were in college in the early 1970's. I would be there were a lot less Asians and other minorities in college back then.

So there are so many more qualified white male candidates for CEO and executive positions.

Minorities running companies will increase in the future due to the increase of minorities in college in the 80's and 90's.

 

Because first you said "how does diversity affect business majors, engineering, biology and computer sciences" and then you said how does diversity affect contribute to majors that don't rely on classroom discussions or student dialogue". Business majors have lots of classes that have discussions, actually so do science classes.

 

I don't know if you have actually done business but getting to know and associate with people of different backgrounds helps you with doing business with them. In my business I have had clients who are Chinese, African and first generation immigrants from Mexico. The experiences that I had before associating with a variety of other students in college, working and socializing with them, have helped quite a bit with developing good working relationships and most importantly getting contracts from them.

That you dismiss this so easily shows that you either don't have actually much business experience or only do so in a very limited capacity.

It helps if you know that stuff ahead of time. Part of my work has been advising others on what to expect and how to deal with different backgrounds.

Anyway this attitude that you will just learn everything at work is a problem with the approach to education. I mean if you feel that way why get worked up at all about not being able to get into the college that you want when you will just learn it all at work.

Yes we should have more diversity.

 

I originally listed several majors that don't rely on discussion/dialogue. Later, instead of re-typing that list, I simply said "majors that don't rely on discussion/dialogue." You're arguing semantics.

I have a business degree, and I don't remember any class discussions. Even if there were, they would be about specific topics pertinent to the lecture...not something that readily lends itself to taking advantage of the students' cultural diversities.

 

I am not saying race isn't still a major factor but I think class is. There are many successful minorities out there who already have a lot of opportunity to go good colleges. For example if I live in River Oaks I doubt my son will have much problem getting into college no matter what race we are. If I live in the Rio Grande Valley though that is a different matter.

As I said earlier one problem with how education is funded in this country is that most states rely on property taxes to fund it so there are huge regional disparities in the educational opportunities. It also happens that these regional disparities are also frequently tied to race as poorer minorities tend to be concentrated in a particular region.

 

Really what school did you go to? I wasn't a business major but I took some business classes and discussion was very important. I mean how are you going to learn marketing, presentation and negotiation skills without having class discussion?

 

Wait? You mean there is more to it than obvious quantifiable measures?

Really?

I don't know.... I don't think it is fair that whites obviously use their education better and are being under represented in elite colleges... they shouldn't be punished by Asian students.... seems backwards to me.

 

I went to UH. Marketing was taught from textbooks. For group projects, people grouped with their friends. My communications class consisted of writing short papers on mundane topics and giving speeches. None of my classes addressed negotiation skills.

 

No offense but if that is all you did at UH my opinion of UH business school has dropped considerably.

 

It consists of over packed classes, students only driven by grades and not learning.... and rampant cheating.

 

No you did not, but the post I was responding to did.

Then you quoted/called me out for not responding to the argument.

Hence, I went through the exercise of responding that argument, which you agree is idiotic on its face.

Circle closed.

 

I agree with bmd. I think that the educational benefits of having a culturally diverse student population are greatly exaggerated.

I used to be an auditor in public accounting, and I encountered a wide variety of people. I treated everyone with respect, and we all got along just fine.

 

Yes, I have a degree in business, so I know what I'm talking about. Other than basics about how to conduct yourself among other cultures when conducting business, there isn't some deep study into different cultures.

And how do I know companies will teach you what you need to know? I was told that by people from different firms before I even got out of college when I was interviewing for internships, and when I was working an internship. And it turns out it's true.

 

Exactly.

 

I think you have an unrealistic view of business schools.

You generally have 4 semesters of business classes. So 20 classes. If you are studying accounting, you will take classes like cost accounting, intermediate accounting, advanced accounting, auditing, finance, business management, marketing, principles of accounting systems, business communications, micro and macro economics, business ethics, etc.

You are studying procedures, formulas, theory, etc.

You aren't studying world cultures, customs, and how to negotiate with foreigners for most of your business majors. Maybe there are some classes dealing with that... but not for a bachelors or masters degree in a major like accounting or finance.

Maybe for an advanced business degree of some type.

 

Many college classes regardless of major at reputable Universities will have discussion as part of the class. It develops reasoning to listen and debate the validity of methods of problem solving in Math. Something as simple as 6x2 can have more than one way to solve it for people learning the concept of multiplication. You could use repeated addition, you could make an array, you could draw six groups with 2 objects inside. Students could present those different ideas and all other students can discuss whether the ideas or valid. Learning to express yourself and critique others is valuable in the business world, it's essential in science, and valuable in Math as well.

Almost any class would have discussion and the students learning would be increased. But even interacting with people of different cultures outside of class and getting that exposure to a different way of thinking would broaden one's minds.

If you guys want to argue against the studies that have been done that's fine. Do your own study with your own criteria and as long as it's valid you can post the findings and teach everyone who wants diversity a lesson.

 

I don't want to be rude but I honestly find it troubling what you and Wekko are saying about your education. In Wekko's case it seems like he wasn't taught some basic skills that are necessary for business such as negotiation, that I even got in my high school class. In your case you are basically saying your education was useless since you were only taught what you needed to know in work.

Frankly I can see why neither of you understand the value of diversity or really even things like discussion and critical thinking since you never got that.

 

If you need to be "taught" how to negotiate, you shouldn't be pursuing a business degree. Negotiation is common sense. Know the value of what you're offering, and know what you're willing to accept for it.

There's a difference between not understanding the value of diversity and recognizing when the value of diversity can't be utilized.

 

And like I said before, whenever there's discussion, it's pertinent to the topic at hand. In a college math class, I doubt that lectures digress to the point that students talk about their cultures.

Absolutely, but college isn't the only place where you can interact with people from different cultures.

I'm not arguing against the results of the studies. I'm arguing against your application of these results. The studies looked at classes that had student dialogue and complex classroom discussion, and they found that cultural diversity led to better cognitive thinking, problem solving, and leadership.

Based on these results, you've claimed that diversity has been proven to provide a better education for all majors. However, since not all majors utilize student dialogue and complex classroom discussion, that's an incorrect claim.

 

I really don't think hanging out with Jamal and Ming watching baseball, putting off projects until the last weekend and sharing a clogged toilet will suddenly make you a shrewd business man when it comes to dealing with Asians and blacks, but hey, they're all the same right. Know one and know them all.

Still waiting for a good reason for why Asian Americans need to be institutionally controlled like lab rats and curb their college admittance rate because they do well.