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[ClutchFans] Rockets Playbook: Examining Jeremy Lin's favorite set
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HMMMHMM is offline Old 02-24-2014, 11:57 AM   #1
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http://rockets.clutchfans.net/6238/j...favorite-play/
 
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crash5179 is offline Old 02-24-2014, 11:59 AM   #2
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Nice contribution. I always enjoy your writting.
 
Carl Herrera is offline Old 02-24-2014, 12:02 PM   #3
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Thanks. The word is that James Harden also loves to use the backside pick and roll in his personal life.

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scottie brooks is offline Old 02-24-2014, 12:08 PM   #4
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Very Informative. Thanks! I will be looking for this play during the next Rockets game.
 
AvgJoe is offline Old 02-24-2014, 12:11 PM   #5
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So we have a set play....

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Joe Joe is offline Old 02-24-2014, 12:12 PM   #6
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Thanks for putting this together.

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bmd is online now Old 02-24-2014, 12:12 PM   #7
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But jtr told me they don't run any plays?
 
gluu is offline Old 02-24-2014, 12:35 PM   #8
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HMMMHMM, I love your analysis. I was wondering if you could break down the difference in defensive ability between Jeremy Lin and Patrick Beverley as well? It's hard for me to tell the difference other than looking at the box score.
 
HMMMHMM is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:24 PM   #9
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Thanks guys.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AvgJoe View Post
So we have a set play....
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmd View Post
But jtr told me they don't run any plays?
Again, the Rockets do have various set plays. They just don't make use of them very often.

This particular play for example they might go to 2-3 times one game, then only once for 4-5 games in a row and then not all for another 4-5 games.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crash5179 View Post
Nice contribution. I always enjoy your writting.
Ha, thanks, but my writing is pretty bad to be honest. Clutch was kind enough to once again help me out in that regard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gluu View Post
HMMMHMM, I love your analysis. I was wondering if you could break down the difference in defensive ability between Jeremy Lin and Patrick Beverley as well? It's hard for me to tell the difference other than looking at the box score.
I hate to turn you down, but I wouldn't want to half-ass a project like this and doing it right would be way too time-consuming. Sorry.

Last edited by HMMMHMM; 02-24-2014 at 01:28 PM.
 
jtr is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:26 PM   #10
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Every metric I have seen ranks hand offs right up there with at the rim shots as far as PPP.
 
FeaR is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:27 PM   #11
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Great work, I watch all your videos(Rockets or not)

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jtr is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:30 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmd View Post
But jtr told me they don't run any plays?
Please read up on the R&R offense. The Rockets don't run set plays except in situations like in bound passes. However that certainly does not mean that what develops out of the R&R cannot be categorized as a play.
 
bmd is online now Old 02-24-2014, 01:37 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtr View Post
Please read up on the R&R offense. The Rockets don't run set plays except in situations like in bound passes. However that certainly does not mean that what develops out of the R&R cannot be categorized as a play.
We've been over this. The R&R offense by Rick Torbett is not what the Rockets run. Stop saying it is.

Have you ever read about Torbett's R&R offense? I find it hard to believe you could read what it's about and somehow think that is what the Rockets are doing. It's so far off that there is no way you could get confused about it. It's baffling that you keep mentioning it.

And the set that Jeremy Lin was talking about is a play. It's been practiced. It's been run many times. They have many options out of the set depending on how the defense plays it.
 
HMMMHMM is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:37 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtr View Post
Please read up on the R&R offense. The Rockets don't run set plays except in situations like in bound passes. However that certainly does not mean that what develops out of the R&R cannot be categorized as a play.
This is false. The Rockets do run various set plays, including this one, that have nothing to do with their read and react offense.

Also, as bmd and others (including myself) have told you before, the Rockets read and react offense has nothing to do with what you like to refer as "the R&R" aka "The Read and React Offense" by Rick Torbett of BetterBasketball.com. It doesn't. Please stop trying to make people believe this.
 
afk is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:41 PM   #15
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I miss Patterson.

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jtr is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:48 PM   #16
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There are many offenses that can be grouped under the umbrella of R&R. The Triangle, Alderman's offense, even the Princeton offense. Torbett attempted to unite the whole field, perhaps unsuccessfully.

And what is a set play? Doesn't it have to be planned? Called? Or do just what we as fans call plays develop naturally out of the R&R? I do not see the PG or McHale calling plays before they happen. An out of bounds play can be called in the NBA. Everything else is just react correctly to what the defense is offering you.

I honestly cannot fathom where you two are coming from. Perhaps it is my own limitations.
 
Karolik is offline Old 02-24-2014, 01:50 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HMMMHMM View Post
I hate to turn you down, but I wouldn't want to half-ass a project like this and doing it right would be way too time-consuming. Sorry.
haha, you don't need an analysis for that. It basically comes down to

Bev = good defender
Lin = below average defender

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HMMMHMM is offline Old 02-24-2014, 02:21 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtr View Post
And what is a set play? Doesn't it have to be planned? Called? Or do just what we as fans call plays develop naturally out of the R&R? I do not see the PG or McHale calling plays before they happen.
I can't tell from my TV how often McHale is calling plays, but the Rockets' players do call and/or signal plays, yes.

I don't track the various playcalls/signals, since they're of little use to me, however I did take a few snapshot of some easy to make out signals when breaking down a few other Rockets sets some time ago.

This, for example, is "Elbow", which is the Rockets play-call for flex action out of Horns, which has been in their playbook for at least a year.



And this is "Horns", which is their play-call for pick&roll out of Horns:



... which may be set the Rockets most commonly make use of.
 
hollywoodMarine is offline Old 02-24-2014, 02:23 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karolik View Post
haha, you don't need an analysis for that. It basically comes down to

Bev = good defender
Lin = below average defender
I thought it's been established in the RAPM thread that Lin contributes positively on defense? It's his issues meshing well with the starters (esp. Harden) offensively that is most problematic.
 
jtr is offline Old 02-24-2014, 02:26 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtr View Post
There are many offenses that can be grouped under the umbrella of R&R. The Triangle, Alderman's offense, even the Princeton offense. Torbett attempted to unite the whole field, perhaps unsuccessfully.

And what is a set play? Doesn't it have to be planned? Called? Or do just what we as fans call plays develop naturally out of the R&R? I do not see the PG or McHale calling plays before they happen. An out of bounds play can be called in the NBA. Everything else is just react correctly to what the defense is offering you.

I honestly cannot fathom where you two are coming from. Perhaps it is my own limitations.
And ... silence. Have I put this issue to bed? Most probably not. But IMHO a "set" play has to be called, the whole team has to be on board, and with a single purpose in mind. Isn't that the definition of a "set play"? In the middle of a possession do you see the Rockets redirecting players to different positions? Certainly. The example that sticks in my mind is of Harden motioning a teammate to get out of my driving path. Get to the weak side. But does that indicate that the Rockets have an offensive purpose in mind other than just clearing out defenders? Where actually is a play called? Is he going to drive to the rim or put up a three point shot behind a screen? Or just reset and pass off to a teammate? I seriously doubt in that situation that even Harden knows. It is just what the defense offers. Isn't that the definition of the R&R?
 

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