hey vince, you're REALLY underestimating the exception.....first of all if this trade does go through, it's because you're getting Mo Taylor.......that would leave antonio davis and Oakley also at PF.......at least one has to go.....and with Lenny Wilkens now there, Davis is unhappier than Oakley....AND, Eisley and Vaughn are both Free Agents so if u do get the 4.5million exception, u sign them as free agents, no need to deal through the jazz....the jazz just signed starks, and definately won't sign both eisley AND Vaughn.....with this trade, you get a PG to start, a PG to back him up(you'll have a few actually), and u've signed Mo Taylor....From Toronto's side, it looks GREAT.....sure u lost out on Cuttino, Rashard, and Croshere.....but these PGs aren't as hard to get don't u think?? I think Davis should be number one on our list.....He's PERFECT for this team.... The Deal looks great for houston and toronto, and like teXaSalsa said, it makes SO much sense, but it won't happen..... ------------------
I 100% agree with Sane. Davis is on record as not wanting to spend minutes at the 5 and becomes part of a log jam with Mo Taylor on board. The $ from the exception will get the third option (Carter, then Taylor, then a PG/SG upgrade with the exception $ and Drew as a backup). The reason the FA $ did not work this year is 3 fold - the Raptors hung on too long to a false hope McGrady would return, they did not anticipate Rashard, Croshere, and Mobley as younger players would feel loyalty to their current teams and last the Canadian tax laws which put them at a disadvantage in the FA market. The exception REALLY helps with the last one. This trade works for both teams. Forget Fizer, PJ, Mason, Taylor, Jahidi and the rest - Antonio Davis is the prototype of what the new Rocks need for success - someone who doesn't the ball to make a major impact. He can post up at the 4 with Collier and Langhi on the perimeter, give minutes at the 5 behind Dream and Cato, provide great weak side defense and REBOUND. Can we clone this guy??!! ------------------ GATER
Would you still go after him if you had to give up more? I say this because if I was Toronto I would want more from Houston to make this happen. I started thinking of it from Toronto's perspective. They seem to REALLY want to unload Michael Stewart. If I was them that would be key for anyone wanting to take Davis from me. He actualy think he might sort of fit with this team as a poor man's Cato (granted that's pretty poor). His one real season when he was in Sacramento he was a good hustle/role player backup center type who ran the floor well. So, with that in mind, pretending I'm the Raptors, if I was sure I could get Mo Taylor & one of the point guards, I'd try: Michael Stewart Antonio Davis Doug Christie and/or Alvin Willaims for the exception Walt Williams Bryce Drew Carlos Rogers Toronto would have $10 mil to sign two FA's, they'd get back two players who were generally liked in Toronto, a small forward who's skills would be synergistic with any new PG to help Vince get the ball, and help eliminate their roadblock inside. Houston would go from weak to deep in the front court. Alvin Williams would be beter suited to be a 4th guard as his skills (defense, ballhandeling) are less likely to erode from disuse than Bryce's 'J'(plus he's Mobley's friend, helping to solidify our feel-good friendly backcourt). We'd then either play Anderson / Langhi @ the SF, or move Christie on to a third team in exchange for a platoon type SF, the net result being more time available to see Langhi. Obviously this isn't as great a deal as Drew/Exception for Davis, but if some variation of this were the bottom line, would you do it? (BTW, the cap numbers were estimates from memory - they may be way off) ------------------
Salary numbers are close enough to work with a bit of massaging. Contract Expirations: Davis '03 Stewart '05 (think about that) Christie 7/16/97(ext) 1+7 (1+)$22 million p-opt '02 (think about that) Williams '01 Houston would be bailing Toronto out of some long term contracts just for the sake of getting Davis and bench players. Wouldn't have cap space for a while. Mango ------------------ 1. Put new topics in the proper forum 2. Use clear wording for new threads 3. No duplicate threads 4. Conduct yourself as an adult The Serious Police are watching Donate Blood or be assimilated!
hmmm i dont think the rockets would want to take on williams, christie, and stewarts salary. williams/stewart ok but we certainly dont need doug christie. ------------------ --TEX
Now, let's think about this for a second. Alvin Williams' contract expires pretty soon, so we don't have to worry about that. Doug Christie would not fit in our future plans as we already have a nice 4 guard rotation. I haven't heard about Michael Stewart in awhile, but isn't he way out of shape ala Shawn Kemp? His contract runs through 2005!!! Ouch. What a ripoff! Antonio Davis would be a huge addition to the Rockets, but I wouldn't be comfortable taking on all these ridiculous contracts just to get him. You all seem to be forgetting that this isn't the trade deadline, and AD isn't Randy Johnson. Let's keep our core intact. Let Walt play this year, and see what the draft brings us next summer- pray to God that it be Eddy Curry or Troy Murphy and Terrence Morris. Antonio who? Maybe we can get lucky like Charlotte did last year when they got #3(only to waste it on Baron Davis). IN RUDY WE TRUST ------------------ "Oh No..." -Bill Walton in 97 just before Stockton's buzzer beater
Antonio Davis also has an opt-out after the season....Doug Christie doesn't fit in here, I wonder if then we could move him somewhere like say Detroit for JYD. ------------------ The Serious Police are watching. Follow the rules or be assimilated. Shandon is underrated.
wait wait wait.....u forget the basics....why would they take back another PF (ROGERS)??????? the deal would be Walt+Drew+exception for Davis+Christie.....Christie is unhappy in toronto...he's more used to, plays better at, and prefers the small forward spot...filling up walt's departure....getting us davis....finding a home for Bryce Drew....that's the most we can go without majorly disrupting chemistry on both sides....it's still perfect as i don't regard christie as better than walt.....but the basic deal is much better for both sides...............after the basic deal, they can get a deal done with Christie+Stewart+one of their many backup guards(Alvin Williams?) for one above average player and someone who's contract finishes next year.... ------------------
Walt Williams: is not the guy toronto is looking for, and if my memory serves me right the guy used to play in Toronto before he was traded to Portland. I don't think he's wanted back by his x-team the raptors. Sane: You would have to throw in another player instead of Walt to make the trade work. HOw about Shandon Anderson& Exeption for Antonio&Christie.....id don't know if it will work salary cap wise, but it will be a fair deal. Drew: Toronto wants a proven PG not someone that has always played in the shadow of some other player. Chrisite: A good player but makes many bad decisions in his shot selection, and has many stupid turnovers. But, at D he would be the best Rocket. Alvin Williams: He just SUCKS i don't think the Rockets should get this guy. He does not have the mentality to play in the league. He takes the most ill-advised shots in the league. This guy belongs in the CBA. Though he does show flashes of being an okay NBA player....but that's rare ------------------ $$ out $$
If Christie came with the package with Davis why would that be so bad, can he not shoot the 3 ? The games I've seen him play he looked pretty athletic, putting pressure on the ball with nice ball handling skills and could play either the 2 or the 3, so I don't see him replacing Walt being a problem especially the way Langhi shoots the ball. It just might be a nice change of pace. ------------------ Rockets For Better, For Worse......'til death do us part!
VinceCarter no offense but as little possibillity of this trade happening i think throwing in shandon anderson would be incredibly foolish on the rockets part and swing the trade in favor of toronto a whole lot. i wouldnt even trade shandon for davis straight up. im sorry i dont see that as a fair deal at all. besides vince and mo pete occupy the 2 and 3 there anyways. if the rockets were making a deal and wanted to take on a bad contract or 2 it'd be fine but if they were trading shandon anderson wouldnt even be considered i think. ------------------ --TEX
This is *ALL* a pipe dream, but let me give it a shot. I hope the formatting works!!!! Rockets: Lose Walt to Raptors, Bryce and Exception to Hornets. Gain Antonio Davis and Alvin Williams. Raptors: Lose Davis and Alvin Williams to Rockets and Del Curry to Hornets. Gain Walt William, Brad Miller, and Elliot Recasner. Hornets: Lose Brad Miller and Elliot Recasner to Raptors. Gain Del Curry, Bryce Drew and 4.5M Exception. Remember, the Hornets just took in some major contracts in the Miami trade and created a glut at PF. I think OT & Magliore can play some 5 and make it work for the Hornets. If Carter switches to the 2, Walt can play the 3 and Recasner can backup Carter. Miller is a more natural 5 than Davis. I think Curry wants to return to Charlotte. I think the numbers are close. Go easy on me - this is the first time I have tried anything this complex!!! ------------------ GATER
the thing is vince, Christie is over the hill...he's probably peaked....no, he's definately peaked....but anderson is gonna have his best season....another thing is, u have to realize that Eisley/Vaughn are not shadows....they're expected to start after next season for Utah (whichever is signed)....they're young, and Vaughn, more than eisley, is gonna become a damn god PG.......and yet another thing is, the salaries don't match....and if we get technical, that way, we're setting your back court, while you're giving us Antonio Davis, and an overpayed player in Christie.....I think u should keep christie, cause he can have SF minutes, where vince is gonna gradually move to SG this season....by season's end, he'll be considered a SG....i don't think Portland dislike Walt Williams, he went there in the stoudamire deal, wasn't by demand or anything.....so the fair trade would be drew and exception for Davis (as originally stated)....if u throw in christie, we throw in williams..... ------------------
