HP--I don't want to get into a back and forth arguement about the Soviet Union and ballet. The end of the Soveit Union was what 1990? Making the kid 10 at the time. During that time it took at least another 4 years before Georgia was able to break apart from Russia. Making him 14. I assume he stopped ballet in his early teens because of his height. Point being he did it with the money from Moscow. As far as centers like the YMCA, have you ever been to the Caspian area? I have and they don't have much for facilities. I seriously doubt that his ballet wasn't intense but it's hearsay so let's leave it at that. My point is that any kid that large who has the coordination, stamina and strength to do ballet is a serious plus in my book. And you've made it clear that you value that as well. If he's only been playing basketball for a few years and he's already as good as the NBA scouts project, then he's got to be pretty incredible. I can not dismiss him with the 5th pick. If Rudy/CD picked him, I would not be suprised or upset.
aelliott, I am not criticizing the kid. He sounds thrilling. All the quotes I gave you were from Europe. I don't know why you are refering to NBAdrafts lame early take on Gasol, when now they are trying to correct that by comparing a 19yr old to him. It makes sense that as the Gasol's succeed, we will read more favorable stuff from European prospects. Like I said, I think we are viewing European potential (without pro playing time) like HSers now. That's fine and actually good for the NBA, but it is still pure potential. If you want to compare him to Gasol and Dirk coming out who were goto players on their teams in Europe, that's fine. I don't do that; I call it potential. Gasol played tremendous in the playoffs last year. He lead a powerhouse team, in a powerhouse league, to the title and was named Finals MVP. Your season stats don't do justice to the final outcome of his season. He bumped his stats in the Finals to 17ppg and 9rpg and 3 blocks read this: <a href="http://espn.go.com/nba/draft2001/s/2001/0624/1218102.html">Gasol ready to go on NBA adventure</a> That was a mere week before the draft. Don't you think his stock rose dramatically on that? Comparing Tsika sitting on the bench in the playoffs like nbadraft.net says is somewhat insulting to Gasol. That does not mean he won't be a star. I just have a different way of talking about him; that's all.
<b>bring it Greg M!!</b> There is a thing in debating on the BBS where you recognize someone's personal hobbies/life-long "studies," and you kinda back off and defer. OK, so you have dismissed me twice on Ballet and have pressed it now, like you are a know-it-all on the subject. nope! You really do not know what you are talking about concerning the infrastructure of organized amateur Ballet in the Soviet Union. I've talked to Russian Principle ballerina's in the Houston Ballet about this at galas. My wife and paso2x have talked to champion ballroom dancers from Russia. The sports are played everywhere like hockey. The communist empire had training centers everywhere just like the YMCA. You make it sound like some scout went down to Georgia to measure 6 yrs olds and check their spine and whisked Tsika away to Moscow. That is sooooooooooooo xenophobic, and weird. Ballet (and ballroom dancing), just like Hockey, is a huge HUGE HUGE "sport" in the Soviet Union. To think no cities other than the cities with the big ballet companies and hockey teams have teaching facilities is just ignorant. Very ignorant.
HP-Oh so now ballet is your life long study? I'm sorry but I won't defer to the fact that you consider this kid to be hype without seeing him play while relying on NBADraft.net. Let the professionals make that decision. He may very well be a bust or he could be better than Niwitski. We just don't know. I'm not going to back off since you claim to be some sort of expert because you've watched some ballet and even took a couple of classes. BFD. I'm sorry if you're used to people kissing your ass on this board but I will not. I'll agree when I do and vocalize when I don't. The truth to the matter is that neither of us is an expert in the subject. We've had our experiences and they are different. I need to clarify the a few poiunts on the region. Those in Russia, Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia had amazing resources for the arts. The rest of the Soviet Union did not. The Caspian area is not to be confused with the Baltic states. These are the areas the Russians looked at as second class. My parents lived in Azerbakain for years and I visited there multiple times just after they had seperated from Russia. The USSR didn't invest any money in these coutries except for a few damn Stalin sculptures and a little education. They stole the Azeris' language, religion and culture and for what? Oil. It was really a raw deal for the entire Caspian area. They were used and as a result they're now spiritually, culturally and financially bankrupt. Azerbajain is lucky enough to still ahave a ton of oil in their coutry but Armenia and Georgia aren't so fortunate. Talk about xenophobia. Meanwhile back to the west of Russia, these coutries were funded with a ton of money and speciafically education in the arts. My Aunt and Uncle lived in Latvia for a year. Unfortunately I wasn't able to visit them there but what you describe about the opportunites in the arts was true. Riga is supposed to be a breath taking masterpiece with it's architecture and incredible strong background in the arts. It's a stark contrast to the Asian counterparts. BTW...I'm not xenophobic in the least. I was born oversees, speak Arabic fluently and have studied other languages in depth. I live to learn and appreciate the cultural differences in all the regions I've been exposed to. It's really quite a rush for me. Anyway....I hope I've clarified my stance here more. Peace.
Todd Fuller? Chris Mihm? Both of those guys were tennis players and o far both have sucked played nba. Playing those other sports do help you playing hoops, but hoops has skill involved also.
Jesus, I don't think the ballet thing was supposed to be such a debate. Anyway. I've been to Azerbaijan, which is, if i'm not mistaken, Azerbakain, and it wasn't all that bad. Not to be racist, really, but I feel Americans don't realize there's life just as civilized as theirs in 3rd world countries. Like when I tell someone I'm from the U.A.E. , they wonder where I got a computer from. I highly doubt there wasn't ONE place to practice ballet in all of Georgia when this guy was in his early/mid teens. But I do think you guys are making a big deal out of nothing.
I agree we're making a big deal out of nothing but when were you in Baku sane? Did you go south of Baku to the striped areas. I'm not implying Baku is a wasteland but it was not on par with the European areas of the USSR and they certainly haven't had the same cultural opportunities. Now they've had a very large resurgence of money coming from oil and Russia's barely getting by. Karma's a b****. Ana la 3andi aya mishakel bik. Lakin la ahab en-nis illy yafakar in yaruf kul ish-shay dowlaya. qult inny liyssa khabeer. el mohem. hakahlee hadha moduwa3.
Greg M, Do you know who George Balanchine was? At what country he was from? btw: I write on topics I love and know about, not to build my post count. Please cut out the "heypee thinks he's great because of his post count," crap. It is lame.
This will be in SI's Sign of the Apocalypse: "Clutchcity BBSers debating the merits of ballet when it comes to footwork in basketball." The end is near.
Arguably one of the best WR's in football history trained by using ballet and it seemed to work for him....Lynn Swann
Then maybe you shouldn't be talking about Ballet and Georgia. George Balanchine is the father of modern ballet. He was the Artistic Director of the New York City Ballet for decades. He was the John Wooden of ballet. Everyone who follows ballet in the minutest way, knows who he was He was born in a small village in Georgia He studied ballet until he was old enough to try out for the big leagues. He is the best example of how Georgians take pride in their ballet and little girls and little boys practice in little schools in little towns with dreams of going to the big city. They might not have big ornate theatres to attract big dance companies, but neither does Nebraska.
This debate has way off track and we've both stated our points. I respect you and your opinions. Truce?
Truce fine. Go ahead and insult a nation's heritage, and then call for peace and truce. I'm down for that. I love it. Let me try: The Soviet Union robbed Georgia of their heart and soul, and stole their babies to teach them ballet, and they now have no culture. Tsika must be a product of that! He must have been forced to do ballet, then later forced to play basketball. How's that? Am I getting it right? Don't ask me for a truce. I don't need the histrionics. I'd rather you consider an apology to Russian, Georgia, George Balanchine, and ballet dancers throughout Russia and Latvia for this ignorant statemet: Yes, Tsika was "forced" to take lessons just like Baryshnikov. That nation taught the world for 3 centuries the greatest dance form of mankind, and you rob them of their heritage and culture in that statement, and ironically say the Soviet Union robbed them of culture. I'm sorry, Greg M, I tried to ignore that statement, when you butted into a conversation with Raven and I, and didn't respond to it, then, but you just wouldn't drop the subject, would you? A subject that you admit you know nothing about. I consider that statement disrespectful of a great nation, and great people, who take tremendous pride in Ballet/Dancing, despite what a deranged Stalin did to them. There is one reason and one reason only that Russia has the best ballet, best figure skating, best ballroom dancers...because they invented it, perfected it, and is so pervasive that they have more kids dancing it than any other part of the world, and it has nothing to do with the communist regime. Now, can I say "TRUCE," too?
There's no need to get nasty about it HP, especially given Greg M actually has first hand knowledge of the situation over there. Don't know why you;re always so would up when someone tries to prove you wrong, even if they do a poor job of it.
