What are you using to determine that Bregman is "hands down" better on defense than Trout? Trout is a gold glove caliber center fielder.
Yes. But mainly, I am questioning your use of the term "hands down". Bregman is nothing special as a shortstop. He is much better at third.
Not Hands down means playing the much more difficult position and playing it at top notch level meaning 3rd base gives Bregman the advantage with anything close in numbers although I know the Trout groupies aren’t going to like that view. How many difficult difficult plays does Trout make in a season 10, 15? Now compare that to Bregs.
That has been empirically derived to correlate with wins. Sure it fluctuates a little with time and it isn't perfect. Considering that WAR has about a 75% degree correlation with wins and sequencing accounts for most of the error, I take your "Not" to mean that you disagree with the way MLB has been keeping score all these years.
So you would say that Bregman at shortstop is hands down better defensively than any center fielder in baseball?
Bregman is having a terrific season but Trout has been worth 2 more wins. The MVP race really isn't close.
Over their careers? Trout has made 10.3% of Remote chances (which are expected to made less than 10% of the time). 31.6% of Unlikely (10-40%) Bregman is at 1.4% and 24.4% (just looking at 3B, since most of his playing time is there). Bregman does get more of those opportunities (probably 3 times as many). There are stats to compare them defensively, which would favor Trout career wise in value, but for 2019 would favor Bregman. But Trout's offensive numbers are a good deal better than Bregman's. And unsurprisingly, Trout's baserunning value is higher.
Breg is about to be top 4 in positional fWAR for the second year in a row. A superstar locked in for the next five seasons at a discounted rate.... beautiful.
I will say Bregman is being jobbed in defensive stats, and I think the gap is slightly closer than 2 wins. Though, I don't think 3B is worth at least 20 home runs (amount necessary for hands down determination) more than CF so take my thoughts with a grain of salt.
I love Bregman but unless Trout has the worst slump of his career and Bregman has the best month of his career he is not winning MVP. Trout has a higher OBP higher OPS higher OPS+ more RBIs more SB 11 more HRs Bregman would have to surpass Trout in a lot of those categories to even have a chance because of Trout's reputation as the best player in baseball.
No I’m just saying that the positions difficulty itself should be considered when determining an MVP. Berkman played CF just saying.
What run adjustment do you think a player should get for a full season at 3B over a full season in CF? What run adjustment do you think there is between CF and DH?
https://blogs.fangraphs.com/alex-bregman-still-has-another-gear/ Here's a good article on an area Bregman has room to grow. The too long, didn't read version, he hits the crap out of the ball on the inner third, but only swings at pitches down the middle.
Nothing exact I think they should be really close right now as the numbers stand if you value defense as much as offense. As for a DH i don’t think they should even be considered for MVP and the same goes for a pitcher. The MVP should be reserved for an everyday player that goes out everyday and gives his team the best chance to win on offense and defense more than anyone else.
Mike Trout is leading MLB in OPS+. He has led his league for 5 years in a row, with Ty Cobb, Babe Ruth, Rogers Hornsby, Mickey Mantle, Mike Schmidt and Barry Bonds*. If he leads all of MLB again this year, for the 4th year in a row, he's with Cobb, Ruth, and Bonds* I love Bregman. "Best" vs "Most Valuable" is a discussion. "Best" is not.
To be clear, I started this thread because of the sign above ^^ But glad to see that Alex has put himself in the MVP discussion
