1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Where are the tax cuts?

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Ubiquitin, Feb 8, 2017.

  1. ipaman

    ipaman Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    13,025
    Likes Received:
    7,792
    well if they "do the right thing" and hire folks that would otherwise be unemployed then you just increased your tax base which generates revenue albeit different from interest but generates nonetheless. not saying they will but that's the idea. if they don't it's because of greed not policy. point is the policy will/would work if corporate greed doesn't factor in. so if it does, don't blame the policy or idea, blame the corporations and their greed. fight the real problem and enemy you know.
     
  2. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,999
    Likes Received:
    12,871
    Kay. Like I said, you don’t have to agree with the reasonings.
     
  3. ipaman

    ipaman Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    13,025
    Likes Received:
    7,792
    so you're okay with corporate greed and want to pass laws that protect against it. got it.
     
  4. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    41,414
    Likes Received:
    15,848
    No, they are not remotely similar. One has a specific purpose and outcome in mind, and it's mandated and comes with a payback system. One is just a giveaway for no public policy purpose. It's the difference between a loan and handout. No one is making these corporations pay back their taxs cuts if they benefit from it. The TARP process had a specific mechanism to do that - one that worked phenomenally well and repaid taxpayers in full and beyond. The corporations got no net money out of it - they simply got a temporary bridge loan.
     
  5. Major

    Major Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    41,414
    Likes Received:
    15,848
    Sorry, I haven't been on CFans much recently and missed it. If a public company gets a tax cut, they end up with more money. In some cases, they would spend it on growth - but here, corporations already have record cash amounts and have nothing to do with it because they are already meeting all necessary demand. So they've simply been buying back record amounts of stock, which raises stock prices - meaning more money goes to the stockholders, who are largely the wealthy. If the corporation gets even more cash, they will just more of that - many companies have already openly said that.
     
    dmoneybangbang likes this.
  6. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,999
    Likes Received:
    12,871
    Lol. Sure thing sweet heart... that was my point...

    You are nihilist, why do you care?
     
    ipaman likes this.
  7. ipaman

    ipaman Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    13,025
    Likes Received:
    7,792
    good point, i don't. i just like hanging out with the lovely folks in d&d. i guess i hate myself the most.
     
    #707 ipaman, Jan 12, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018
  8. ipaman

    ipaman Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2002
    Messages:
    13,025
    Likes Received:
    7,792
  9. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,999
    Likes Received:
    12,871
    Record revenue, record population, record spending on medicare. Lots of records will be broken by revenue and spending.
     
  10. Rocketman1981

    Rocketman1981 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2009
    Messages:
    1,499
    Likes Received:
    581
    To be more detailed i'll try to share my opinions on what happens. It really depends on the type of industry/company
    and goes as follows:

    1.) Regulated Companies (i.e. Utilities) As their profit margins are regulated any savings would then be passed on to
    consumers (which is akin to a tax cut to all as utility costs drop for millions of Americans) Every American is both a
    producer and a consumer, if the cost of consumption falls this is akin to a raise.

    2.) Highly Competitive (Commodity) Industries - Their profit margins are 'regulated' by fierce competition. If excess
    margins is gained through the tax bill it should immediately reflect lower prices to consumers, potential jobs/wages
    increases.

    3.) Brand/Moat Businesses - Businesses with a moat around their business keeping fierce competition at bay.
    Businesses with brands can usually retain those earnings and will then benefit stockholders or potentially some
    employees.

    Many companies do, however, domicile abroad or have contemplating moving offices abroad to benefit from
    much lower tax jurisdictions globally. This removes much of this incentive and may have businesses bring back
    those offices/employees to the US as the cost is no longer beneficial due to the lower tax spreads.

    This has been talked about and needed for a long time and I'm glad it got done.

    The fact that the standard deduction was doubled and the child tax credit increased along with removing these subsidies
    to wealthy homeowners, all in all i'm pleased.
     
    sugrlndkid likes this.
  11. Commodore

    Commodore Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2007
    Messages:
    31,014
    Likes Received:
    14,538
  12. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,999
    Likes Received:
    12,871
    LOL. "The Media". I guess people are stupid enough to believe snippets of people's opinion represent the media.
     
  13. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,999
    Likes Received:
    12,871
    A bunch of already planned bonuses, made public in light of the tax plan, doesn't make this some huge coup. This will need several months to make its way through.

    I'm for a corporate tax cut, but not at this expense. It will need to be the boomers to take a hit on this one when it comes down to entitlements.

    Many companies domicile abroad to be closer to customers, talent, and the growth. Another country or trade bloc can merely lower the taxes to compete, then what? I actually am in favor of the corporate tax cuts, but none of the other stuff. Our next recession is going to be much worse because our revenue is going to tank and our debt will soar; i.e. the Bush Jr special.

    This is the largest corporate tax cut in ~ 40 years, anyone doing a victory lap now should probably stick to just watching CNBC.
     
  14. Rocketman1981

    Rocketman1981 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2009
    Messages:
    1,499
    Likes Received:
    581
    Yes because there is so much business and revenue coming from Bermuda (insurance industry), Ireland and Lichenstein.
     
  15. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    34,122
    Likes Received:
    13,527
    Oh, if only it was so simple. Every state and sometimes even utility is different, but in many cases, the basic rate case isn't revisited unless the utility applies for it. Rate cases are very cumbersome. It's a ton of work for both the utility and the utility commission. So, they've increasingly gone to a system of atomized riders. The utility wants to deploy new meters, so they keep the underlying rate case the same and ask for a rider that just adds another line item to the utility bill. For investor-owned utilities, the commissions assume there will be some puts and takes every year, the companies will have unexpected expenses and windfalls, which is why they allow some rate of return to make the risk worthwhile (and handsomely so). The point being, in many cases those tax savings will not be returned to the ratepayer unless enough political pressure is brought to bear to force the issue. Because the mechanisms currently in place do not force the utilities to give up the money. A bunch of state AGs, in fact, recently wrote to FERC asking for action to compel utilities to give the tax benefits back to ratepayers. There are a couple of successes already, but we'll have to wait to see how widespread it gets.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...50bc3300042_story.html?utm_term=.6dbe8f1c3b64

    Of course, even if ratepayers win there, they're still paying 10%+ return on capital to an investor-owned company that has almost no risk of default. Which is ridiculous. European utilities make something like 5%, which seems more appropriate to their actual risk exposure.
     
    B-Bob and FranchiseBlade like this.
  16. Rocketman1981

    Rocketman1981 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2009
    Messages:
    1,499
    Likes Received:
    581
    I'm not sure at all what this has to do with my post?? I stated what happens to companies in varying industries when taxes are cut
    within our competitive system.

    I think there is a massive government inefficiency and spending problem. We're taxed in every such way yet the government still
    needs billions monthly to subsidize its spending?
     
  17. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    48,872
    Likes Received:
    17,479
    Well, one of the largest expenditures of the govt. is paying down interest on the debt. This tax bills only increases the debt.
     
  18. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,999
    Likes Received:
    12,871
    LOL. Me neither, maybe I left the first part out.

    And our aging population is a big part of the spending problem, look at how much we will be spending on our past. And our military which apparently anything less than decisively beating China or Russia is not enough.

    Smart spending is a key aspect of America's supremacy in the 20th century, we've lost sight of that.
     
  19. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    54,431
    Likes Received:
    54,345
  20. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2010
    Messages:
    24,001
    Likes Received:
    19,904
    As predicted

     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now