1. Value in the longer term persepctive. What I call the self-satisfied outlook of the Latest Generation pales when compared to the outlook and devotion of the Greatest Generation. I know there are critics within the Greatest Generation but it's not an inordinate number. 2. Rather than talk about envy of the US, I would opt for something more like resentment. The US is obnoxious and arrogant culturally. That offends me as a Christian and I know that the Muslim world has less tolerance that I do. 3. The radical Muslim element percolates in the disenfranchised elements of society. A smaller percentage of radicalized anything is usually more potent than a larger percentage of disinterested persons. The growing poor and starving populations around the world are hotbeds of future radical Muslims. The pursuit of souls there is evil rather than loving. It's a gang mentality. 4. If we lose this war (militarily or politically) the attacks will not stop and should in fact increase. Wouldn't you? 5. Excessive political correctness is a poison to our effort to defeat this "army." 6. Divisiveness over civil rights issues is paranoia. In times like these, Civil Rights have been suspended or abandoned and returned when the threat has passed. There is a problem in that this threat is hard to recognize and categorize, so it will be tough to ascertain that it has indeed passed. Nevertheless, it must be done to track and detain enemies who work quietly from within. 7. Did you notice that the author didn't call people who are "unsympathetic" to this viewpoint traitors? He just called them oblivious to the dangers. I think that is fair. 8. What have been the contributions of Muslim societies to the world? Algebra! And that dates back to when? Go ahead and call me a xenophone if it makes you feel better, but I think it is reasonable to ask for more evidence of what these closed, intolerant societies offer the world. We are the source of their wealth beause we buy their oil. What else are they doing?
giddy- I appreciate you responding in susbtance, thanks. Best of luck to all Rockets fans this evening. This is good stuff, seriously. I'm on board with you here. I think your own writing would have done you better service than standing by the letter you posted. I don't say this to be contradictory, I promise- I just don't understand what you mean by "lose the war." You mean leaving Iraq? If that's what you mean, then there is far more evidence to support the supposition that anti-US hatred (which you referred to above) and therefore terrorist recruitment and attacks will only increase and grow as our soldiers stay there, rather than leaving. To be honest, I still sometimes hold hope that somehow Iraq will turn around and become a successful progressive democracy. Short of that, the entire war on Iraq has not benefitted us in the war on terror. If you just mean "lose the war on terror," what does that mean? I have no idea what that means. As for number 5- Can I assume by "political correctness" you mean anti-profiling? I guess we'd catch more bad guys faster if we profiled. Back when I was pro-war, I actually wrote a long post supporting profiling. I'm about 60-40 or 70-30 against it now, but I can see the benefits. #6- for the life of me, I don't understand why conservatives trust government so much. I thought conservatives were for small government, less federal control, etc. I flat-out do not trust goverment to handle civil-rights invading powers with responsibility and respect. Period. There is WAY too much evidence on my side for me to think otherwise. Anyone who has read their history knows that it IS a slippery slope. The author gets one half of one kudo for trying to appear not to be partisan. I'll take "oblivious to the dangers" over "treasonous America-haters" but it's still offensive. I think conservatives are oblivious to the dangers of eroding civil rights. giddy, I am troubled that so many theocratic Muslim countries are ass-backwards on social issues and civil rights. That being said- dude, this sh*t is you've typed is not cool. There are a lot of Muslim countries out there, not just a handful in the middle east. A lot of them are poor, and a lot of them contain wonderful people who are oppressed by dictatorial theocratic regimes and deserve better. You're crossing into the dangerous territory of calling all Muslim countries the ubiquitous "they", and your condemnation of these societies reads as a condemnation of Islam. If that's the case, then come out and say it. I've got a problem with intolerant Muslim societies too. In fact, I would proffer that the most successful countries in the middle east are the ones who have most shunned theocratic rule. but I don't lump them all together in blanket statements. There are BILLIONS of Muslims in the world. How do you answer the question "what have they done for the world?" How does a third world country answer that question? It's easy for America to ask that. Not every nation in the world can be an innovator in science, astronomy, technology, and medicine. I think I could list some Islamic staes and nations that have made contributions but I don't want to give the assertion merit.
Ever heard of elections? We don't have a situation where ANYONE (not even Saddam Hussein) is going to get 100% of the votes cast. If the Civil Rights abuses are so bad, we'll have a made-over Congress within 6 years. We have a new administration every 4 years. Seems like you are trying to describe an abysmal outcome that no one can change. I don't see it that way-- that's why I can trust the government. It is made up of people just like you and me who, to varying degrees and in varying ways, love and respect this country. Why is it offensive to have somebody suggesting that you don't recognize the magnitude of the gravity of the danger? How are my civil rights eroded if I don't take or make phone calls or send money to suspected terrorists? I'm sure there are wonderful people, but what have they contributed to the betterment of the world? Being poor is part of the problem. Of course they deserve better. Isn't that the point that the author is making? Unless they are freed from their oppressors, they will have no opportunity to unleash the brilliance and generosity that they posess. Inspired people are a treasure for us all. Disposessed and oppressed are a problem for us all. The cricism here is of the nation not the individuals. My greatest contribution to the world is 4 children who I raise in the hopes of having them to be better citizens of the world than I am/was. That's not a lot-- but my nation has allowed other individuals to flourish and have great impact on the world. This particular skirmish we are engaged in in Iraq is largely about fighting off a plan to disallow that kind of opportunity. I don't really mean to incriminate all Muslims? I have no issues with Muslim people; I do think that I have a problem with how I understand they govern or want to govern their people. Which are the tolerant Muslim societies that I can admire? The only contribution that anyone made here was centuries old. These radical Muslims who want to seize control over their population and whatever nations they can are often described as having a Dark Ages mindset. Are you prepared to live in a world where terrorism reigns? War is bad enough but unchecked terrorism is worst.
Not quite sure what "losing the war" means anymore. Hell I'm not quite sure who we're fighting anymore. It went from cracking down on Muslim terrorists to fighting a war in Iraq involving major sectarian warfare from new indigenous insurgents. Al Qaeda certainly has a presence there but its only one group among several others, many of which aren't the standard groups we saw before. As for the political aspect, you're obviously referring to Iraq, and yes I agree that's important in terms of stopping the insurgency and creating some level of stability. Hopefully things work out. However, this debate has been beaten to death so I'll stop wasting time here. I suppose I'm not quite sure what political correctness you are referring to so some clarification would be good The "history" you cite is extremely limited. Lets see, John Adams passed the Alien and Sedition Acts which were quickly repealed and declared as tyrannical and unAmerican as any piece of legislation ever passed. Then in the Civil War we had the suspension of Habeas Corpus which to this day is still controversial but then again that was the Civil War involving ongoing warfare in the US. Unless you want to assert that this "war on terror" is on par with the Civil War, I think we can say that today's conflict warrants much greater protection of civil liberties. If suspending habeas corpus in that situation was controversial, it would be downright idiotic today in a situation that is no where near the Civil War. Finally, during the Cold War we had the McCarthyism debacle that proved to be a blatant abuse of government power and a real reason as to why we should be sceptical of government power. Point is, what got us this far was our unending committment to civil rights in all aspects of life, and that we should be sceptical of government power. Even if you trust the administration now, there's no telling what future administrations might do with this power. Nixon was a paranoid nuthead and I can only imagine what he might be doing with the power to wiretap without warrant or monitor phone records, or even legalizing torture. Not to mention I personally believe most people criticizing the Bush administration's policies have been pretty reasonable. For example, after 9/11 we loosened up the FISA act to allow for retroactive warrant requests and that still wasn't enough. There has to be some limit on government power. Its sad when we have to actually point something out like this and congratulate the guy for it. No one should be spewing out the traitor accusations against anyone so props to him for being a little better about it. I guess setting a low bar makes it look real good when you actually do it right. Wow there... I suppose the contributions of the Central African Republic or Malta should take precedent. Hell outside of Europe, parts of Asia and North America, what has anyone done for us lately? Using your logic most of the world is worthless since they don't do anything productive in terms of technology. Also, if you have a problem with this, then stop buying their damn oil. We've been whining about oil dependency since the Carter administration and no one has done anything about it.
Ever heard of elections? We don't have a situation where ANYONE (not even Saddam Hussein) is going to get 100% of the votes cast. If the Civil Rights abuses are so bad, we'll have a made-over Congress within 6 years. We have a new administration every 4 years. Seems like you are trying to describe an abysmal outcome that no one can change. I don't see it that way-- that's why I can trust the government. It is made up of people just like you and me who, to varying degrees and in varying ways, love and respect this country. This is a good point- I used the same point when speaking with some Canadian America-bashing friends of mine (so sick of that.) Still, the nature of elections and turnover is not a reason to trust government. It just means that some mistakes will be corrected eventually. It is no comfort to those of us who have read about Macarthyism in the cold war, that eventually it ended and people said it was wrong. It should never have happened. Goverment power cannot be trusted and must be limited. Why is it offensive to have somebody suggesting that you don't recognize the magnitude of the gravity of the danger? How are my civil rights eroded if I don't take or make phone calls or send money to suspected terrorists? 1st question- it's patronizing. 2nd question- this shows a fundamental misunderstanding of civil rights. If you agree that you have a civil right to privacy, then that right has eroded when you grant the govt power to invade it. Would you be fine with weekly or daily searches of your house? After all, you don't own anything illegal, so why should you object? There is WAY too much history and evidence on my side for me to blindly trust govt with increased power to invade our lives. I'm sure there are wonderful people, but what have they contributed to the betterment of the world? How can you speak of your children as contributions to the world as good citizens, yet negate this possibility for denizens of Muslim countries? Being poor is part of the problem. Of course they deserve better. Isn't that the point that the author is making? Unless they are freed from their oppressors, they will have no opportunity to unleash the brilliance and generosity that they posess. Inspired people are a treasure for us all. Disposessed and oppressed are a problem for us all. Agreed. Well said. The cricism here is of the nation not the individuals. My greatest contribution to the world is 4 children who I raise in the hopes of having them to be better citizens of the world than I am/was. That's not a lot-- but my nation has allowed other individuals to flourish and have great impact on the world. This particular skirmish we are engaged in in Iraq is largely about fighting off a plan to disallow that kind of opportunity. I don't really mean to incriminate all Muslims? I have no issues with Muslim people; I do think that I have a problem with how I understand they govern or want to govern their people. Well said. Your previous tone seemed to incriminate Islam and Muslims in general, and the letter you posted definitely did. Which are the tolerant Muslim societies that I can admire? The only contribution that anyone made here was centuries old. These radical Muslims who want to seize control over their population and whatever nations they can are often described as having a Dark Ages mindset. Are you prepared to live in a world where terrorism reigns? War is bad enough but unchecked terrorism is worst.
