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12-26-2009, 12:50 PM
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#1
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Contributing Member
Since: Feb 2006
Posts: 17,393
Member: #16420
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I like this way of representing offense and defense of various teams. I calculated standardized offensive and defensive ratings (the more positive, the better) using the schedule-adjusted efficiency numbers at basketball-geek.
The Celtics are amazing right now -- dominant defense, with a still very potent offense. The Rockets are above average, but not stellar, on both ends. The Pistons and Hornets, interestingly enough, rate identically on both ends.
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12-26-2009, 01:20 PM
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#2
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Member
Since: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,446
Member: #38691
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Great work. Boston are indeed dominating.
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12-26-2009, 01:38 PM
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#3
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Contributing Member
Since: Apr 2005
Posts: 10,466
Member: #16162
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Hmm...so the Lakers are average offensively. That's surprising.
Who is jumbled up with the Pistons at -0.5 / -0.5?
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12-26-2009, 01:41 PM
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#4
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Member
Since: Jun 2009
Posts: 230
Member: #42978
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ClutchCityReturns
Hmm...so the Lakers are average offensively. That's surprising.
Who is jumbled up with the Pistons at -0.5 / -0.5?
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I think it's the Hornets
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12-26-2009, 01:41 PM
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#5
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Contributing Member
Since: Feb 2006
Posts: 17,393
Member: #16420
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ClutchCityReturns
Hmm...so the Lakers are average offensively. That's surprising.
Who is jumbled up with the Pistons at -0.5 / -0.5?
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The Hornets.
The Lakers are bottom ten in 3-point shooting, turnovers, and getting/making free throws (FTM/FGA). They'll improve, but right now their offense isn't what's led them to the great record.
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12-26-2009, 02:02 PM
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#6
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Member
Since: Oct 2008
Posts: 102
Member: #35083
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so according to this houston and lakers are giving an equal offensive output?
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12-26-2009, 04:44 PM
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#8
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Contributing Member
Since: Jul 2002
Posts: 9,385
Member: #6116
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Looks like JVG would love the Bobcats. 
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What we are leaks out all around our words.
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12-28-2009, 02:09 PM
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#10
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Contributing Member
Since: Apr 2001
Posts: 7,105
Member: #2425
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Bobcats + Raptors = Celtics? 
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In case you Halo - Xbox Live ID: jamesatgsu
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12-28-2009, 02:21 PM
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#11
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Contributing Member
Since: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,918
Member: #20409
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I like the first chart better graphically... though it may be because I don't understand the second as well.
In the second representation the "bad" is on the left and the "good" is on the right for both offense and defense?
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12-28-2009, 02:28 PM
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#12
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Contributing Member
Since: Feb 2006
Posts: 17,393
Member: #16420
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hayesfan
I like the first chart better graphically... though it may be because I don't understand the second as well.
In the second representation the "bad" is on the left and the "good" is on the right for both offense and defense?
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Yes. X-axis is overall how good the team is, taking both offense and defense into account. Y-axis shows whether the team is offensive-oriented or defense-oriented. So, if along the Y-axis the team is close to 0, that means they are balanced in terms of offense/defense. You can be "balanced" and really good (e.g., the Cavs), or "balanced" and subpar (e.g., Pistons, Hornets).
I did the second plot because whenever I looked at the first one, I kept trying to project the points onto the Y=X line in my mind to gauge how good the teams are.
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12-28-2009, 02:29 PM
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#13
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Contributing Member
Since: Aug 2002
Posts: 7,986
Member: #6676
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Spurs would normally be much higher on defense. I think the lack of Bruce Bowen is showing. He brought a certain nastiness to that team.
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"I don't need luck. It just gets in my way." - Kick Buttowski
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12-28-2009, 05:31 PM
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#14
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Contributing Member
Since: Jul 2002
Posts: 9,385
Member: #6116
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I am surprised by the Lakers' defensive slant. I guess the lesson learned is, never underestimate size in the middle.
BTW, I like both charts, good for different purposes.
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What we are leaks out all around our words.
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12-28-2009, 05:55 PM
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#15
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Member
Since: Mar 2008
Posts: 183
Member: #31237
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basically a good offense can get you to win but a bad offense won't. The nuggets and suns are proof that offense > defense.
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12-28-2009, 05:55 PM
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#16
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Member
Since: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,803
Member: #3014
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Zboy
Spurs would normally be much higher on defense. I think the lack of Bruce Bowen is showing. He brought a certain nastiness to that team.
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I would think that the odometer on their main players has something to do with it moreso than just Bruce Bowen. That and the fact that they have literally zero good/formidable defenders outside of Duncan is another cause for decline.
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12-28-2009, 06:01 PM
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#17
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Member
Since: Aug 2001
Posts: 6,803
Member: #3014
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Easy
I am surprised by the Lakers' defensive slant. I guess the lesson learned is, never underestimate size in the middle.
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No doubt.
Lakers have Gasol and Bynum
Celtics have Perkins, Garnett, and Rasheed
In an era where real centers are almost archaic, having a center that can get you 18/10 with decent defense can get you pretty far.
If only Patrick Ewing was born a couple of decades later. The guy would have dominated big time. (I'm singling him out because Olajuwon and Robinson got their rings)
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100% Believer in PatPat!
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12-28-2009, 06:07 PM
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#18
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Contributing Member
Since: Jul 2002
Posts: 9,385
Member: #6116
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by J-Tang
basically a good offense can get you to win but a bad offense won't. The nuggets and suns are proof that offense > defense.
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Look at the second graph. 4 of the top 5 overall teams are better defensively than offensively.
Also, overall, the teams on the right (good teams) are closer to the x-axis (balanced offense-defense) than teams on the left (bad teams).
__________________
What we are leaks out all around our words.
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12-28-2009, 06:16 PM
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#19
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Member
Since: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,362
Member: #39843
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I find it interesting that, according to the second map, all of the teams one would consider "Championship contenders" are all defensively-oriented (at least for the time being). This also shows how much of an anomaly the Suns really are.
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12-28-2009, 07:20 PM
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#20
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Member
Since: Nov 2009
Posts: 619
Member: #44380
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by juicystream
Bobcats + Raptors = Celtics? 
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No, the Bucks would be something like what you'd get if you combined the two (meet in the middle).
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The Rockets are the most frustrating team in the NBA... they have players who compliment each other extremely well: a mix of defensive specialists and crazy mismatch experts, and high hoops IQ from top to bottom. - Cavs Forum
Basically at the end of the day all those guys have to live with the fact that they are Dallas Mavericks, they choked in the finals, their owner is Mark Cuban and they play and reside in Dallas. I would consider hell an upgrade. - Francis3422
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